Super Mods!!!

Mercury_Tilt

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Lump

I agree with your point about it being a popularity test. I don't think it's fair that just the Mods that are seen to be modding are getting put forward. Not blowing mine or anyone else's trumpet, but there are plenty of us who mod forums and contribute to forums and don't go around posting in the Mod forum letting everyone know when we ban some one, or diss out a bit of advice.

Another point, maybe a good mod is someone who doesn't have to ban people all of the time. Maybe it's in the lack of banning that makes you good.

Halflife, College work and Audio Visual, speaking on my own experience are boards like that, relatively busy but the no-nonsence approach seems to work.

Also when you're a mod of say afterhours, you're going to get plenty of muppets. Fair enough. BUt being the mod of PI you get the same amount of spammers, but I've seen a few threads on there that are locked because the original poster is deemed as having a laugh and not taking it seriously. I don't agree with it and if you ban some one due to their possible false postings it's not very fair.

Bla, I'm starting to ramble. I think that the "Less Known mods" should be put forward. I think that some of the mods of the busier forums will open a can of whoop ass and ban people for minor things. I think "The power" - or lack their of, could go to some peoples heads. Even I feel that I need to be carefull when postig on the Afterhours board... that's saying alot. I worry that I may joke, hence my recent posting clarifing that a previous post was being sarcastic. I think over sensitive mods are really reducing the amount or freedom and discussion that goes on here.

Again, I'm rambling.

They're my opinions.

John

Lump

Forgot to say, why aren't the mods asked if they want the power.

Ie, Pm all of us. If we agree to be put forward there's just an open democracy type vote thingy. Shock! Democracy! Shock! If 20 mods got put forward, I believe there's enough regular users to vote across 20 mods.

John

amp

Mercury_Tilt wrote:

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I'm sorry, is this a troll or do you have examples of mod corruption?

Mercury_Tilt

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Mercury_Tilt

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amp

And yes I can pull up a few example of mods going over board with regards to their remit.

Marvelous, let's see these examples.

Mercury_Tilt

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seamus

You have people complaining that AH is too spammy, then when you get strict, others complain that it's too strict.

Jesus wept.... :rolleyes:

Lump

Too spammy? It's busy, not spammy.

John

amp

Mercury_Tilt wrote:

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Tilt has no examples. This thread is a troll designed to try and stir things up for Tilts own childish enjoyment and not for the good of boards.

Mercury_Tilt

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Mercury_Tilt

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seamus

Mercury_Tilt wrote:

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I know, I was actually referring to Lump's post.

You see asking people to desist from personal abuse and then asking them to keep their "dumb mouths shuts" .. well... it not a bigge but its a mindsight...

It was an attempt at ironic/sarcastic humour. I'm surprised you missed it. Perhaps it was too subtle

BuffyBot

To be honest, it does seem like a someone is holding a big spoon and stirring the pot...

From what I'm gathering this doesn't seem to be about the concept supermod's as such, but percieved clashes between mod behavior (Gandalf/WWM and Seamus's charter). The outing of the debate is one thing, but I'm not so sure what there was to gain from it. Unless you feel it's a conspiracy of some sort, which of course it could be, if you make it one.

The other points seem to more issues to do with standardisation of moderator approach than anything else. Unfortunately boards.ie is such a loose collective, standardisation is a problematic beast. That, however is a seperate topic.

mr_angry

IIRC, the admins were looking for a dozen nominations so they could go into a darkened room and decide who was best. When it comes down to it, they are equally as likely to choose someone like ecksor (ie. common sense over popularity) to fill the void. This is not exclusively a popularity contest, and I think plenty of posts on the relevant mod thread are fine examples of good posts with a lot of thought behind them - not just a popularity poll. To paint it as such is, in my opinion, completely and utterly wrong. I really wonder why you're bringing this topic out of its intended remit Merc - something which you request the Mods themselves stick to. Are you the self-appointed "man of the people" now?

seamus

BuffyBot wrote:

The other points seem to more issues to do with standardisation of moderator approach than anything else. Unfortunately boards.ie is such a loose collective, standardisation is a problematic beast. That, however is a seperate topic.

This is in fact something which I think merits much more attention. Boards.ie has gotten to a stage where most people could name off only a handful of mods, and where the proportion of mods who know eachother becomes less and less.

This is actually a good thing, it helps weed out/disprove any nepotism or "Cliques", and it means that valuable people get the modding jobs, not just the ones known to the admins. Not that this has ever happened, but when there are only a handful of boards, it makes sense for the admins to choose those whom they know and trust. But now, even though it doesn't appear so, new mods are almost being elected. The board users are being asked to nominate their preferred mod, and even though the admins can veto, I've yet to see one actually do it.

So with this, you have new mods being thrust into a position where they may not be entirely sure what to do, and they may not even know any of the more experienced mods. So inconsistencies appear in the way people moderate.

I think it could serve a useful purpose to draft a very rough sort of "constitution" for moderators. A loose set of guidelines dealing with best practice etc. Trojan posted a very good one on Feedback which was dragged up recently. When I say "loose", I mean very loose. If someone can point to the guidelines and tell you where a mod was in breach of them, it means that they're too specific.

Mercury_Tilt

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bonkey

Mercury_Tilt wrote:

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Self praise?

Seriously though....if you're in any way criticising the mods for not being able to suggest "super-mods" from within their own ranks without it turning into a popularity contest....how the hell do you think the users can suggest super-mods without it being flawed in exactly the same way?

One would hope that with the mods, the signal-to-noise ratio of such a discussion would be somewhat less than with a more open equivalent.

Ultimately, I don't know how it could be anything other than a popularity contest, if the admins were to make decisions based on any sort of poll, rather than by reading the comments made, and considering what they thought of the pros/cons for a given candidate, and then making their own short-list.

It is only suggestions for super mods.

Only? So "only" that you felt it incumbent on you to take it out of the closed environment that it was originally suggested in and share it with the rest of us mere mortals? Its obviously that important to you....so I have to wonder at the use of only here.

Who knows what little nugget some one might come up with.

Anyone who wants the job shouldn't get it, for a start.

jc

Mercury_Tilt

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ozt9vdujny3srf

Mercury_Tilt

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Lump

I believe that image is out of spec. :P

John

The Muppet

Getting back on topic Merc's list is pretty spot on to the best mods on the site. There are a few there that I have come across so I would add the names of Uberwolf and Mike65 .

gandalf

BuffyBot wrote:

To be honest, it does seem like a someone is holding a big spoon and stirring the pot...

From what I'm gathering this doesn't seem to be about the concept supermod's as such, but percieved clashes between mod behavior (Gandalf/WWM and Seamus's charter).

Yep you are stirring alright as usual :rolleyes:

That incident you have used as your example was cleared up between myself and Eamo and occured when I edited out a spam link in the Work forum during a weekend when wwman was not about. He replied to the pm I had sent him about the thread stating his preference that I do not edit items like that on the forum he mods and I now don't.

The only thing I agree with you on is the choice of bonkey as one of the "Super Mods" who I think would be an absolutely excellent choice.

Just as an aside what has happened to you recently you seem quite contrary these days.

Giblet

Super mods =

No-ones really doing a "super" job as I see it, and I don't know how it's gonna be more "super" with more abilities.

I see Hash Boy is still running around.

amp

Mercury_Tilt wrote:

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You had not provided examples. In this case my opinion was fact. If you're going to accuse moderators of corruption then you'd better prove it.

Ok so one to keep you quite...See gandalfs recent apologoy to wwhead for editing a thread on the Work forum for one.... When it was not needed. But Ill put up more when it suits me. Not you.

How is this an example of corruption?

But in the greater scheme of things...I have no interest in talking to you amp. This is a reasonable debate. And one that is for the good of the community that is boardsie. Maybe thats where we differ.

Yeah, I've never done anything for this community. Maybe I should post when I'm drunk more. Maybe I should go round accusing the people who help run this community of corruption. Maybe I should get constantly banned from certain forums because the rules shouldn't apply to me. Maybe I should try and delete all my early posts in case anybody reads them and I get embarressed. That's the Mercury_Tilt way, isn't it?

But you are right about one thing. I do get enjoyment out of boardsie. That is what boardsie is all about I recall. Enjoyment.

Your enjoyment at the expense of others. That's not very community minded.

StupidLikeAFox

Someones jealous he wasnt on the list anyway....

BuffyBot

So with this, you have new mods being thrust into a position where they may not be entirely sure what to do, and they may not even know any of the more experienced mods. So inconsistencies appear in the way people moderate.

I think it could serve a useful purpose to draft a very rough sort of "constitution" for moderators. A loose set of guidelines dealing with best practice etc. Trojan posted a very good one on Feedback which was dragged up recently. When I say "loose", I mean very loose. If someone can point to the guidelines and tell you where a mod was in breach of them, it means that they're too specific.

I think, as time progresses and the site grows, it will become more of a nessecity than something that's just desirable. Without some guidelines, the people who make naturally good moderators will do fine, but those who are less adept won't do so well - and it just ends up generating more of a mess to clean up in the long run in terms of muppetry and complaints.

Mercury_Tilt

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oscarBravo

Mercury_Tilt wrote:

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Like the way the moderator forum is supposed to be for moderators only, you mean?

StupidLikeAFox

And the prison forum is only for prisoners?

Asok

Ecksor for admin!

Stabshauptmann

Sangre

Rofl! That brings back some memories Asok.

I should be a Super-mod...to...eh...mix it up!

amp

Mercury_Tilt wrote:

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Yeah, because being on Tilt's list is a sure fire gaurantee of supermodship. Let's face it Tilt would never nominate me for personal reasons rather than my ability to moderate. I know this, everybody else knows this, so let's not pretend it's anything else.

Suffice is to say I'd rather stay on topic and I shall. No real value in pointing out i used a well know phrase "power corrupts" rather than actually stating mods were corrupt. But sure if thats the "picking point" Need an example?? gave an example. Hardly corruption par se but it suited what I mean originally rather than amps decided version.

Gandalf was corrupt because he edited a post in a forum of which he is the catagory moderator. I believe he was acting in the interests of boards. You chose to define it as one moderator stepping into anothers territory which is complete garbage given that no moderator should see a forum as their territory. If they do then that's closer to corruption than Gandalfs actions.

What can you do tbh. No pleaseing some people. Perhaps two example would have done it... we will never know... or perhaps that would not have sufficed either... again we will never know.... I could take an educated guess though...

One actual example would suffice.

For my next trick... Ill may pull up a quote from a concerned party stating "attack the post and not the poster".... the irony.....

You're the one that claimed to be doing something for the good of the community. I merely highlighted examples of things you do and have done in the past that have not helped this community. Attack the poster when it's in context baby.

Duh..duh...duh!!!!! Or I may not.

I prefer the topic at hand!

I don't believe I'm off-topic. I'm replying to your original post and the content within it.

azezil

noone ever votes for me

mad m

azezil wrote:

noone ever votes for me

Azezil i'm going to ask you to leave the Hacienda,but before you go i want to know.Are you Gay or Straight?.


put Azezil on Super Mod list......

Beruthiel

Mercury_Tilt wrote:

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I think that’s a pretty unfair thing to say Mercie.
I don’t see it as a popularity contest, rather it’s probably just more of a fact that people tend to vote for Mods who’s experience they know – what I mean by that is, I cannot claim to know well every Mod on Boards because I do not frequent their forums. There are probably many good ones I don’t know because of this. Hence I voted for people I know in this context. What other feasible way would you have had in mind?

Mercury_Tilt

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bonkey

gandalf wrote:

The only thing I agree with you on is the choice of bonkey as one of the "Super Mods" who I think would be an absolutely excellent choice.

Yes yes. Pick me. I want the job...and thus by my own criteria should be excluded.

Seriously...I'd be a terrible choice. The fact that I'm not a mod of anything should hint towards that.

jc

ecksor

bonkey wrote:

Seriously though....if you're in any way criticising the mods for not being able to suggest "super-mods" from within their own ranks without it turning into a popularity contest....how the hell do you think the users can suggest super-mods without it being flawed in exactly the same way?

The phrase "turkeys voting for christmas" comes to mind. Still, there's definitely potential for some good suggestions to come from the users at large on boards and transparency of how the boards are going to be organised is a good thing in this case.

vinnyfitz

What will the supermods be expected to do?

zenith

I thought I was keeping a very low profile, which is what I think moderators should do. If you make too much noise, it becomes the forum versus the moderator, and life's too short. Speak softly, and carry a big stick.

I also think that supermods should show an ability to police policy, and a disinterest in making it: it's how most political and policing systems work, hand-in-hand.

For what it's worth, I know DeVore from well before boards, so I'd consider myself unsuitable for promotion: if the admins asked for my advice, I'd prefer they didn't promote any more 'insiders', but picked from the community proper, and would exclude myself for that reason.

I also think that this discussion should be carried out in plain view.

zenith

uberwolf

zenith wrote:

I'd prefer they didn't promote any more 'insiders', but picked from the community proper

what do you mean by insiders? - because if you mean to exclude all mods then your suggestion is flawed. I say this because being a moderator first should be an absolute prerequisite for this role. How else is this new tier of user to be vetted? trained? have the experience?

As for personal friends - that may not be inappropriate either. This site is a private entity. Owned by a few, rather than belonging to the masses. Whilst the admins strive to make that distinction invisible, fiercly protecting free-speech it is inappopriate to believe that the site is there for everyone to rule. It is their decision who or whom takes on this role. Friendship is not a qualification - but it may provide the element of trust that is going to be required to allow them hand over the new set of keys.

This persons job will be invisible to most, behind the scenes, with the occasional spammer bust. Consequently the community may have no perspective on it.

Conversely, your point re: mods keeping their head down means that this discussion has validity. A good mod may have a low profile recognised by their forum users only, not necessarily the other mods.

Hobart

Ah mercie.....

If the rules had been different I know you would have included me in that initial list . However the rules state that you cannot vote for yourself so,,,

As for nobody voting for Hobbes, your wrong. Re-read the thread. As for it being a popularity contest, imo, the process was started the way it was, it was only ever going to be a popularity contest.

I think our esteemed ex-admin summed it up with his reference to yuletide. ^

Again, imo, the admins had little choice in the way the nominations where structured. Imagine the case where the admins go off too, oh lets say, Shanahans on the Green. After copious amounts of Chateau neff Du Pape and a nice Baileys ice cream desert they decide to nominate (e.g.) Merc as one of the new supermods. It is announced on the mod board. Could you imagine the amount of consternation and ****e they would have to put up with? All the "why him?" "he's a bad choice.", "why don't we have a say?" type posts that would arrive? People seem to think the "higher up" one rises in the ranking, the more popular they become. Or the more respect the can command.

How many times have we seen people asking how to become mods, asking for toaster forums, etc... We have even had one poster here expressing his desire to be an admin????And he was serious.

It's all about popularity, power, self worth etc.... Leave them off I say.

As for the "nominations", I won't comment on some of the other nominations, and some are laughable imo, but of the 5 I "put forward" I have had "run in's" with 4 of them. However there "style" of moderation and presence here in something I had borne in mind will typing in thier names.

As for your ability to stir it up, rofl, keep it up.

Giblet

I'd do it in a second if I didn't have to overcome the giant wall of the super-clique

HAHA

zenith

uberwolf wrote:

what do you mean by insiders? - because if you mean to exclude all mods then your suggestion is flawed.

I don't mean to exclude all mods: the opportunity to promote from within the community is too good to miss, though. While we're all friends here, some are more friendly than others: and I think that that's not a basis to make a recruitment decision in a community of this size. Future expandability is important, and now's a good time to make those decisions.

uberwolf

from an organisational perspective this site has tiers.

I emphasise organisational because Mods are no more important than newbies in the grand scheme of things.

To launch in someone who has no experience of moderating and allow them ban people from the site and allow them access to the boards database is a recipe for disaster. The only means the admins have of assessing someone is through their moderating background.

However important the community is, ultimately we're guests of the owners of the site. Those owners are proposing handing over a spare set of keys to their fiefdom. The community perspective on the suitability of users is less useful than the moderators. Which is why you've seen my name crop here as a potential when it didn't on the moderator board.

i do agree that I'd also like to see the thought process for the sites development clarified at times, and there are probably hundreds of people who would willingly and honestly give of their time to improve this place (other than the mods who do this already).

But you cann't parachute in somebody to this role. Trust needs to be earned, suitability needs to be vetted. Moderatorship appears to me to be the only vehicle to achieve this. Have you an alternative in mind?

Stabshauptmann

it shall be a race around the world...the queen herself will draw the checkred flag

BuffyBot

Off on a tangent:

The problem with boards as an expanding community is that it's caught between two stools. It's a private entity with an active user base that many commercial sites would kill for. The continuing growth of the site puts a lot of strain on the "old" informal ways of doing things, as we've seen lately with the Helpdesk replacing the help forum.

To launch in someone who has no experience of moderating and allow them ban people from the site and allow them access to the boards database is a recipe for disaster.

Although moderation experience on boards would be hugely beneficial to whoever takes the role, if you find the right person, they could perform without it. Your point is valid too - find the wrong person, and it can all go to crap. I've seen it happen elsewhere.