Luas SmartCard - technical

SeanW

From the BVG Website.

On the subject of maps:

Maps and more
Here you find a variety of maps (underground and tram) as PDF files and the interactive city map of Berlin containing the underground, tram and bus network. Find your address with the BVG online city map and just click on the map and the selected address is automatically transferred to BVG journey planer fahrinfo online.

Regarding tickets and fares:

Tickets and fares
The city of Berlin is part of the Berlin-Brandenburg transit authority (VBB). This means that if you travel into the surrounding areas which are served by different transit companies, you will need only one ticket which is valid for the complete trip. Here you will find all information on tickets, prices and BVG info & sales points at a glance.

Now THIS is what we REALLY NEED. Some real integration as opposed to deploying smart cards and dressing them up as "integrated ticketing"

antoinolachtnai

Well, that certainly is a contrary example. But are the different bus companies really independent with their own fareboxes, or do they operate on contract to the central authority, paid out of a central farebox on a per-mile or similar basis? The Munich syste appears to operate on that sort of basis, and I suspect the Berlin system does too. (London operates on a similar basis.)

I'm not arguing that that's not a good way of doing things. It's just that it's not going to happen in Dublin. There is no Dublin Transport Authority or Dublin Transport Company, and from what I can see, there is no intent to establish one.

murphaph

antoinolachtnai wrote:

There is no Dublin Transport Authority or Dublin Transport Company, and from what I can see, there is no intent to establish one.

......and this is where the problem lies. There's nought wrong with smart cards, it's just that they should be being implemented by a Dublin transit authority as part of an overall integrated strategy which encompasses all operators. Like I said, tough decisions need to be made and if we are to ever work our way out o traffic chaos we won't do it without cogherent planning and administration from this sort of authority.

SeanW

antoinolachtnai wrote:

But are the different bus companies really independent with their own fareboxes, or do they operate on contract to the central authority, paid out of a central farebox on a per-mile or similar basis? The Munich syste appears to operate on that sort of basis, and I suspect the Berlin system does too. (London operates on a similar basis.)

Yes it's a central farebox system.

antoinolachtnai wrote:

It's just that it's not going to happen in Dublin. There is no Dublin Transport Authority or Dublin Transport Company, and from what I can see, there is no intent to establish one.

We had a debate about this on the Platform 11 Message board, a few months ago. I raised the possibility of an agency named DT (short for Dublin Transit) specifically for the purpose of public transport integration. This was after I took a journey to Berlin and saw how feckin' brilliant the BVG system was - trust the Germans to do it right, eh

Of course you're right it will probably never happen, but we can always dream ...

ED E

zg3409 wrote: »

>Anyone got any info on the hand held device the conductor uses ?
>Does it show how much is left on the card or only the last validation time ?

Acording to luas.ie the conductor can tell you when you last clocked on. It doesn't mention if he knows the balance. The last time you clocked on may be stored in the card or on a central database which he has access.

Anyone know if those readers are putting in database queries or are the cards written every time?

#Necro

Dravokivich

They are reading the cards. For example with leap, the can see current balance and last 5 actions, be they topups or touching on/off .

ED E

So theoretically a hack is very plausible as Mifare Classic(Crypto1) is flawed(proven for a while too) and NFC write capable phones are commonplace?

goingnowhere

Leap isn't a MiFare classic chip...

The card holds the balance, current tickets and several last transaction

ED E

goingnowhere wrote: »

Leap isn't a MiFare classic chip...

The card holds the balance, current tickets and several last transaction

Leap aint, but luas is.

Victor

I'd say the Luas Card is likely to be withdrawn in the next year.

While it's hackable, there are still measures that make such hacking highly impractical. You might get a few trips before you are blocked, but you have to spend money on the equipment up fornt and face paying fines for not having a ticket and/or prison time for fraud.