Most recent MMDS installation?

405_Lines_TV

How long before MMDS was switched off in 2016 was it possible to phone up virgin and arrange to have an MMDS aerial/package installed as an new customer?

405_Lines_TV

It's gas that people took to the streets with Packards to protest against MMDS back in the day. were any of these people actually worried about MMDS being dangerous or were they all just deflector fans ?

https://www.rte.ie/archives/collections/news/21448026-burke-denies-mmds-hazards/

The Cush

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058428639/most-recent-mmds-installation

Interesting question, I guess we don't really know unless people that worked for them can remember.

Comreg gave them 2 years notice of non-renewal of the spectrum licences. They started switching off MMDS masts from autumn 2015 and by the time the licences ended they still had in the region of 10,000 customers.

The Cush

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123999791#Comment_123999791

I guess both depending on the area. In deflector areas it was the push by MMDS licensees to get rid of the deflectors.

In other areas it was the fear of "microwave" radiation. Microwaves were associated with the cooking of food so in turn these masts were "cooking" us.

The acronym MMDS started out as Multipoint Microwave Distribution System, but as time went on it changed to Multichannel Multipoint Distribution System/Service, i.e. microwaves disappeared, it was bad for business.

The MMDS protestors of yesterday are the 5G mast protestors of today and maybe the 6G mast protestors of tomorrow.

We all walk around today with devices in our pockets capable of transmitting and receiving in the same band as MMDS of old without protest

jmcc

MMDS was the wrong system at the wrong time for Ireland. I think that the government had got some Canadian consultants to advise them. The terrain in Ireland was unsuited to MMDS and it needed line of sight to the transmitters. This led to some MMDS dishes being placed on 20 foot masts. The rebeam operations were much more popular and used existing technology (UHF). Coverage was better. The higher frequencies used for MMDS (2.5 GHz) were intended to give some protection and scrambling/encryption wasn't common. The rebeam operations were also cheaper. That may have been the motivation for some protests. The rebeam operations were also politically organised. It technologically bypassed by Digital Satellite TV and cable companies expanding their networks. Saorview probably was the final nail in the coffin. Not sure that there have been any new MMDS installations for some time.

Glaceon

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123999970#Comment_123999970

There’s still a load of (redundant, of course) MMDS aerials around Drogheda. Some are on ridiculously high masts. Most are pointing towards Mount Oriel while others are pointing in a southerly direction, towards Ashbourne I think.

The Cush

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124000009#Comment_124000009

Still lots of MMDS aerials up around our area too, including the Limerick city area, almost 10 years after shutdown.

Our house tried for it around 1994 but due to topography, insufficient signal, so we went the Sky route.

jmcc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124000009#Comment_124000009

The only excuse for the government backing MMDS was that they may have thought that they could earn money from franchise fees. In some respects, MMDS was obsolete when it was introduced here. Even though the improving technology from Satellite TV LNBs (low noise transistors) made their way into MMDS downconverters, there were just too many things happening in the market. Satellite TV was taking a lot of the potential subscribers and the setup was easier and less obtrusive. Cablelink was sold off. It had previously been owned by RTE and Telecom Eireann. It didn't have the money to expand the cablenets too far beyond the cities. Once there was investment in upgrading and expanding the networks, some of the market for MMDS switched to cable. Once BBC, ITV and C4 became available via satellite, there was no real real reason for MMDS.

jmcc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124000079#Comment_124000079

Even after some areas became cabled, the old UHF TV masts antennas (often for UK channels on the east coast and by the border) were not removed. Some of the MMDS dishes had a sort of second life when WiFi started to take off in the early 2000s when people couldn't get broadband in their areas.

The Cush

A Broadcasting Review Committee was established in about 1971 and reported in 1974.

An area they reviewed was the retransmission of multichannel TV - RTÉ, BBC1/2, UTV - by cable and microwave. There was a belief that transmission by microwave could have copyright implications.

This from a Dáil debate in 1981

Mr. Deasy: Would not the cable vision system of transmitting this television network also give rise to copyright problems?

Minister for Posts and Telegraphs Mr. Cooney: I agree with the Deputy that there appears to be a contradiction, but I am advised that there is a distinction between retransmitting by microwave and by cable. I admit I cannot see the distinction but it was held that there was a distinction. Another view seems to be gaining support and that is that rebroadcasting by microwave does not infringe copyright.

The last sentence is very telling of a change in the Dept of Posts and Telegraphs. His colleague and future Minister in the Dept, Jim Mitchell, said in 1986 (in various debates over the year)

On the question of access to multichannel services for people in remote areas, this is receiving very careful examination and we are looking at new possibilities — for example, the new system being developed in Canada at the moment which might provide a way out of this problem in the future. However, it is at a very early stage of development, so we cannot say yet; but we are exploring it.

I am, however, considering alternative means of providing greater choice of viewing in non-cabled areas using transmission techniques but I must stress that my Department's planning in this field is at a relatively preliminary stage and there are no quick and easy solutions.

I have said before in replies to questions in the House that my Department were examining ways and means, consonant with good radio frequency management, of providing multichannel television services to areas which are not served and are unlikely to be served by cable television systems.

My Department are currently examining the suitability of systems which use microwave frequencies, for the distribution of television signals in this country. I am hopeful that if the use of such systems proves feasible, they will enable a broader range of television services to be provided in areas which for economic reasons are unlikely to be served by cable systems.

• 5 March 1987 press release: the then Minister for Communications, Mr. Jim Mitchell, TD, announced the introduction of Multipoint Microwave Distribution Systems (MMDS) to this country.
• In February 1988, Minister Burke, after a careful reappraisal of the matter announced the Government's decision to proceed with MMDS. (Fianna Fail Ard-Fheis, 19-21 Feb 1988?)

Ray Burke's announcement at that Ard-Fheis, on a Saturday morning TV broadcast iirc, was the first time I'd heard about MMDS and multichannel TV for us who lived rurally, with access to only two RTÉ channels and no deflectors in the area. I still remember it was like a bolt from the blue and still remember it to this day.

The Cush

On the issue MMDS and microwave radiation - RTÉ Archives | Collections | Burke Denies MMDS Hazards

jmcc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124005259#Comment_124005259

The problem with the microwave technology at the time (1971-81) was the noise figure and the sensitivity of the receivers/converters. The designs the Canadian and US systems were using were Silicon based and required higher transmission power for adequate reception. The developments in Satellite TV throughout the 1980s saw low-noise Gallium Arsenide transistors replacing Silicon transistors in the frontend of Satellite TV LNBs/downconverters. Some LNBs were manufactured for S-Band use which was close to the frequencies used by MMDS. MMDS was simply unsuited to Ireland because of its topography. Ireland had been allocated some Direct Broadcast Satellite frequencies under WARC-77. It was such a small market that nothing was really done about DBS in Ireland and it was overtaken by the development of Astra. The British Satellite Broadcasting system (with its famous Squarial) used DBS frequencies, a different TV system and it was late to market. Astra dominated the UK and Irish STV market.

Conor Cruise O'Brien, while he was the Labour minister for P&T wanted BBC2 to be broadcast as Ireland's second TV channel instead of RTE2. Ironically, Ireland was well ahead of the UK when it came to cable TV operations with Dublin being the largest cablenet in Europe at one stage. As MMDS, DBS and the Telecom Eireann fiasco showed, letting politicians dictate the evolution of technology is a very stupid idea.

The Cush

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/124005329#Comment_124005329

I remember BSB and their squarial, there was a few around my area at the time.

I also remember Jim Stafford and his Atlantic Satellite consortium won the licence for Ireland's 5 allocated DBS frequencies at 31 deg. west. If I recall correctly Niall Quinn's QSat broadband service transmitted from there years later.

Medium powered Astra killed off the hi-powered DBS business in these islands at least, using BSS frequencies and then down into commercial FSS frequencies. A lot more frequencies available for more channels over DBS.

It also damaged the MMDS rollout but the non-availability of the UK terrestrial channels via Astra probably attracted people to MMDS at the time. This was the reason we tried for it about 1994 iirc.

We tried for MMDS but due to topography the signal level was too low from two sites, Woodcock Hill and Keeper Hill. We then went the Sky route using our own purchased box, the Pace MSS500 (lovely receiver). An MMDS "beam-bender" was installed on another site much later but we didn't even try for it then.

I was over in my local village this morning and from the street looking at a small housing estate I counted at least 4 MMDS aerials still pointing towards Woodcock Hill, and that was only a few houses at the front of the estate. Didn't realise the estate was that old.