Rent (in an RPZ) that I charge way below the market rate - is it possible to correct this?

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739423#Comment_123739423

There were massive interest rate increases in the last few years, particularly on buy to let properties as they're all on variable mortgages.

The repayments on my BTL increased 33% in that timeframe due to this (it's started coming back down again now with the interest rate reductions).

The actual monthly rent in that timeframe increased about 4% as a comparison.

Mrs Shuttleworth

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739464#Comment_123739464

These properties won't be a good investment when it becomes verboten to secure vacant possession of your property prior to a sale, and with a tenant in situe at below market rent. The time for me to get out is now.

A fund owns about twenty units in one particular block near me. Since the public discussions of the upcoming legislation they've suddenly issued termination notices to all tenants and all units are now on the market.

Rocket_GD

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739478#Comment_123739478

This poster wasn't on a BTL, as they claim they were an accidental landlord. The figures don't add up for a standard mortgage.

Rocket_GD

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739452#Comment_123739452

Accidental landlord means nothing, you charged below mortgage rate, that's your fault, not the governments.

crusd

If the market rate is double what you are charging it is yet more proof that the market has been fundamentally distorted by a complete unwillingness to build the housing necessary for the population.

In 2006 I was paying 700 per month in rent prior to buying. The same apartment today is 2400. In this example based on inflation 1200 would probably now be more than an adequate rent. In fact using CPI figures it should be around 950

For comparison he job I was doing 15 years ago paid 36k and would now pay about 45k. Its a completely distorted market and the correction when it comes will be massive.

burgerKev

"Accidental landlord" always makes me laugh, you didn't trip, fall, and end up with a property generating income when you got back up.

burgerKev

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739417#Comment_123739417

Anything less than gouging is now "socialist"?

Mrs Shuttleworth

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739508#Comment_123739508

I lost my business in the crash of 2008 and had to move out of the property. I moved back in with parents (now deceased) and was on the dole for four years before I worked again.

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739485#Comment_123739485

Ah I didn't see they said they were an accidental landlord.

The interest rate hikes still track though as they also impacted non BTL mortgages. My fixed rate went from 2% last year to 3.95% due to this. Also saw a substantial jump in my monthly repayment. So I wouldn't be surprised if Mrs Shuttleworth's mortgage on that rental jumped a large amount too.

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739508#Comment_123739508

And if your property is making a loss and you are in negative equity?

For someone so smarmy about property you don't really seem to know a lot about it.

Rocket_GD

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739512#Comment_123739512

The rent in that location never covered it

So you've been charging €900 since 2008?

ElitesTeam

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739283#Comment_123739283

The market rate is totally relevant. This is a service he is providing not a charity.

Mrs Shuttleworth

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739541#Comment_123739541

I don't have the exact figures in front of me but you are correct and it was a struggle to manage. The obvious question is why did I not just sell but I couldn't do that being in negative equity as a consequence of the sudden slump at that time. I'm now in profit finally (not in rent but equity) but anticipate with the new rules that there will be significant difficulties in the coming years in trying to sell properties with tenants in situe. A property with a tenant in situe at below market rate in an RPZ (the entire country) will be worthless compared to another owner occupied or vacant house on the same road.

There seems to be a crazy assumption by (some) tenants that private citizens have some moral obligation to provide housing at low cost. We don't. Last weekend two blokes in anoraks sang a few tunes and thousands of punters were willing to pay upwards of €400 on a shifting sands "dynamic" basis to listen to them. That's gouging. Wanting to rent your property for a comparable amount to similar houses in the same estate, is not.

cgorzy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739483#Comment_123739483

Is the property to be making a return under the current rules with you paying part of the mortgage?

Assuming Yes what do you expect to happen in the future with your current tenant, mortgage rate, property values that will change the rate of return.

What will you invest any proceeds from a sale in and what will the rate of return be?

Just be sure that that you have considered all of these and more before making a decision on what to do.

burgerKev

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739571#Comment_123739571

"everyone is at it so I want a piece of the action".

That's all this boils down to.

mrslancaster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739571#Comment_123739571

Really odd attitudes towards providers of private rental accommodation in this country for as long as I can remember. Renting anything is just permission to use it for X amount of time - whether it’s a car, hotel room, broadband, business premises or equipment etc and it’s always charged at market rates but so many people think renting a house should be different.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739483#Comment_123739483

Not surprised owners of rentals are selling up before the new and more restrictive rules come into effect next March. The rules get more convoluted every time there’s a new minister. More landlords sell and there’s less places available for tenants to rent. It’s a crazy situation.

Rocket_GD

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739750#Comment_123739750

More landlords sell and there’s less places available for tenants to rent. It’s a crazy situation.

But this is not exactly true, figures show that Private tenancy numbers rose by 7.6% annually to 240,964 in Q4 2024, while  private landlord numbers rose by 4.5% annually to 105,594.

https://rtb.ie/about/news/residential-tenancies-board-releases-directors-quarterly-update/

They're not all fleeing the market as people continue to claim.

SupaCat95

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123738340#Comment_123738340

Hats off to you, that is one smart move. A better solution would be to move in the nephew/niece to keep an eye on the place.

SupaCat95

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739357#Comment_123739357

Charities do charge rents. You should look into some former investment funds operating as "charities" in Ireland for tax advantages.

mrslancaster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739508#Comment_123739508

Yes, there are many accidental landlords, the ones who didn’t buy a property with the intention of running a letting business. If they had all sold those properties, or left them empty, their tenants might have had more difficulty in finding a place to rent so what’s the point in disparaging those owners? Especially any of those owners who let at lower rents.

DubCount

If I want to buy Bread in a supermarket, I have to pay market price, and its not greed or gouging. If I get a painter to paint my house, I'll be charged market rate and nobody will suggest greed and gouging. When an evil LL wants to charge market rent, that becomes greed and gouging.

Every business charges the most they can.

Rent controls only drive up the market rate for tenants, and drive down quality. If you want to find real market rates, let landlords and tenants agree a rate agreeable to both - just like the good old days !!

mrslancaster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739761#Comment_123739761

The RTB estimated 276223 private tenancies were registered at the end of 21. At the end of Dec 22 it was 246453 and in Dec 24 it was 240964. So in three years from Dec 21 to Dec 24 the RTB tenancy registrations fell by 35259. Also from RTB recent data, the total number of terminations received from Q3-22 to Q1-25 was 49320 and the majority were due to landlords selling and for their own / family use.

https://rtb.ie/data-insights/rtb-data-hub/notices-of-termination/

It’s puzzling how there are reported increases in landlords when the number of tenancies reduced, and high numbers of terminations were issued by owners leaving the market. Some of the increase in landlord numbers can be explained by the RTB following up on unregistered landlords and some by AHBs, but even Sherry FitzGerald’s quarterly analysis said there was a net loss of 42300 investor rental properties from Jan 20 to Mar 25. The RTB figures in that linked directors update don’t seem to add up.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/2025/06/30/more-than-43000-properties-have-exited-private-rental-sector-over-past-five-years/

Pretty clear why it’s so difficult to find anywhere to rent if 43k landlords have left. When people providing a much needed service are constantly criticised and labelled as evil, gouging and greedy, and the rules keep changing, it’s obvious some will leave the market. Unfortunately the people most affected by that are the tenants who lose their accommodation.

mrslancaster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123738340#Comment_123738340

^^+1. Best option for OP or let a niece/nephew move in as suggested in another post. If OPs tenants are still in a six year cycle, he can choose not to renew when it reaches the end of the term. More straightforward than terminating for sale, family use etc.

daithi7

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123738980#Comment_123738980

Nope, that would neither be a "problem" or what would have happened.

Most Landlords (I.e. the private providers of the living accommodation to others) have lived through negative equity, falling assets prices, rising interest rates and now stupid government legislation cheered on by populist fools & chip merchants!!

I don't want to evict my below market rent tenants but this coming legislation will force me and sadly, I may just sell up.

The net effect of this, me trading an asset for cash in Ireland which I will put to work in other economies (by investing in World indices), my dwellings being purchased by most likely owner occupiers, and several less rental properties available on the market.

Net result: less property to rent , so higher rents, funds diverted offshore that were invested in Irish property.

Well done TDs - you're brilliant!?

3DataModem

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123737742#Comment_123737742

Or rent it to a company, not a person.

mrslancaster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123741296#Comment_123741296

Exactly this. How the new rules will increase supply quickly is a mystery, small landlords are already selling up and new builds could take years to materialise. The government are spinning the changes as a great improvement but it’s not great for tenants with a low rent if their small landlord sells up.

Several people I know with a single rental (couples where each had homes but now they live in one and rent the other) have already issued terminations. Awful situation for the tenants but those families have to look out for their own family finances and who knows what rules will apply in future because each new minister changes the rules another bit.

It seems the writing is on the wall for small landlords. The government is gradually moving the rental market to large companies whose business is letting residential accommodation and maybe that’s what the market wants.

mrslancaster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123741421#Comment_123741421

Needs to be RTB registered if the company use it for employee accommodation so all the rules still apply.

somenergy

If you can get the house vacant

Move in rent a room after 2 years then relet at market

It's an asset you invested paid with interest for your future,, if you paid the taxes and there are many go to revenue that the govt use to supply housing should not expect others to provide at a subsidised rent below true inflation.

dennyk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739551#Comment_123739551

Doesn't change the fact that you chose to be a landlord at some stage. It wasn't something that happened to you or was imposed on you by forces outside your control, it was something you actively made the decision to do. You might have chosen to become a landlord because it seemed like the best financial decision at the time under the circumstances, but it was still a choice that you made, and one that you and only you were responsible for making. You might be a reluctant landlord, or an absentee landlord, or an ignorant landlord, or just a bad landlord, but you can never be an "accidental" landlord.

DubCount

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123743052#Comment_123743052

Not everyone who becomes a LL sits down and decides I want to be a LL. Some people end up with a vacant property for any number of reasons (inheritance, buy a property and have to move for work, 2 single people with property who decide to move in together, cant afford mortgage and move back home …. whatever). These are the people who become "accidental" landlords. Its not that they did not make a decision to become a LL, its that some circumstance arose where they fell into becoming a LL, often without much thought. This is very different to someone who makes a conscious decision to become a LL, saves the deposit, and buys a property specifically to rent out. The "Accidental" LL just falls into the industry because of circumstances rather than an intention to become a LL.