The "we don't discuss things before the courts" thing

Dublin Calling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739395#Comment_123739395

The larger issue is moderators shutting down discussions that are not before the courts and discussions of cases in other countries with no such rules.

JP Liz V1

Harvey Weinstein and P Diddy's cases are discussed

I think if you are using a case as an example to your point even if it is before the courts but not directly commenting on it, would that be allowed?

johnny_ultimate

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123739441#Comment_123739441

Sub judice contempt is part of common law rather than any sort of formal legislation. Traditionally it would have covered traditional media publication but obviously social media has kind of expanded the media it has to cover.

There's a thorough discussion of it in this report from the Law Reform Commission (section 5): https://www.lawreform.ie/_fileupload/Contempt%20of%20Court%20and%20Other%20Offences%20and%20Torts%20Involving%20the%20Administration%20of%20Justice%20Final.pdf

A blog post about it from KOD Lyons here too: https://kodlyons.ie/sub-judice-why-you-should-be-careful-when-you-click-send/

archfi

Is there anywhere on this site that the insane arrest of Graham Linehan in London and it's implications can be discussed?

I mean, I could transfer my interest on that current hot topic (and others) to a myriad of competitor sites both here and in the UK and further afield.

Keep boards alive, eh?

Arghus

I don't fully understand why boards can sometimes take the attitude of closing discussion of cases before the courts in other jurisdictions, it does look to me to be an overreach and an overly cautious approach - but that's the thing: I don't fully understand.

I'm not a lawyer. Can I categorically say with total certainty that there's no risk to the site of potential legal action? Not entirely. I'm assuming the risk is tiny, but I don't know that for sure either.

And, unless, I'm mistaken, none of the mods, aside from Hullabaloo, by the looks of it, are legally versed... So, they, as a result do what's probably the most cautious thing: close the discussion, because they don't truly know what the actual level of risk is. Which I think, if we were being honest, very few of us do either.

Because, if you're wrong about it one way - the outcome is the discussion ends and people are frustrated. But you could potentially be wrong the other way and the site is faced with potential legal action - maybe that's unlikely, but, like I've said: how many of us know that's actually impossible?

One thing I would be fairly confident of is that boards couldn't afford to fight anything or have a day out in court. The risk might be tiny, but it'd be the end of the place I suspect, if anyone decided to make a case of it.

Comparing it to twitter, Facebook, Reddit etc isn't comparing like with like: these are huge companies with plenty of lawyers. Aside from the owner, boards has one employee, who's part time.

It would be good to know what the true status of things is but I suspect once you get into the weeds the nuts and bolts of it all are more complicated than it might appear at first.

archfi

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123787971#Comment_123787971

Linehan hasn't even been charged (yet) with the heinous tweet crime of the century.

The note about closing the thread discussing it mentioned "thread locked as Linehan is before the courts for another matter."

It's possibly the most discussed happening across the many different types of forums and social media worldwide while also reaching the dizzy heights of being actual headline news in UK MSM newspapers and tv and radio.

Meanwhile, an about-to-close forum based "discussion" website holds out…just in case it's massive influence derails a foreign country's insane law enforcement system.

I don't think anyone ever gave an answer about non-Ireland court cases (for example, Trump's court cases were fair game on boards, no problem)

Arghus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123788637#Comment_123788637

I don't disagree with a lot of what you say, but I wouldn't disregard the importance of the "just in case" in all of that.

It is probably an overly cautious and prescriptive approach. But this place, unfortunately, due to resources and size, doesn't have the luxury to find out for sure if it's right or wrong, and so is compelled, to an extent, IMO, to be cautious first and foremost. That may not be the reality - just my theory about this.

But, yes, having said all that, it can seem arbitrary at times how threads closures about court cases abroad are used.

At the end of the day, neither of us can answer this definitively, I too would like clarity about this, there should be an attempt to provide some.

odyssey06

I don't find the 'army of lawyers' argument convincing as a basis for why e.g. Reddit hasn't been tackled for discussing 'matters before the courts' in the UK.

Why would the UK courts care about that when it comes to issuing legal proceedings? They wouldn't.
It might affect how long it takes to get through the courts, whether it is appealed etc

Occam's razor - they haven't been challenged in court because the UK has no legal basis to do so and there is no legal impediment to the discussion of cases outside this jurisdiction.

amandstu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123696680#Comment_123696680

If you voice an opinion about a case and you find yourself contadicted in an intelligent way by another poster then the benefit is that you have learned something about the case and your own understanding of it.

So there are benefits

It may be that the owner(s?) of the site likely feel that those benefits are outweighed by harm to their investment as well as possible damage to the atmosphere around the trial and society in general.

It is their call entirely but it must be reassuring for them to know that so many users on boards are prepared to put the hands in their pockets to pay for their legal defence - or provide pro bono representation in court if that proved necessary.

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123788865#Comment_123788865

The post was in the context of the value of discussion after charges have been brought or during a trial.

Pages of comment by posters who have no particular insight to the detail of the case usually doesn't improve understanding.

On the contrary on other sites you'll get people just using the occasion to air their own prejudices or grievances.

It's time enough when the case has concluded to have a discussion that can help in understanding issues which can be beneficial.

As regards the legal side I'm happy to trust the judgement of the site owners.

nullzero

Is it just a case of "before the courts" equals not having to deal with the back and forth crap that would arise from discussing the Graham Linehan situation for the mods?

Anything outside of this country should be open for discussion.

hullaballoo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123787971#Comment_123787971

this is spot on from my reading.

it's not possible to impart the mods with an understanding of this area because it's intricate legal stuff that not even all lawyers deal with/understand. it's not possible for me to assess every instance in real time and provide feedback to mods. it's not possible (and would be foolish for me to attempt to) construct scenario-based guidelines either.

as a result all we can do as a site is provide general guidance and leave it to mods' discretion to implement. on this point, it is necessarily a high bar for me or anyone else to say the mod got it wrong.

at one point there was a hope that the site's lawyers could band together and have a drop-box for queries. in fact maybe it existed for a while. but typically, good lawyers are not available at the drop of a hat, so the well-intentioned idea never really took off. obviously a legal department has never been on the cards for the site.