Rail Upgrades

Gunner3629

Will Irish rail ever upgrade to higher speed lines and trains?

Surely we should be thinking about going full electric, introducing ERTMS, and bringing intercity rail from 80-120kmph to 160-200kmph.

I’m not talking about the exorbitant costs of high speed rail (300kmph+), just significant upgrades that can allow travel times between cities to be reduced by 60-100%, making using the train vastly more attractive than travelling the same journey by car.

With those upgrades, Cork-Dublin could be done in less than 90 mins. Surely that is a game-changer.

thosewhoknow

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058420781/rail-upgrades

Right now I think Irish Rail are focusing on capacity (Oranmore loop, dual track Limerick-Limerick Jct., Four North) but the AISRR does include electrification of InterCity routes and higher line speeds.

ednwireland

I suspect most of the track needs to be upgraded to get them upto 160-200kmh

Glaceon

Regarding ERTMS, ETCS has been rolled out from the NI border as far as Greystones (and the Howth branch). The new DARTs require it. GSM-R has been in the pipeline for a long time, not sure if they're actively using it yet.

PlatformNine

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058420781/rail-upgrades

IE have had electrification of the IC and regional lines on their radar for a while now. They had been limited their stock, but we should see some plans start progressing soon after the new Enterprise fleet order is placed, as they will likely be tri-mode (25kV + 1.5kV + Diesel on delivery, to be later converted to 25kV + 1.5kV + Battery).

For ETCS as Glaceon said between the border and Greystones is already installed, but they currently are procuring a framework to install it on all lines with a few exception. The exceptions are the Greater Dublin Area and Cork Metropolitan Area as they will happen as a part of DART+ and CACR rather than this framework. And additionally the Nenagh line and Waterford-Limerick Jnc line as it would be a much larger investement because they use manual signalling.

For line speeds the plans are more up in the air, but for going past 160km/h they are limited by their stock. This is again a case though that we should see some plans start to form when the new Enterprise fleet is ordered, as they should hopefully be capable of 200km/h if not higher. The AISRR goes into good detail about line speed reccomendations and they are currently developing a strategy document for how to approach the reccomendations and to get timelines for implementation.

I will say however I think IE, NIR, and the AISRR are overconfident in the time savings the infrastructure upgrades can deliver, or at the very least are being a touch misleading about it. For example, for Cork-Dublin services I don't think a sub-90 minute time is realisitc without a dedicated HSR alignment between the two. I think a ~90 minute time for express services(1 intermediate stop at most) may be possible, but more generally I think a 1:45 time is a more realistic goal albiet still difficult and needing the full interventions reccomended from AISRR.

Gunner3629

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123690457#Comment_123690457

Thanks folks, I didn't reaslise the AISRR went into such detail. I have began reading it and do see medium term timescale for speed upgrades - "Longer than seven years".

1hr 45 mins would still be a significant improvement and absolutely move people away from their car. That should be the ultimate goal of all of these improvements: make rail better value, quicker and more convenient than the alternatives. Taking people off the road, reducing carbon and giving commuters a swift efficient experience.

I feel like Europe and the EU are really promoting rail transportation the last number of years and countries like Spain have really shown what can be done with the right investment (I'm not expecting Ireland to copy Spain's approach).

On top of that the Baltic countries are going to transform once it's new EU-led rail network gets off the ground (Rail Baltica).

Soon Budapest to Belgrade, which currently take 7+hours by rail will be possible in 2hrs 40 mins once their upgrades are finished. Similar to what we could do with Cork-Dublin-Belfast and other routes.

Czechia and other EU countries have big plans too. Countries like Ireland should be following suit. Not in a decade time but now.

Medium Term Interventions:

Interventions that are likely to take longer than
seven years to deliver, but could still be delivered
(or have made significant progress) by the end of
the next decade, are:

• Invest in developing the skills, supply
chains, and rolling stock to deliver the Rail
Decarbonisation Strategy.

• Deliver capacity and speed improvements to
existing core intercity corridors and start
rolling out overhead electrification on
intercity routes.

• Procure hybrid and electric rolling stock as
each fleet comes to their end of life.

• Upgrade intercity routes to 160 – 200km/h. ««««

• Increase other line speeds to 120 – 160km/h. «««

• Upgrade the cross-country rail network to a
dual-track railway and increase commuter
and intercity service frequencies.

Source:
https://assets.gov.ie/static/documents/report-of-the-all-island-strategic-rail-review-english.pdf

Geuze

What we need to do is as follows:

Intercity network standards

• all double-track, with ETCS, electrified with OHLE
• max speed 200kph
• no level crossings

on the following lines

1. Dublin to Belfast
2. Dublin to Galway
3. Dublin to Limerick and Cork
4. Dublin to Waterford

By 2035.

PlatformNine

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123694327#Comment_123694327

Regarding full twin-tracking on the IC network, this is something that not even the AISRR reccomends, more specifically it doesn't reccomend doubling Athenry-Athlone and Kilkenny-Waterford. I do see why and I mostly agree with it, just not to the extent which the AISRR reccomends particularly for Athenry-Athlone.

Athenry-Athlone can currently be done in 40 minutes with an average speed of about 90km/h. If raising the maximum from its current 145km/h to the reccomended 200km/h can increase the average to 120km/h it would mean the section can be done in 29 minutes. If they were to re-double the line From Athlone to Ballinasloe(which I think might be a better option) it could reduce the single-track section to less than 20 minutes from the 25 minutes Athenry-Ballinasloe curently takes. Using the passing loop at woodlawn 2tph per direction should be possible. Fully double-tracking the line would only be needed if they want to run more than 1tph to Athlone(or Mullingar if the line is reinstated).

Kilkenny-Waterford however I completely understand why they didn't reccomend. Currently Kilkenny-Waterford can be done in 36 minutes which is about 80km/h on average. Increasing the maximum line speed from 130km/h to 200km/h, again hoping to increase the average speed to 120km/h would, reduce the time to 25 minutes. However as Kilkenny-Lavistown Jnc and Waterford-Grannagh Jnc would be double tracked (6km of 49km), it would likely mean the single track section would only be about 20 minutes, possibly even less. Reinstating the second platform at Thomastown could allow for 2tph per direction, and that will likely support the line for a while.

Everything else I 100% agree with. I will note though on ETCS that it's network wide rollout is currently being tendered for completion by 2030 or 2031. The only lines not currently planned for ETCS are the Nenagh branch and Waterford-Limerick Jnc line, however thats because there is a much greater investment needed to replace their signalling systems, and it will be a sizable project to replace.