Advice on how to bring this renovation to a satisfactory conclusion

amecullen

​We started a renovation of our home in February.

We engaged a planning consultant and a builder that he works closely with, both were recommended by friends. The consultant offers a ‘full service’, which includes the services of a structural engineer and any planning applications. 

Plans were drawn up, discussed and agreed. A detailed tender document was prepared we got three quotes and selected the builder our friends recommended. The main focus of the project is the renovation of downstairs and the replacement of all our windows and doors. We are living upstairs during the works.

The project started in February and was due to finish at the end of June. 

The main delays we encountered relate to a well known windows company. A two week delay due to ‘technical issues’ a two week delivery delay. Then due to a production mistake, a 4 week delay due to the front door having to be taken back out and aligned properly. The final mastic on the windows is still not done 7 weeks after installation. There has been no inspection of the windows and there are numerous issues with them, faulty locks, damage done to frames on installation, sealant/glue still visible on aluminium frames, holes drilled through them not plugged, etc. 

The consultant has been very elusive. He does site visits when payments are due, provides no updates, does not track changes, does not agree anything with us in advance, he told us he has 15 jobs on the go at the same time. As a result, our main point of contact has become the builder. We are happy with the work the builder has done.

The problem with the windows was not picked up by the consultant, we noticed it ourselves, in fact he told the windows company that we were requesting the door be taken back out. We had to step in ourselves to resolve the problem. 

Early on in the project a number of load bearing walls downstairs were removed. Shortly after a number of cracks appeared upstairs in several locations. The builder reassured us that he would make good any problems and repair them in full. The structural engineer assess the problem and agreed what remedial works needed to done. The consultant has now instructed the builder to “make good the internal plaster with a plaster skim finish to match the existing & leave ready for future painting / papering”. As a result our master bedroom, ensuite, stairs and landing are left unfinished awaiting wallpapering and painting. 

We were told by the consultant that windows would be removed and installed from the outside. At no point was there any conversation about internal damage. There is no allowance in the tender documents for repairs to the inside of our home. The windows were removed and new windows installed from the inside. Extensive damage was done to the walls around the windows, we were told a kango hammer had to be used, we have also noticed damage to wardrobes and hardwood floors. The consultant approved an invoice from the builder which included an amount to “repair the reveals”, this was before it was discussed with us and before the work had been completed. The cost did not include panting/ wallpapering.

Our renovation project is nearing completion, however, every room in our home, now needs to be painted/wallpapered to bring it back to its original state.  The electrical plans specified wired smoke and heat detectors. These have not been installed. We are worried that this does not comply with building regulations.

The consultant wants to put the window issues and outstanding mastic work on a ‘snag list’. Even though the builder offered to do the mastic himself and reclaim the money from the windows company. 

The consultant is not impartial, he openly said he needed to free up the builder to work on his other jobs. The builder is very dependant on this consultant for his work.

We have been told by the builder that the consultant is planning on doing a snag list. 

He has not contacted us about it and we don’t know what this involves. We are also very unclear on how we get from here to the end of our project which is to apply for retention permission. 

We want this work completed as soon as possible. But we want assurances that the work has been completed to the required standard and that it meets all building regulations.  

We prefer to resolve any issues in a fair and amicable way, but we are unsure on how best to go about this. Any advice would be most welcome.

muffler

First bit of advice (no offence intended) is keep the posts shorter and more concise. Secondly where does "retention permission" come into the equation ? Have you constructed an extension? Thirdly I'm struggling to understand why a planning consultant would be inspecting the works etc. Can you check his letterhead and see what his exact qualification is?

Goldengirl

Might need to engage somebody like an engineer or architect to check and snag everything for you and provide an independent report of the works .

Sounds like the builder and this consultant are hand in glove and that is not a good position for you as a client .

Let them both know you are engaging somebody to inspect for you and see if this has any impact on the speed of finishing.

I would be concerned though that any cracks or faults are properly documented and reported on before all is covered up .

Don't mean to scare monger it is just good practice to have a construction professional on the client's side and not working with the builder .

Perks

Do you have it in writting from the Consultant regarding windows being installed from outside?

amecullen

yes muffler, I appreciate that.

There is no qualification listed on his letterhead. But I found out he is registered with Engineers Ireland as MIEI.

The renovation is to the existing house which was extended before we purchased it and was exempt from planning permission. We have straighten up one outside wall, this adds less than 2m2, which the consultant believes may put us slightly over the 40m2 exemption limit. I have been unable to find details of how the 40m2 is calculated?

Yes goldengirl , I was thinking the same myself, just not sure where I could source someone like this?

We don’t have it in writing Perks, he puts very little in writing.

Our main concern now is to make sure we get the right level of documentation / certification and that the work has been completed in compliance with the building regs. What doumention should he provide?

Perks

The Consultant believes may put us slightly over the 40m2? It either does or it doesn't.

Starting to sound like you got into bed with a building CONsultant for a renovation knowing you should have been applying for planning permission.

Your main concern now is making sure you get the right level of documentation but not with regard to the increased size of the renovation ie planning regs

muffler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123657052#Comment_123657052

Looks like you have an engineer engaged or perhaps a technician but not a planning consultant. Those consultants usually stick to planning matters only.

I think you might struggle to get a different professional involved at this stage particularly as works arent yet completed and you have your own professional overseeing matters. So you need to document and photograph everything. Take notes of what you consider to be either unfinished or poor quality works. Basically do your own snag list. Check that your professional (I wont call him a consultant) will follow through on the highlighted matters and ensure you get the proper certs upon completion. I think you should sit down with this professional and talk through the issues you are concerned with.

Have you a contract with the builder? If so then he will most likely be responsible for any defects regrading the windows and doors and their installation. Its up to him to contact that well known company and get everything sorted.

I have no idea what you mean by "straightening a wall". If you have increased the total floor area of the house in excess of 40 m2 then yes you will need retention. This floor area is calculated on measurements taken from the inner side of the external walls. But be aware that there are conditions that need to be complied with and are dependent on what type of house it is. Have a read at Class 1 of the exemptions here.

tabby aspreme

The snag list sounds like a way to buy time, and there shouldn't be one if the same builder is on site from the start of the job, he should be able to see any issues with the work and make good without a snag list

muffler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123657721#Comment_123657721

Sorry but snagging doesnt work that way.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058420091/advice-on-how-to-bring-this-renovation-to-a-satisfactory-conclusion

There's a lot to going on there. I'll pull out a few points that stood out;

We engaged a planning consultant and a builder that he works closely with, both were recommended by friends. The consultant offers a ‘full service’, which includes the services of a structural engineer and any planning applications. 

Full service is vague. What exactly is the scope of services, in particular his services during the site/contract admin phase?

The consultant has been very elusive. He does site visits when payments are due, provides no updates, does not track changes, does not agree anything with us in advance, he told us he has 15 jobs on the go at the same time. As a result, our main point of contact has become the builder. We are happy with the work the builder has done.

Related to the above. What is the he contracted to do?

The problem with the windows was not picked up by the consultant, we noticed it ourselves, in fact he told the windows company that we were requesting the door be taken back out. We had to step in ourselves to resolve the problem. 

Didn't you just say that the door had to be taken by out?
Why isn't the builder managing the comms with the windown company? Who ordered the windows?

Early on in the project a number of load bearing walls downstairs were removed. Shortly after a number of cracks appeared upstairs in several locations. The builder reassured us that he would make good any problems and repair them in full. The structural engineer assess the problem and agreed what remedial works needed to done. The consultant has now instructed the builder to “make good the internal plaster with a plaster skim finish to match the existing & leave ready for future painting / papering”. As a result our master bedroom, ensuite, stairs and landing are left unfinished awaiting wallpapering and painting. 

Was repainting upstairs in scope? if not, it sounds like the builder has done what was asked.

We were told by the consultant that windows would be removed and installed from the outside. At no point was there any conversation about internal damage. There is no allowance in the tender documents for repairs to the inside of our home.

Windows can't always be removed fitted from the outside. Inside is probably the norm tbh. Scope should ahve allowed for make good. But if it doesn't then it's not allowed for.

The consultant wants to put the window issues and outstanding mastic work on a ‘snag list’. Even though the builder offered to do the mastic himself and reclaim the money from the windows company. 

They sound like the exact issues that should be on a snag list. I'm not sure why this is an issue.
Builder has to rectify the snag items.

We have been told by the builder that the consultant is planning on doing a snag list. 

That is normal. I'd be worried if he wasn't planning on doing a snag list.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123657721#Comment_123657721

I don't think I've had a single job that didn't have a defects/snag list. In major projects, these lists are thousands of items long. I can't imagine any professional entertaining the notion that the builder can manage defects.

amecullen

Thanks again to everyone for their advice.

In terms of contracts with the builder we signed the RIAI ‘form applicable where quantities do not form part of the contract, 2002 edition.

We signed the RIAI agreement between client and architect for domestic work 2002 edition, revision 1, print 1 with the professional.

In terms of planning permission, the floor area on the plans drawn up by our professional before and after are the same m2. However, I don’t think this is correct. We merged two rooms and the back wall of one stepped back, this now steps out in line with the other wall, so this will have added a small amount of extra m2. Assuming we will need to apply for retention, what documentation would we need from our professional to do this?

I agree the next step is to discuss these issues with our professional, but as he likes to keep things vague, I want to do this in writing and more formally. I hope to incorporate the advice I have been given here to make sure we address all issues. What certification/compliance documents should he provide?

We expected a snaglist and I want to make sure that we are approaching this in the best way possible. Unfortunately the onus to check everything seems to have fallen to ourselves.

There has definitely been some confusion regarding who is responsible for the issues with the windows, I can see now that the builder should have taken a more active role. Our professional took the lead and let us down. It is clear that the builder is responsible.

In terms of decoration, there were no cracks upstairs when the tender was agreed, so no decoration was included. This damage was caused by the builder. The professional should have know that the windows would be installed from the inside and that there would be damage to all the rooms and that repairs and redecoration would have been needed. I know that now, but I did not know it at the time and trusted the professionals.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123658428#Comment_123658428

In terms of contracts with the builder we signed the RIAI ‘form applicable where quantities do not form part of the contract, 2002 edition.

We signed the RIAI agreement between client and architect for domestic work 2002 edition, revision 1, print 1 with the professional.

And what does the contract say in terms of scope?

Assuming we will need to apply for retention, what documentation would we need from our professional to do this?

You should confirm is planning is required. It's a bit strange to assume if you don't know.

I agree the next step is to discuss these issues with our professional, but as he likes to keep things vague, I want to do this in writing and more formally. I hope to incorporate the advice I have been given here to make sure we address all issues. What certification/compliance documents should he provide?

We expected a snaglist and I want to make sure that we are approaching this in the best way possible. Unfortunately the onus to check everything seems to have fallen to ourselves.

There has definitely been some confusion regarding who is responsible for the issues with the windows, I can see now that the builder should have taken a more active role. Our professional took the lead and let us down. It is clear that the builder is responsible.

To be honest, it's not very clear what the issues are. You are complaining about the professional, then the builder, also the window supplier. You seems put off by a snag list, but were expecting one. etc

Understanding the scope of services would be much clearer. What was the professional engaged to do during construction, who is the contract administrator.

In terms of decoration, there were no cracks upstairs when the tender was agreed, so no decoration was included. This damage was caused by the builder. The professional should have know that the windows would be installed from the inside and that there would be damage to all the rooms and that repairs and redecoration would have been needed. I know that now, but I did not know it at the time and trusted the professionals.

The upstairs cracks are unfortunate, but I would consider then a unforeseeable defect. The builder should repair, but there may be additionally cost to come from contingency.

I agree regarding windows. Unless there was some latent condition, that shouldn't have caught anyone off guard.

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