How many miles to justify diesel

realdanbreen

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058384406/how-many-miles-to-justify-diesel

It's a bit of a leap from a 2008 car worth a few hundred quid to an EV.

John_Rambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122966919#Comment_122966919

I'd disagree. An old car with lots of miles on the clock is more likely to break down than a brand new car. Believe me, I have a 24 year old vehicle and a newish vehicle!

bazz26

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122967020#Comment_122967020

Well I'd fancy my chances of getting a 25 year old Corolla back on the road alot quicker and cheaper than trying to do the same with the 2 year old EV currently resting on my driveway.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122967020#Comment_122967020

I think you're arguing a point that no one's making.

No reason was given for changing the car other than they'd like to and it's diesel. It being diesel isn't an issue if it's not causing problems.

Considering diesels are a bit of a lottery. They seem to do 500k with no problems (most of them) or break your heart a (minority).

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122956597#Comment_122956597

The GTE (the older one) is bit closer to a GTI than a normal hybrid. Is that what your looking for?

The argument against a Phev with a small battery is that you'll be plugging it in a lot, and a lot of people just drive it on petrol most of the time. Which is the worst of both worlds. People use them as a gateway into EVs. If you don't want to plug in that often just get an EV or....

Theres a lot to be said for a mild hybrid (you don't plug in) or non hybrid, for holding its value better. Govt not forcing anyone to go EV or Hybrid so why do you want to?

PopePalpatine

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122957391#Comment_122957391

Buy a diesel crossover instead like a real free thinker.

John_Rambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122967517#Comment_122967517

Why don't you?

https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/toyota-corolla-99-1-3-automatic/38106893

https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/toyota-corolla-1-6-gs-nct-manual/38473616

ELM327

This is my feeling too. Diesels like my 94 carina and 99 406 are peak diesel tech. Once they started adding emissions crap it made it less and less reliable. There are probably more old (20+ year old) diesel mercedes still on the road (as a percentage) than there are 15 year old ones.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122967970#Comment_122967970

John_Rambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122969928#Comment_122969928

100% agreed, once they started pumping crap in to the engine they became an over engineered, unreliable, not fit for purpose engine.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122969928#Comment_122969928

I think buying newer cars is a bit of mine field. Lots of tech you might love or hate and expensive to fix if they can get parts.

Personally I dislike touch buttons and screens. A bit is ok, but not when theres almost no buttons.

That said I do like ACC heated seats, wheel and windscreen. Android Auto or Apple carplay personally wireless. Some of the proprietary nav systems are out of date almost instantly. Reversing camera and sensors handy but not essential. I do like the automatic braking for collisions, like a pedestrian steps in your blind spot.

The OP is just looking for something newer. If I was doing 12k a year and didn't want an EV I just get a non hybrid petrol. Once you start looking at hybrids then EVs might be an option.

But the market is fickle. Its fear mongering on EVs which effects resale. But a hybrid has a smaller battery which will be charged far more often and harder than an EV, and the market is not scared of that. Does make used EVs a bit of a bargain. But newish non hybrid petrol is a safe choice.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122969945#Comment_122969945

They also lied about the emissions and economy.

ELM327

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122970014#Comment_122970014

Literally all I want in a car is a connection for apple carplay, cruise control (basic, no tech, no lkas, no TACC) and maybe heated seats. Everything else after that is just extra tech to break.

I just replaced a 2006 XC90 diesel with a 2014 Outlander hybrid. The volvo has too many issues that it was cheaper to buy something else. All ECU and software based, probably to do with emissions and modern crap. I went for the hybrid because it was a plugin when new and even if it is degraded to 50% capacity it's still perfectly serviceable and functions like a normal hybrid. The alternatives were all diesels and to be honest diesels that are less than 20 years old give me the heebee jeebees when it comes to gubbins to go wrong, DPF, EGR, filters, turbos, etc etc. I got 40 mpg over 300km last weekend, and the battery that is in the car can do 30-35km in EV mode without turning the engine on. And that's with 200k miles on the clock. My only issue is the small (45L) fuel tank. Compare driving that boggo spec car with basic cruise and apple carplay, to driving mrs ELMs Ora is night and day. I get binged and bonged out of it, have to remember to turn off steering functions every time I turn the car on and then TACC+LKAS get disabled in bad weather, and theres no basic cruise control. The outlander cost me less than 10k, the ora was 30.

I had 3 teslas, the last one got written off, and going back to driving "stopgap" cars has opened my eyes. There is for sure such a thing as too much tech. I'd prefer a base car that gets 40mpg consistently than a newer one that gets 55+ but has so much more crap to go wrong where you end up spending thousands in repairs to the point that the 40mpg in the older car is cheaper overall.

Flinty997

Only problem with mitsubishi is they are gone from the market. Which causes it own problems with the supply chain.

Used market is saturated with diesels which is a problem is you don't need one. I end up getting one because there was nothing else in the MPV I wanted. Regretted buying it.

I do feel theres a market for a simpler car. Obviously theres Dacia, but thats also a cheap car. Which is fine and all that. I look at videos of people with 90s cars and think I much preferred that quality and simplicity. I want a button to change radio stations not a touch screen.

So thinking out of the box there's probably used cars hitting the sweet spot.

timmyntc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122967020#Comment_122967020

Cars rarely go from no problems to broken down on the side of the road.

Get your car serviced annually, don't fly over potholes and speed bumps and wear out your clutch and chances are your car will have a fairly long lifespan. When the age starts to catch up with it you'll know well in advance of a proper breakdown.

You have to ignore all manners of sounds and lights and mechanics findings before your car conks out during a trip.

John_Rambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122970374#Comment_122970374

Exactly my point, thanks.

Cars rarely just stop working, age catches up with all sorts of things, rubber perishes, metal fatigues etc.. slowly they fail bit by bit.

timmyntc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122970536#Comment_122970536

Other than electronics, that is the case that routine maintenance and getting car looked at when bad noises start to appear will keep a car going a long time.

If the OPs car is not burning money through repairs right now then there is no reason to change car. The most economical car to run is the one you already own

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122970374#Comment_122970374

Well that was from my comment, that there's no immediate need to change a car that's NOT giving trouble.

But now you mention it, problems I've had with no warnings or signs that stopped cars, no warnings or symptoms.

Fuel pump fail. Alternator fail. Starter fail. Spring broke while parked. EGR fail, (well limp mode on a motorway, in the middle of 300k trip). Hairline crack on battery terminal clamp.

Probably the oldest car I've used as a daily was 19yrs old and I sold it because I wanted something bigger better suited to motorways not because it was unreliable.

Probably the youngest car I've sold was the diesel at 50k because it was unreliable. I remember the abs pump failed while still under the dealer warranty at 20k was downhill from there.

A friends Porsche had RMS bearing failure at 15k no warning, engine destroyed.

John_Rambo

Fair enough, you're all making valid points and something just occurred to me (that a lot of you may have already deduced) the 2008 Volvo may not have a diesel particulate filter.

And it's a Volvo.

autumnalcore

Drive it til it drops and hope that battery technology has moved on by then.

_Kaiser_

I really think the diesel doom-posting is overstated.

I've had multiple diesels and do significant mileage - not as much these days but still about 350km a week - and sure, it's not cheap in fuel costs alone but with on-time servicing, regular cleaning, appropriate usage (regular motorway vs small urban runs), and not driving it like you stole it (which isn't to say slowly), mine have held up pretty well.

The last one got to 410,000km before it was time to call it a day (intermittent oil pressure warning that put it into limp mode), my current one is touching 200,000km and despite being almost 13 years old now runs flawlessly, everything works, and the interior (like its predecessor) is in excellent condition.

My problem will be finding a suitable replacement when the time comes. I like to move up each time (currently have an A7) , but A8s are getting hard to find in the right spec, and the Q7 (if I went SUV) is ridiculously expensive. I do have a fair bit of experience of late with the 2016 generation 1.7 diesel Tuscon and it's actually very nice and surprisingly responsive - but I think it would be too much of a drop from my current/previous 3.0 TDI Quattros.

I do not like electric cars. Not the look of them (almost all of them are awful Back to the Future 2 rejects), not the limitations (and I wouldn't have home charging available anyway), and the costs are ridiculous!

Can't see myself changing from diesels for a long time yet.

Flinty997

If you're doing a lot of mileage especially out side of cities then diesel will continue to offer significant advantages over petrol or battery vehicles.

It's a bad idea to fill your cities and urban areas with diesels though.

silvertimelinings

A Renault 1.5dci diesel is not as pernickety as modern diesels.

User1998

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122979456#Comment_122979456

Renaults adblue is notoriously bad. Experienced it myself.

silvertimelinings

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122979883#Comment_122979883

pre adblue

moleyv

I’m having similar considerations. Said I’d jump in here rather than a new post.

Looking at a new car for ‘25.

I live in the city centre so I don’t commute by car. Car use is 2.5 hours each way on the motorway every few weeks, shopping trips weekly and then an hour each way type journey each weekend.

I do 15-17k km a year, down from about 20k the last few years when I got my current car, a diesel.

I don’t have charging facilities at my parking. There are public chargers in the vicinity that would be an option, but this obviously isn’t the most economical as home charging.

Full EV isn’t an option for me realistically. I usually add a good few extras to my car so VRT bands are a consideration.

Options are, Petrol MHEV in a small saloon (170hp), Petrol PHEV in a mid size saloon (280hp) and Diesel (210hp) or PHEV (280hp) in a small SUV.

The choice between small SUV and saloon is for me but any thoughts on power train? I could charge the PHEV on street and I’d probably be doing it off peak hours so I wouldn’t feel guilty about it. It would obviously be an inconvenience but I could do all the smaller trips on EV for the most part.

I’m not overly fussed about fuel cost but I do enjoy filling up my diesel and getting 55-60mpg and 1000km range, the latter being a nice convenience.

Flinty997

Just get another diesel if it's not causing you problems.

Without home charging don't bother with an EV or PHEV. Don't really need a hybrid either.

timmyntc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122987836#Comment_122987836

If your reason for buying a diesel is the mpg then why not buy a PHEV instead for cheaper motoring?

Or don't buy new at all, if cost is really your #1 concern. The mpg savings are dwarfed by the cost of a new diesel - total cost of ownership will be far higher

JKerova1

Thinking of getting a Lexus CT200h. A nice one near me has come up for sale with v low miles and nice spec. Anyone have experience of this car?

Flinty997

No experience. Heard its a reliable comfy cruiser. But not sporty at all..

https://youtu.be/ZKhMq1yKg9Y?si=YS5qyjXo6OgjCRje

John_Rambo

It's awful looking. Really horrible.

But it will probably last you a lifetime without giving you an ounce of problems and cost you €8 to service every ten years.