Sold counterfeit watch...by an AD!

Darwin

So I bought a new Tag Heuer Aquaracer GMT last October from a well known AD in Ireland which was on promotion at the time. The watch came by courier and it all seemed fine except for a tiny mark on the AR coating which I decided to just live with. It was obviously full set coming with warranty card and matching serial number on the watch. I even checked the warranty period on Tag Heuer's website and it was active from the date of sale. Last week I sent it off to watchfinder to part exchange it against another watch and they came back to me to say my watch is counterfeit. Now I'm thinking did somebody buy this before me, do a switcheroo and return it within the 14 day cooling off period? I'm not sure how they managed it so the serial number correlated with warranty period showing on the website? Either way I'm stumped what to do now. It's over a year since I bought it, will the AD even listen to me now? Maybe my only hope is they have records that this was a customer return if indeed that is what happened in the first place. I thought buying from an AD was about as safe as you could get lol.

893bet

get a second opinion (and maybe a third opinion) before going near the AD.

893bet

@OmegaGene will be able to tell a lot from images with out even opening the caseback I would suspect

sparrowcar

That's a **** situation to be in Darwin.... hopefully you get it resolved.

Darwin

Thanks guys, so watchfinder came back to me and offered to send it to Tag Heuer for authentication which I think I will accept. I emailed the AD requesting a call back to discuss and copied them with the email from watchfinder. The reason they have flagged it is "on the overall standard of manufacturing, in particular the really poor-quality engraving of the serial reference being highlighted". I've never handled a counterfeit, but I would not describe the finish as poor in any way, it was brushed and polished in all the right places, the logo and font looks perfect, the bezel and crown action were solid and no issues with timekeeping or power reserve. The movement inside will be the immediate tell I suppose but that wasn't inspected as far as I can determine.

If this was a swap out job, I'm guessing they had a counterfeit without serial number and then got the real serial engraved (badly) on it and returned it to the AD.

Lorddrakul

I'd definitely take the offer on that.

Best to know one or the other.

AFAIK, there is no limitation on this kind of thing in terms of one year warranty etc. This goes above and beyond a normal sale of it is a counterfeit item.

Also, I'd doubt if an AD would like it to be known they let something slip through. Couch it in terms of allowing them opportunity to rectify the egregious error without undue attention.

H_Lime

Hope you get a speedy resolution. If I was the ad I'd appreciate a chance to suitably recompense (and more) and keep this error on the down low.

I recently posted about bb tudor super clone I handled which in some regards was better finished than the real deal. It's a brave new world out there…

OmegaGene

In my opinion get the watch back and take it to tag yourself. Watch finder aren’t an AD or affiliated with TAG in any way. They’re technically a third party

TAG Heuer will be able to tell you for certain, i would’ve just sent it to them for a service quote. They won’t service a fake watch. Chances are watch finder are wrong and just guessing because they aren’t perfect obviously, an AD isn’t going to knowingly sell a fake tag and ruin his business
The chances of a previous customer swapping bits out are also extremely low, but in any case if it’s fake you can just return to the AD for a full refund with that tag letter attached and corresponding serial
They’ll refund you straight away

hope this helps

the main thing to do is not panic and go down the logical direct route, I’ve sold a seamaster chrono with full box and papers and an AD told the buyer it could be fake because there was an unbranded rubber strap in the box 🤷‍♂️

fat bloke

If tag say it's fake will they a hammer to it? They hardly release a fugazi back into the wild do they.

Rows Grower

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122711219#Comment_122711219

Good point, if it is fake they're in a bit of dilemma though as it's not their property to keep or destroy.

OmegaGene

TAG Heuer will check the watch for a service quote and if it’s fake they will return it, I’ve been dealing direct with TAG Heuer for yearsc they will not take a hammer to it ffs and speculation will only lead to the owner getting worried.

facts are the buyer bought a watch from an AD with receipt and box and papers fully legit and it was registered on the TAG Heuer warranty website on day of sale, buyer tries to sell said watch through watchfinder where it’s assessed for value and they seem to think it’s fake, watchfinder likely made a mistake but on the 1% chance something is bogus it’s all covered with the AD

local ad can send it to tag free of charge for a service quote and it will come back with a letter 👍🏻

Gooser14

Excuse my ignorance but what does AD mean.

fat bloke

Well if a bank finds a ringer note, they certainly don't give it back.

OmegaGene

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122711320#Comment_122711320

authorised dealer which is a shop that’s approved by the brand to sell their watches, they must meet certain criteria to keep that status, certain stock levels and display areas dedicated to the brand and meet sales targets

OmegaGene

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122711327#Comment_122711327

we aren’t talking about fake notes or fake boobs, this is a third party outfit making an off the cuff remark that a watch could be fake with no proof submitted to the owner and they aren’t and authorised authenticity centre

fat bloke

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122711426#Comment_122711426

Is that what you're talking about? Sorry I thought you were talking to me. Because I asked about Tag Heuer dealing with a fraudulent piece with their company name on it, and what they would do with such a piece. I think you're off your chops if you think they'd pop it back in the post. But as you say, you're talking about something else entirely.

OmegaGene

they will return it, the owner has proof of purchase from an AD, I’m not a pub expert and not off my chops as you say

I’ve given my advice and bowing out now because the conversation is just getting silly

Best of luck with this op, everything will be fine don’t worry

Darwin

Thanks for all the replies and @OmegaGene thanks for your words of reassurance! I decided to let watchfinder return it to Tag Heuer as I have had a lot of dealings with them in the past 4 years and if it turns out to be genuine, I want them to know first.

Tag will definitely not destroy the watch if it is indeed a counterfeit item, it will be returned back to watchfinder and then I can take it up with my AD. I really don't know what to make of the situation. Watchfinder have years of expertise with this and would have a stock of Aquaracer's to compare mine against. On the other hand I am assuming they did not inspect the movement as there was no comment made about that. As I mentioned above, the brushing, polishing and general finish is perfect, the crown is sturdy, the bezel clicks just like the review units on youtube, the clasp does not feel cheap in any way. I just can't remember what the serial engraving was like, I never paid any attention to it. It's a waiting game now, but I will come back and update this thread as it is pretty unusual set of circumstances!

OmegaGene

don’t worry about it honestly, while we all use watchfinder, they are not without faults and personally I have bought a watch from them that turned out to have been stolen in 1992 and only found out when it went to breitling for a service , another watch had replica links and I had this confirmed by cartier so while they are a huge company they make mistakes

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122711464#Comment_122711464

That is a clueless view. It's not their property.. If they destroyed it, they'd be liable to the OP to reimburse him. Fake or otherwise, it's his property. If they wanted to come after some body for IP infringement, that would be the AD, not OP.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122711327#Comment_122711327

There 's a rather obvious reason for that. Currency is state property.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122711688#Comment_122711688

Did you get any update from TAG?

Peregrinus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122711327#Comment_122711327

There are laws that apply to currency, and to fake currency, that don't apply to watches, fake or otherwise.

In particular Irish law provides powers to seize fake currency. Plus, it provides for forged banknotes to be sent to the Central Bank.

Other countries have similar laws. But I'm not aware of any country with laws that allows someone to seize goods that belong to someone else, and destroy them because of an allegation of intellectual property infringement.

Deep Thought

any update @Darwin ?

Darwin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122814875#Comment_122814875

Nothing yet I'm afraid, I'll give watchfinder a shout on Monday as it's 4 weeks by that stage. I wrote to the AD to advise them of what happened and I got a very snooty reply to the effect that they don't sell counterfeit watches. Like obviously! But there was no offer of any assistance so it doesn't bode too well if it comes back as a fake. I'll sit tight and hope for the best.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122817448#Comment_122817448

To be honest, of all the people involved, Watchfinder are the ones most likely to be wrong. Strange that you haen't heard anything though. I'd have expected TAG to respond quickly

1123heavy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122711759#Comment_122711759

Out of curiosity, what did Breitling do about the fact it was stolen?

OmegaGene

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122850084#Comment_122850084

contacted the police and passed on my details and gave me back the watch, I then took the watch back for a refund

1123heavy

Ah, interesting. So it was bought from a dealer who one imagines didn't know it was stolen

OmegaGene

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122851258#Comment_122851258

watchfinder bought and sold it and didn’t do their checks 👍🏻

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122851284#Comment_122851284

I've no idea how Watchfinder works, so feel free to explain, but how would they know that a watch was previously stolen. Especially in 1992? They would have access to police records. Presumably the user updated their Breitling account but would a 3rd party have access?
I often wonder to genuine watches that are stolen, end up on the market with a "Unverified, potential a good fake" smell attached to them?

OmegaGene

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122851324#Comment_122851324

they buy and sell watches like a fancy pawn shop, the watch was reported stolen to the police and was on the watch register and Breitling had it on their records, watchfinder didn’t run it through the watch register and my point at the time was they do make mistakes and that’s why the op shouldn’t worry about his watch from the ad being a fake 👍🏻

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122851503#Comment_122851503

Ah, I've only a passing (or maybe starting) interest in watches. I wasn't aware there was a watch register that listed stolen watches going that far - or at all actually.

OmegaGene

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122851924#Comment_122851924

the watch register is very good, insurance companies update them to help recover stolen watches

DuckSlice

Any update on this @Darwin very eager to see the outcome

Darwin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122869220#Comment_122869220

No, they are still waiting on Tag Heuer to authenticate the watch, I'm probably a low priority case for them :( I will definitely update the thread whenever I hear back.

Ardent

Any update @Darwin

Darwin

Unbelievably still nothing. In fairness Watchfinder have been in touch twice to say they are chasing Tag Heuer to look at my watch, but it is probably low priority given the turnaround times in servicing.

OmegaGene

3-4 week service time with tag these days if you hand it in, having watchfinder as a go between isn’t ideal but too late now