TV License Statutory Declaration

fady

This morning I got a letter in my mailbox from Anpost asking me to fill a Statutory Declaration form and return it back to them. I don't have a TV and thus no need for a TV licence and, and the letter was addressed to "The occupier".

So I was wondering if it's a good idea to fill the form and return it, or it would open a door for further correspondance from their end, i.e. if I fill the form and provide my name in the process I may get next letter addressed to my name with legal liabilities entailed. Any insights would be much appriciated.

Regards,

Fady

muffler

Fill it in I would suggest. If you don't need a licence then there's nothing to worry about.

fady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122559393#Comment_122559393

I'm actually worried that this letter is simply a beginning of a set up, where I fill and provide my name so they would then send an inspector who claims a PC monitor is a TV set then starts a legal procedure using my name for court summons. I've read several such negative experiences online.

Buffman

You're not legally obliged to do anything unless it was given personally to you by an officer of an issuing agent or served by registered post. I don't think an unregistered letter to 'the occupier' meets either of those criteria, but it's your decision OP.

https://www.irishstatutebook.ie/eli/2009/act/18/section/147/enacted/en/html#sec147

Dr Turk Turkelton

If it's addressed to the occupier just ignore it.

Brian2208

I got one of those letters a few years ago. I don't have a telly so I filled it out and sent it back to them. I haven't heard from them since

fady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122559422#Comment_122559422

If I'm not legally obliged to do anything given that they didn't satify the prequisite of the law, why are they sending out those letters then? Apart from being a waste of tax money, since they can't address myself by name via either a registered mail or in person, I can simply ignore it. Is it to serve as a justification for further actions leading to a fine? i.e. asking to inspect premises which I ignore as well, then they issue a fine to "the occupier"

elperello

They have an address IE. your house with no corresponding TV licence.

If you send the form back their job will be done.

If you don't a question mark will remain.

It's an administrative process.

Note: you can't be fined if you don't have a TV.

fady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122577234#Comment_122577234

Having first hand working experience with many public agencies in Ireland, I wish if life could be this straightforward

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122581642#Comment_122581642

It's your call.

I have also dealt with many public agencies and in my experience once the paperwork is in order they are generally happy.

fady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122584595#Comment_122584595

If it's my call, does this mean there is no legal liability if I simply ignore it?

Raichų

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122629047#Comment_122629047

that has been told to you several times already, yes.

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122629047#Comment_122629047

No legal liability.

However the next time someone decides to check the lists you will probably get another letter.

JVince

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122629047#Comment_122629047

That's correct, but they will have you as "undeclared" and you may get a visit and you will get continued reminders.

As for your previous post saying you see online that people say they were targeted because they had a pc monitor. That is total and utter BS. Guess what - people LIE online.

Then you say this is a waste of taxpayers money - but constant letters and possible callouts to check you house because you refuse to make a declaration is where the waste of money actually is. Make the declaration, post it in and there will be no further cost to the taxpayer.

fady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122629214#Comment_122629214

If people lie online, then why should I head your advice? You could be lying as well :)

And for tax payer waste, it's not up to me to fix a Kafkaesque system, actually after some further investigation it turns out that even after you fill said "declaration" they would respond back using your filled in name to "refuse" this declaration, so how about wasting my own time and money in this pointless process so someone can tick a box?

fady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122629143#Comment_122629143

I can live with that, as long there is no legal liability

fady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122629063#Comment_122629063

Just trying to focus on the question in hand as people tend to voulnteer opinions in areas that I'm not concerned with

dxhound2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122629362#Comment_122629362

You could have a read through this thread.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2055794011/tv-licence-all-tv-licence-discussion-queries-in-this-thread

fady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122629377#Comment_122629377

I did search the forum before posting, couldn't find any reference to the topic of this post so I figured it's a new move and was hoping to get insights of people who did experience this not mere opinions and speculations of topics that didn't concern myself.

dxhound2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122629430#Comment_122629430

Are you still wondering whether it is a good idea to return the form, or have you gained any useful insights to persuade you either way?

yagan

Addressed to the occupier is unsolicited junk mail as far as I'm concerned.

JVince

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122629325#Comment_122629325

seems you have an awful lot of time on your hand to "investigate"

As you get on in life you realise its better to go with the flow and keep the arguing for far far more important things.

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122629589#Comment_122629589

The difference with TV licence inspectors is that unlike your average junk mailer under certain conditions they can legally force you to do business with them.

fady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122629785#Comment_122629785

Well, I've the luxury of time because of exactly this, I don't simply follow the crowd and I don't assume things about other people. In other words, it's highly likely I'm way ahead of you in life, so you may want to keep that advice to yourself :)

yagan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122629834#Comment_122629834

They're not at that stage yet though.

I'd say it's just more to do with the fact that in recent years, especially after the RTE Barter acc affair, there's far more confrontation at doorsteps and in neighbourhoods. I think there was a piece in the media late last year saying how inspectors simply weren't knocking on doors in some areas anymore and just leaving notes, probably like the one in this discussion.

fady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122629564#Comment_122629564

Well, I was hoping to get something that sounds like "I got the letter and ignored/answered it and this was the outcome", all what I'm getting so far is people taking it upon themselves to tell me that I should/must do some certain action otherwise Anpost could/would/may do some other action in return, without actual experience with the process, I wonder why? Is this some taboo topic in Ireland?

In other words, my question basically was "Am I legally liable if I ignore such a generic letter?" and the answers I'm getting so far, I "may" get in trouble without explaining why or how, since they don't even know who am and it's not registered post, making it sound like whomever is alluding to this answer is somehow personally invested!

Gary_dunne

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122629898#Comment_122629898

Post #6 gave you the advice from their own experience:

"I got one of those letters a few years ago. I don't have a telly so I filled it out and sent it back to them. I haven't heard from them since".

There's your answer.

fady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122629940#Comment_122629940

I was hoping for recent experience given the below development, also how about the "doing nothing" option? I can't be penalized for failing to reply to some generic unregistered post, or can I?

https://www.thejournal.ie/fixed-penalty-notices-and-increased-collection-funding-for-an-post-among-tv-licence-measures-6445297-Jul2024/

Gary_dunne

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122630019#Comment_122630019

Ignore it, you'll get another letter eventually.

Reply stating you don't have a tv and if an inspector hasn't been by and seen one on display in your sitting room through the window or that you have an active Sky/Virgin Media/Any tv service connection you'll be taken off their list.

fady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122630028#Comment_122630028

When you say another letter, do you mean same letter, or an escalating one?

elperello

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122630019#Comment_122630019

That's not a development, it's a proposal that hasn't been adopted.

seanin4711

never volunteer information, just my two cents

Gary_dunne

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122630054#Comment_122630054

90% chance it'll be the same letter as they've no further information to go on other than requesting "the occupier" to declare no tv in the property.

SteM

If you don't have a TV just fill the form in and send it off. Otherwise just put it in the bin.

Why do people have to be so arkward about stuff? Just get it over with and get on with your life. I've a brother that questions all of this type of stuff, his life is spent questioning 'the system', it must be draining.

dxhound2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122629898#Comment_122629898

You mentioned legal liablities in the OP, and you are asking for legal advice in this post. Even in the Legal Discussion forum their Charter say no legal advice can be sought or given. Never depend on legal advice given here.

fady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122630167#Comment_122630167

This is why I was looking for actual experience, since the law may say something but it's actual implemenation in reality may be something else.

fady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122630116#Comment_122630116

Ignorance is a bliss that is costly, also at the risk of stating the obvious, this is a discussion forum where people come to ask such questions, if you don't like questions, then ignore them.

Raichų

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122630256#Comment_122630256

the ironing is delicious.

Was it not yourself only a few posts ago telling everyone to remain on topic and actually answer your question and no further should the thread venture into anything else?

SteM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122630256#Comment_122630256

The theads being going on over 2 weeks and you seem none the wiser, you're still questioning things 🤣

yagan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122630251#Comment_122630251

I've ignored such letters if you want actual experience. Eventually an actual tv license inspector called to the door, I invited him to view my lack of TV but he was grand, just ticked me off his list. We ended up having a good auld door step natter about everything and anything.

He wasn't far off retirement so really didn't a shyte.

fady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122630280#Comment_122630280

Is your brother the smarter one?

fady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122630270#Comment_122630270

Does the ironing comes with washing?

fady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122630283#Comment_122630283

That is actually a relief, I try to steer away from signing any legal documents that can circle back to bite me in places I don't wish to be bitten in. Human interaction is best!

SteM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122630377#Comment_122630377

He'd certainly say he is alright.

dxhound2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122630251#Comment_122630251

Straying into the area of legal advice, the Statutory Declaration says this:

Note. Under section 147 of the Broadcasting Act 2009, a person who, when required to do so, fails to complete and return a Form of Declaration within twenty eight days or makes a false or misleading statement in the Declaration is liable to prosecution and fine. If a person makes in it any statement which is to his or her knowledge false or misleading he or she commits an offence and is liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding €1,000.

https://www.tvlicence.ie/home/pdfs/StatutoryDeclaration.pdf

muffler

Dont feed the troll lads.

65535

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122559410#Comment_122559410

However, a PC monitor is NOT a TV set.

A TV set must have the ability to receive Terrestrial TV via an antenna.

dxhound2005

Again from the Declaration form:

“television set” means any electronic apparatus capable of receiving and exhibiting television broadcasting services broadcast for general reception (whether or not its use for that purpose is dependent on the use of anything else in conjunction with it) and any software or assembly comprising such apparatus and other apparatus;"

If the OP has no apparatus capable of the above, then the answer to Question 1 on the form is NO.