Is it normal to pay before receiving the goods?

UnhappyCustomer

I need to replace my windows and doors in my home and I have received quotations from a number of companies in Dublin. When I finally found the one I liked, we discussed payment and they said they needed 100% payment before the windows and doors were delivered and fitted.

Is that normal in the industry? If they do a **** job, what protection does the consumer have?

Stanford

Payment is made when the job is completed as per the agreed specifications, not beforehand, however a small deposit (10-20%) is not unreasonable and can be negotiated with the contractor.

gipi

I had a new front door installed earlier this year. Company asked for 50% deposit, balance when the work was complete.

I wouldn't be happy paying all up front.

10-10-20

It's an idea to try protect yourself by only paying a portion up-front, but often companies will not compromise on that as they are part of a payment chain.

A recent example on here is the following:

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058275956/beware-signature-windows-gone-into-liquidation-any-lost-money-to-theses-con-artists-help

T-Maxx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122424485#Comment_122424485

The bulk of the cost is in the manufacturing though. You'll get laughed out of it suggesting 10-20% deposit. Unless you meant holding 10-20% for the fitting which sounds about right.

MacDanger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058361330/is-it-normal-to-pay-before-receiving-the-goods

We had agreed details of doors & windows for a new build with WRL in Galway and it was only when the contract came that we noticed that they wanted 50% deposit and the remaining 50% before fitting the windows.

I rang them and queried it with the owner who said that we could pay that morning before fitting but that nothing would be fitted before payment as they were then giving us "credit" and they have a "no credit" policy. I proposed that we'd have a bank draft ready for them that evening as they left but he wouldn't budge.

I asked what would happen if there was a problem with the windows and he said "oh, we'll come back and resolve it" - I pointed out that he was asking me to trust him that they'd resolve any issues while on the other hand, he wasn't trusting me to pay him.

Anyway, the upshot of it was that we pulled out of it and went with another supplier where we paid 50% as a deposit and 50% after fitting. I wouldn't be happy paying out 100%, otherwise you're left with zero leverage

Edit: I know someone else who went with WRL and everything was fine. I guess everything is fine until it's not fine though and then you need something to fall back on

timbel

When getting a new front door recently had to pay 50% on ordering and 50% upon arrival to supplier.
Installation was scheduled for 2 days later.

Felt a bit uncomfortable doing it that way but all went ahead with no issue.

I can see the other point of view that it could be hard to get money out of some people after installation is done.

the_pen_turner

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122424485#Comment_122424485

thats not how it works. the company sets the terms and the customer either buys and follows them or doesnt buy . the customer cannot change the terms to suit themselves

i dont agree with 100% upfront but thats what the company is offering so its take it or leave it. 80% upfront would be better in my opinion

XsApollo

50% max upfront.
and paid with credit card if possible, credit card will give you the best protection in case anything untoward arises.

the remaining 50% after the job is completed.

I wouldn’t pay for a job upfront before any work has started, if you don’t want that then find another supplier.

for example I was getting a composite door fitted a couple of years ago,

Major issues with delays and crap fitting and returning to fix.
eventually got on to the credit card company told them to chargeback.
Bank got the money back, supplier called me the day after, and they were out within a week, took the whole door and frame out and refit it properly.

Stanford

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122424900#Comment_122424900

OP asked what was "normal practice" in the industry, paying 100% upfront is not the normal practice but obviously every contractor is free to apply their own payment terms or alter their normal terms by agreement with the intended customer if they wish.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058361330/is-it-normal-to-pay-before-receiving-the-goods

is it Munster Joinery?

Nigzcurran

I got a new front door fitted. 50% deposit and 50% after fitting which was lucky because they made an absolute balls of it and had to order up a brand new door and come redo it before I'd part with the remaining balance

myfreespirit

Just had new doors and windows installed, thee payment schedule was 40% on completion of survey, 40% on getting a date for installation and the remainder prior to installation on the morning of the fitting.

Problems arose after payment, but, to be fair, the fitters rectified the issues after I complained.

TThis is with a large Dublin-based company.

UnhappyCustomer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122424485#Comment_122424485

I agree with you, however they stated that's company policy. I read the terms and conditions and it is there, I just didn't see it before.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122424549#Comment_122424549

That's it… by paying all upfront, we are vulnerable and with no leverage

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122424665#Comment_122424665

That's it… everything is fine until it's not and you are uncovered.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122425719#Comment_122425719

No, they were giving me 5 weeks just to get a quote which to be honest is a bit ridiculous.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122425816#Comment_122425816

I'm glad you could sort it out even though you pay up front.

tayto lover

I can't see why anyone would pay everything up front. Why would they come back to you or even worry about doing a first class job if they were already paid?

UnhappyCustomer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122429955#Comment_122429955

I suppose their usual practice is to actually deliver the goods, otherwise they'd get wrecked with reviews, while if a customer doesn't want to pay they have to go to court. I understand their point and the situation, I just didn't like it and wanted to know what the norm is.

mykrodot

got a door earlier this year, 50% upfront, 50% on completion. Absolutely delighted with it. No way would I pay 100% of anything up front.

mulbot

It's becoming more common to request 100% beforehand. One of Ireland's biggest budget kitchen companies has 100% upfront.

SC024

Any of the window companies we deal with it work are 50% before order is submitted to manufacture & then final 50% when windows arrive in Ireland but prior to delivery

SodiumCooled

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122424485#Comment_122424485

Any of the window suppliers we interacted with (including the manufacturer we went with) required full payment before fitting. Normally 50% on placing order and then the remaining 50% a few days before fitting. This was non negotiable.