Rich relatives

Big Bag of Chips

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moonage

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122294176#Comment_122294176

Do you know if your brother is familiar with those Harry Enfield sketches?

If he is, every time he makes inappropriate comments you should joking say "I'm considerably richer than you!" in a thick Brummie accent. By mocking him like this he might get the message.

tohaltuwi

Times change, circumstances change. Keep up the good relationship with him, his wife & children for the sake of yourselves and your children. You never know when he might give a fig out in a crisis, or arrange some practical assistance. Indeed could be the opposite, depending on how life happens, there are no guarantees in it.

Of course it is demoralising to compare, and it may seem he is lording it over you when he is enjoying his wealth. Yes, in all likelihood he will remain wealthy into the future, and going forward, you will be doing your best to make ends meet, unless you were extremely lucky got a once off lotto win from a modest €2.50 per week as I do. I’m still waiting for the win!

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122294116#Comment_122294116

OK, that puts some perspective on it. You're the older sister, the elder sibling. So you likely feel a greater duty of care both to him and your aging parents. Perhaps he's regarded as the 'golden boy' who has done well and the fact that he doesn't pull his weight so much with parents is excused by them and likely correctly resented a bit by you.

Have the quiet word with him but remember you're most likely still the boss in terms of family dynamics, with your parents and aunts/ uncles. When family things matter, money is irrelevant.

Avatar in the Post

For someone to qualify for €200k redundancy for a regular enough job (no qualifications required) it would need to be far more generous than statutory and the worker would need to be near retirement age i.e near 40 years service (from prior calculations for generous redundancies I’ve worked on).

I didn’t get the impression he was that old, is it possible he exaggerated on that at least, for whatever reason.

Lolfox

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122294931#Comment_122294931

He had 20+ years service working with a mulitnational. He didnt just get statutory, he got a hefty severance pay on top of it. You may not be aware that multinationals often offer generous redundancies to get rid of people. As I said earlier he was extremely lucky to get this.

Lolfox

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122294300#Comment_122294300

I worked for a financial services agency when I was younger. Im not a QFA but I have a good grasp of finance. A QFA will not be able to help us as we have relatively little savings ( which sometimes we need dip into so need easy access), no extra cash to invest, no extra money to put into pension, getting best rate on mortgage and have no other loans to restructure. We have no spare money for a QFA to do anything with. This will hopefully change when we dont have childcare to pay but then we have to start saving for the kids going to college! - a chat with a QFA may be of some use at that stage.

afatbollix

Most of the advice so far has been joking about the brother acting like a dick.

But I'm not sure it's all him. Life has its ups and downs. Sometimes people get a bit of luck and things fall in place and they quickly forget what life was like.
Same for when things are tough and looking up at someone whose life seems to be great.
You genuinely don't know if they are debt-free, They might actually have 3 credit cards each maxed out and the cars on finance unless you see his bank account each week and why would he show you that? You also don't know if that money will last for ever! Next year, the roof might fall in, The car needs alot of work and that extra holiday pushes them back into a overdraft. They might even have to come to you for advice! The tortoise and hare situation!

You have 2 choices, You can keep being jealous or you can go along in your life living your own life. Try not to worry about it. Roll your eyes at the stupid comments. You probably say some silly things too which you don't even realise that they roll their eyes at. We all do it.

Personally, I have some wealthy friends, Some times they can say silly things. My favorite was when someone needed to pay for a op for his kids ear 6k was needed and my friend said just work harder for a bit! Which is a bit hard on a salary. We called him a knob but in his line of work a few extra Saturdays and he would have it covered. He just didn't know!

Blood is thicker than water and it's not something to fall out over.

witchgirl26

OP I ask this from a nice place but are you sure he's actually making digs at you & not just you being hyper-aware of the difference in circumstances?

I wouldn't be mad wealthy at all but I would be probably better off than my sister. I have a brand new car (thanks to work) & I was talking to her about electric cars in general & how it would probably be cheaper to run than her car which is continuously having problems that are costing a bit. I wasn't at all having a dig at her but it was actually coming from a good place because ultimately over the years the newer car would cost her less than the repair costs accumulated on her older car.

Also redundancy is not just used to "get rid of someone". It's a hugely costly and onerous exercise for businesses so if he really got that amount, he must have done something to earn it. Stat redundancy is 2 weeks pay per year of service (maxed at €600 per week) plus 1 week. For 20 years that would only come to €25k. I don't know of any multinational that is throwing away an additional €175k per person they're making redundant as standard. I know someone from a multinational that was there for 25 years in a high up job that just about got that figure. So there is definitely something missing there.

Look all you can do is have a word with your brother about how he's very blase with how he talks about money & that it upsets you sometimes because you don't have the same disposable income to just do those things. But I think getting annoyed when he's talking about holidays etc is more a you problem than a him problem realistically. All you can change is your response, not his actions.

Kurooi

I wouldn't be writing complaints to lady luck just yet, not being able to buy a new car is hardly the poverty threshold. Though wealth is relative.

Definitely have the conversation, people enjoy showing off and lose the track sometimes, he likely doesn't realise that he's hitting on a sore point. Even just checking him once may cool him a bit, next time it happens just say you can't afford something don't laugh it off don't dodge it, make it curt and clear. It encourages a pause and reflection.

Lolfox

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122296741#Comment_122296741

I dont think Im being oversensitive. I used to let it go over my head but when you have to say 'I cant afford it' over and over again, its degrading and is getting to me now. I have said to them so often that certain things are out of our budget so they should know better than to say or suggest stupid things to me.

As regards the car I completely get your point that a new car would be more efficient to run but If I could afford one I would get one. Im sure your sister aswell would buy a new car if she could afford it! They made the comment knowing quite well that we couldnt afford to change our cars which is insensitive. Another example recently was they suggested that my 3 children go to a cookery summer camp with their children. This camp cost €185 per child for the week which is a way higher cost than other summer camps. I would also have to pay the childminder extra to drive them there and collect them as its 20 minutes from where we live. So total cost of camp was €555 (€185*3) + childminder extra driving charge. I had to explain that cost was almost a weeks wages for me and we couldnt afford it! I suppose that cost is nothing really for them but its huge for me and thats the difference. They dont appear to get it. They are in the lucky position that they dont have to worry about day to day costs the way I do. Im going to have to deal with it once and for all and talk to them and explain how its upsetting me.

He genuinely did get that redundancy and used it to pay off their mortgage. They even had a mortgage pay off party where they delighted in showing everybody the statement showing their mortgage paid. Companies do pay large amounts to decrease their workforce, I dont know why people think its not possible. Look at Tara Mines at the moment, there are guys walking away from their jobs there with huge pays offs through redundancy aswell. I personally know some of them and some are getting great deals!

Sono

Wealth is all subjective at the end of the day, yes it would be nice to have more money and less expenses but then I wouldn't have my 2 kids, they are worth more to me than any money and we all know children are expensive, but I wouldn't have it any other way.

Money comes and goes, whilst it's not nice for the OP to be made feel the way she is around her brother, it sounds to me like you are doing what many other families do, you seem to be doing a good job in my opinion, don't be too hard on yourself.

I used to compare myself to others in the past and it did me no good whatsoever and all it did was feed negative energy into my head, I have learned that comparing is not healthy but sometimes it is can be hard not to.

witchgirl26

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122296918#Comment_122296918

I do get your point about suggesting a vastly expensive summer camp. Could it genuinely be that he didn't do the maths of how expensive it is in total. Maybe just stop engaging with him over holidays/camps etc. Or suggest things yourself if he's likely to suggest something.

On the car - I view it a bit like buying a new phone. I could pay out the full cost & have it sim free but will probably hurt for a while because it's so pricey. Or I could get it on contract where in reality, I'm actually going to pay more for it overall. My point on the car was not to shame my sister or anything (as to be honest I don't know the full extent of her financial circumstances as in reality it's none of my business) but more to maybe give a viewpoint she hadn't looked at as when you're in the middle of that, it can be hard to see the wood for the trees.

I'm not saying he didn't get that redundancy but what I'm saying is that to get that level, he must have been doing something worthwhile in there. A redundancy payment like that is not down to luck at all. Depending on how many people a company makes redundant, it could defeat the purpose (which is often cost cutting) if they're just giving everyone massive payouts. Most will be based on grade and length of service.

I won't lie - if I got a redundancy that size, I'd do the same & probably would throw a party to celebrate getting rid of my mortgage because that is a huge thing!

But again I say you cannot control what your brother says, you can only control your reaction to it. And if you keep going down the path of looking at what he has over what you do, you'll just end up bitter.

richardbradley

A mortgage pay off party?? That tells you a lot. Everyones different, but I'm a believer in keeping personal finances personal. Even my family would have no idea how much I earn, how big my mortgage is or isn't. The thought of inviting people who still have a mortgage, to a party to celebrate me getting rid of mine, is outrageous to me. It screams look at me. If.when i paid off mine, id have a nice celebration with my wife, but that's it.

As you say you just need to have the conversation now and see where it leads you. Think of how you would structure it, what are the examples you have, what effect do they have on you, how do they make you feel, and what would you like him to do in future - and me clear the purpose is you want a strong relationship with him but the way he speaks is diminishing that relationship. Good luck with it, if it goes well, he's a sound (if slightly ignorant) guy, if it goes badly then at least you know he isn't the person you hoped he was, and can recalibrate whatever future relationship you have.

Hannibal_Smith

They even had a mortgage pay off party where they delighted in showing everybody the statement showing their mortgage paid. 

I'd do exactly the same if I paid off my mortgage!

If he'd said that he was sending his kids to a camp and lording it over you it would be different, but he sounds like he thought it would be a nice idea to get all the cousins together for a camp. Is he working? Could he bring the kids to the childminder?

If its bothering you, then absolutely have a word with him, you know two know your relationship best. Hope you can resolve it between you so you feel more at ease in his company.

Avatar in the Post

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122296610#Comment_122296610

They would have had to have given him 13 weeks per year service if he was on an annual salary of €40k. As you say, very lucky.

whitelaurel

Jesus a mortgage pay off party and showing people the statement, I can only apologise to the OP , your brother sounds like he really needs to grow up!

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OEP

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122296741#Comment_122296741

There are people on here making statements about redundancy that don't have a clue what some multinationals offer, and it is used to get rid of people when they want to reduce the workforce. I work for a pharma company, the manufacturing side would have plenty of people without a degree etc. and long term service. When they made people redundant the offer was 6 weeks pay per year of service (this included an addition for OT and bonus) plus statutory. Everyone that's made redundant gets this - you don't have to be someone important or have done something to earn it, aside from just working for said company.

YellowLead

Don’t be embarrassed about putting him in his place when he suggests expensive cars / holidays. He’s the one who should be embarrassed for noting being emotionally intelligent.
As a single person buying a house in Dublin let’s say the areas I can afford don’t sound like the most desirable and I constantly get people asking where I’m looking to live and they ask me why I’d want to live there. Eh hello, I don’t want to but that’s all I can afford. I know you think he’s relishing in it, but he might not realise how hurtful it is to you - if he didn’t have money growing up he probably feels like he’s finally part of the club and wants to brag. Just have a word with him - he’s your brother. If he doesn’t cop it just spend a little less time with him and try not to be affected by it personally.

Comparing yourself with those that have less than you instead of those that have more is far more satisfying.

SharkMX

My brother was telling me that his sister in law married rich and they are loaded.

When they were meeting up with the kids the in laws would always choose somewhere really expensive (like where they would never go themselves) and they used to go and just suck up the cost.

They were all supposed to go on holidays a couple of years ago. All the cousins were delighted to be going on holiday together and talking about it for a year. This couple picked a holiday that was going to cost over €10k for my brothers family.

They had to tell the kids they couldnt go after them being all excited about it. Their in laws offered to pay, but thats not right either and would only lead to problems in the end.

They dont meet up with them now unless its all family together at Christmas. Sometimes you just have to de-orbit and go live in your own orbit. Its just a better place to be for you.

csirl

It would be quite common for a mid ranking executive in a multinational - maybe earning 100-150k to get 12-18 months salary as a 'redundancy payment' due to 'restructuring'.

HildaOgdenx

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If you have no advice to offer, please do not post.

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spaceHopper

My sister and her husband are very well off but I don't think she's happy, there is always some stress in her life - far to much of it.

Your brother and his wife were gifted a lot of wealth, and they love showing it off. It doesn't mean they are happy or even that they are wealthy, there would have been CGT to pay and they could be living beyond their means on credit for all you know. Believe me I've seen that more than once.

If it were me I'd take them aside and say look you are happy for them that they are in a great place financially, however it's becoming toxic that they expect you to keep up with them and at times it feels like they are showing of in a way which puts you down. You hope that wasn't their intention but they need to be aware of it.

Also, mum and dad would like to see more of you and their grandkids, its hurting them that you don't visit them that often. They are getting older and need more support.

Frumy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122291999#Comment_122291999

2 cars you can't be doing too bad you seem to have an awful lack of gratitude in life.

You are doing well, working, healthy kids, 2 cars isn't that something to thanks the lucky stars for?

There is hundreds of millions in the world would kill for these things in life trust me.

I have siblings far wealthier than me I wouldn't fall out with them over it life's too short and if they go on 5 holidays a year what business of that is mine?

Get over the jealousy as that's what it boils down to. Grass is greener nonsense.

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122297783#Comment_122297783

De-orbit I like that.

Yep that's what I'd do..

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122298595#Comment_122298595

That's not what's happening.

If someone can't have a social gathering without reminding people about their wealth then they are the problem not anyone else.

Flinty997

The key to being happy is being happy with where you are.

If someone keeps trying to to make you unhappy for whatever reason. You need to minimise your time with them.

kirving

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122296741#Comment_122296741

Unless you're going from an old SUV with outrageous tax to a new Supermini, AND you're doing big milage, it's almost certainly never cheaper to change to a new car, when you consider depreciation.

A Kia Picanto, probably one of the cheapest new cars on the road at €18,490 will cost you about €9,000 in depreciation in the first 3 years - that goes a very very long way in repairs, tax and fuel. A €36k car will probably cost €6k per year, and so on.

Voluntary redundancy is absolutely used to get rid of people, often for the simple reason of pleasing shareholders which boots the stock price and not much more. I know some people in tech companies in Ireland, including where I worked, who got unbelievably generous payouts for a short time employed. The funny thing is, the company is still hiring, in the same positions where people not 2 months ago were offed voluntary redundancy.

@Lolfox In short, your brother seems to being intentionally ignorant, so he can look innocent while rubbing it in your face.

Probably the wealthiest person I knew growing up, even as a teenager, would barely even tell me if his dad got an 100k+ car. Incredible holidays were glossed over as if it was a week in Tramore. He was very aware that our situations were different, and made sure never to rub it in.

Recently, I got a very big pay bump. Most of it has been absorbed by much higher rent in a higher cost of living area, but I do have much more disposable income as a result. As an example, I bought a car which while not out of reach for most of my friends, would be a major financial burden for them while it isn't to me. I didn't really mention it, and only told people who specifically asked, as it could make people feel bad about their own financial situation. Same goes for holidays, mortgage, savings, etc.

Am I any happier now than before? Not even a little bit, exactly the same as before, and that's what matters.

I think you just need to say it to him casually next time something comes up. "Hey XXX, you know very well I can't afford YYY, please don't rub it in"

witchgirl26

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122303464#Comment_122303464

Sorry when I mean a new car, I don't necessarily mean a brand new 2024 reg one. I mean a new to them & closer to the current year one. Rather than an older one that's causing problems. And your right, a lot of the time, moving to a brand new car is not the most economical but there are times when the benefits are there.

MrRigsby

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122291999#Comment_122291999

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122291999#Comment_122291999

Ask him if he knows the difference between an electric BMW and a hedgehog. He might take the hint

BalboBiggins

Sorry you're going through this OP. It is absolutely horrible to have conflicting feelings about a sibling. It's not much help but really try to focus on the relationships the kids have and try to focus on the good sides of your brother and sister in law. It sounds like you're under some financial pressure and I think when this eases you will look at your brother differently. With all that said, it's a bad reflection on him that he wouldn't help his only sibling out when he has such abundance.

Modulok

I am the 'rich' brother in my family (though 'rich' is a very relative term).

To be honest, it can be just as socially awkward to be the rich one in the sense that you just want to talk about the hum-drum of your life yet things are perceived as a brag or a boast, even when you're not actually intending to brag or boast. You therefore develop a filter which stunts conversation, and end up hiding various elements of your life. It sounds like your brother hasn't developed that filter yet.

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122294167#Comment_122294167

I am late to this thread, but you know, you and your wife have an awful lot to be proud off.

You work and pay your own way, look after your kids, and have your priorities right. You may not have all your wants. but you are taking are of your family's needs. In my view, that is doing well.

I would have a lot more respect for a family like yours, than someone who fell into a big redundancy package and inherited a shed load of assets and thinks they earned it.

He's your brother. Have a frank and open conversation with him, and tell him he's being at best inconsiderate, and at worst, an asshole.

Then go low contact if he keeps it up.

ShagNastii

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122353428#Comment_122353428

I understand this completely. I have members of my family that are all over the spectrum of wealth. I would be in the same situation as the poster above. It is all about being humble about your lot in life and never ever looking down on someone.

I know a family that earn saleries that look like telephone numbers. All self made I may add. They are the soundest, most humble people, down to earth people I know. They do truly amazing things and have great experiences but would never for a second think of touting and shouting about it to anyone.

On the otherhand I do know people who have lots of money and love to show it, in often very cass ways. Your brother has obiviously fallen into this category. I think you are well in your rights to have a word about what you are saying but your brother doesn't seem like the most considerate type.

HildaOgdenx

Mod - As the OP has not returned to the thread for quite some time, I will close it off at this point. Thanks all who took time to give advice. 

OP, if you want the thread to be reopened at any time, please drop a PM to me, or any of the PI mods. 

Hilda