Can Rural FTTH get 2Gb?

brimur69

FTTH is being enabled in my rural village next week and Eir are coming out next month to connect peoples houses up. I have been following the threads here for a long time and I thought that, due to technical limitations of using GPON instead of XGPON/XGSPON, rural ftth would always be limited to 1Gb? My Eircode is now showing as FTTH enabled on various websites (except AirWire FYI) and most show 1Gb but when I logged onto Blackknight just now its telling me I can get a 2Gb package. Is that even possible or just an error on their part?

The Cush

The early OpenEir rural fibre rollout was gpon, NBI is rolling out a xgs-pon network.

I assume at this time OpenEir are rolling out an xgs-pon network, if so it'll be down to the retail providers to offer a 2 Gbps product.

RobiePAX

Vodafone offers 2GB at some areas where Eir offers just 1GB. It seems to be dependant on a retailer.

Altreab2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058356505/can-rural-ftth-get-2gb

No technical reason they cant all sell 2Gig speeds now. However IMHO saying its 2Gig speeds is a marketing exercise. Most hard drives cant consistently write data at anywhere near that speed. Network cables from routers to computers tend to be capable of no more than 1Gig. Not forgetting that no matter how fast the fibre is ,unless the servers at the other end can send data at 2Gig then its excess capacity. 4K Tvs run easily on about 50Meg each. So unless you have about 5 connections hammering the line at max then at the moment 2Gig is overkill. That said this might not be the case in 5-10 years time :) Dammit i feel OOOLLLLDDDD writing this. 8 years ago i was in awe of 25Meg speeds :) 3 years before that it was 3Meg speeds :)

Gonzo

speeds beyond 1gig are currently not available in the Eir rural FTTH rollout areas. Speeds beyond 1gig are available in the Eir Urban rollout as well as Siro and the NBI rollout areas. At some point OpenEir will have to upgrade the rural rollout to speeds beyond 1gig

Blazer

The 2gb option requires a different router ie 10gb port and stp+ adapter. The only ones who bother offering this are Vodafone and Blacknight. And I wouldn't hold your breath on blackknight. They still haven't responded to me while VF have already wired me up.

Unless your house is ethernet wired forget about 2gb…I was in the same board but while I was gonna upgrade from 1gb to 2gb the only device currently capable of 1gb is my NAS because its wired directly to the VF router. I need to install network ports both downstair, wire them up to a switch in the utility and add network ports to my PC room and wire them back to the switch in the utility.

forget bout powerlines- they top out at 250megs even the fancy 2.5gb ones I have…and even a wifi mesh system will lose a couple of hundreg megs upstairs..

brimur69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122286920#Comment_122286920

I dont think I would even need 2Gb, I might even only get the 500Mbps package but I do have a pretty good network that would easily support the 2Gb package. My house has TV aerial coax in all the rooms so I connected the internet from the living room where it comes in to my office on the other side of the house upstairs via 2.5Gb MOCA adapters. They are awsome and I do actually get 2.5Gbps from the living room to the office. I have a couple of mini-pcs downstairs that I backup to the NAS in the office and it maxes out the 2.5Gb link. The 2.5Gb MOCA device in the office connects to a 10Gb switch which is where my NAS is connected at 10Gb and some PCs with 2.5 and 10Gb NICs.

Blazer

l was looking at those actually. I don't think any of the rooms are wired for extra tv but I must definitely check.

brimur69

Just wanted to confirm what some on here said and answer my own question, Eir rural FTTH is rolling out xg/xgsPON and does support higher than 1Gbps. Vodafone are offering me a 2gb package now also.

Gonzo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122315718#Comment_122315718

I'm fairly certain that Eir Rural FTTH is all gpon. I've tried lots of Eir rural FTTH eircodes in my area including my own and no packages faster than 1Gbps are being offered by Vodafone and Blacknight. It could be a few years before Eir Rural FTTH gets upgraded to xgspon with support for speeds greater than 1Gbps.

All the other networks do support speeds greater than 1Gbps, Siro, NBI and Eirs urban rollout.

cosanostra

Was chatting to an eir technician and he was saying it's currently capped at 1gb but is expandable to 5gb but he can't see them doing that any time soon it would require costly exchange upgrades

ben_mce

I have the Vodafone 2gb plan, but the router can't even negotiate a link when using the SFP+ adapter. Therefore I can't even get 2gb speeds and I'm stuck at 1gb despite paying for it. Vodafone support can't help with this either

ED E

If you have the vodafone ultra hub then its 4x 2.5G land and 10G SFP+ Wan.

Get a 2.5G NIC and some decent UTP.

ben_mce

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122537253#Comment_122537253

I have a UDM Pro which has 2x 10gb ports and should happily manage the 2gb line coming in from my ONT at 10gb. But for some reason it refuses to negotiate at 10gb even though when plugged into a switch it will blink at 10gb speeds. It is coming in from a 30metre run over Cat6 from outside the building

heavydawson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122537261#Comment_122537261

Why is there a 30M outdoor run to your ONT from the UDM Pro? Are they in two separate buildings?

ben_mce

yes, the ISP could only get fibre line in form the edge of the road. This is where the ONT is located. Then a CAT6 wire is used to run that line roughly 30metres into another building where the UDMP is located in a network room

heavydawson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122582789#Comment_122582789

Your ONT (where the Fibre is terminated and the CAT6 begins) is at the edge of the road? I've never heard of that (except in FTTC deployments?) Or am I misunderstanding, and the ONT is actually inside and the fiber is running to it from the road, and there's a subsequent run (between two buildings) with CAT6.

In terms of the 10G, have you tried temporarily bringing the UDM Pro right beside the ONT with a short CAT6 run to determine if the cable length is the issue?

Also is the cable CAT6 or CAT 6A…. 6A is more reliable for that speed over longer distances:

Cat6A speed is at least 500 MHz. This allows 10 Gbp/s (Gigabits per second) up to 328 feet (100 meters).

Cat6 max speed is 250 MHz. Therefore, it only supports 10 Gbp/s to 165 feet (55 meters) under ideal conditions—less in heavy cross talk environments.

Padre_Pio

Off topic, but is there any practical need for these speeds in the average house with zoom calls, Netflix, online gaming etc?

ben_mce

Your second scenario thete is correct. ONT is in a building and there is a subsequent run. Cable is CAT6 not A so I’m aware 50 metres is the limitation. I’ll try moving the UDMP out next to ONT for testing next

ben_mce

Yes, I’ve a need for high speeds. I’m doing video editing work from home and host multiple servers. I have a couple TBs of traffic every week so bandwidth is needed. Currently maxed out at 1gb and would love to see full speeds and be ready for future speeds up to 10gb too

heavydawson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122583605#Comment_122583605

Always interested in hearing about those people who have the high bandwidth requirements at home. If you don't mind me asking….
1. Is the video editing for your own personal interest, or do you free-lance or your employer allows you to edit remotely?

2. Many of the ISPs still list caps in terms of monthly usage (Fair Use). Digiweb @ 3TB/Month for example (which I'm not sure if they actually enforce). Do you choose ISPs based on their caps, and/or have you ever been subject to a fair usage warning?

For your CAT6 run, is it in conduit where you could easily replace it with a CAT 6A run (or CAT 8!!!)

heavydawson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122583584#Comment_122583584

In the Average house, no. The entry level 500mbps package will allow users to stream 16 simultaneous 4k streams from Apple TV (generally considered the highest bitrate 4k streams at ~ 30mbps)

Unless you transferring massive files on a regular basis, and time is of the essence, or are hosting content from your own home, the entry level package is actually overkill for the average home.

limnam

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122584322#Comment_122584322

True.

But there is many people with high upload requirements.

I wouldn't mind seeing the ISP's match the upload with download.

ben_mce

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122584305#Comment_122584305

Mostly work is freelance and I have a few servers in my network which other users are accessing files from. I don't have a need for huge download speeds, more the upload is important to me since my upload is other users maximum download when accessing the file server. A 500mbps package will only give me 50mbps upload where as the 2gb gives 250mbps. If homes could get synchronous connections I would opt for a 500/500 as that would be plenty.

I've never seen any warnings about fair usage. ISP is Vodafone but might be worth looking into.

I don't know if the run is in conduit, but the cable shouldn't be the bottleneck. The issue may be that the SFP+ Adapter has a maximum range. But Unifi advertises it as 100m at 10gb compatible with cat 6a or 50 metres with cat6.

Furthermore, I can see that the line negotiates 10gb with my Zyxel switch but refuses to negotiate at all when plugged into any of the 10gb SFP+ ports on the UDM with rj45 adapter.

heavydawson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122584350#Comment_122584350

The high upload angle is interesting. If you're hosting content that for example hasn't been generated/created locally in your home, then why wouldn't you host that content on a dedicated server somewhere in the cloud with better bandwidth scaling,etc. What's the use-case for hosting content locally? Are the economics really better?

heavydawson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122584368#Comment_122584368

Where is the Zyxel switch? Same location as the UDM Pro?

ben_mce

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122584377#Comment_122584377

Try looking up how much 20TB+ costs in the cloud every month. It's a lot more than the once off setup costs for a home NAS setup using a Synology or something custom

ben_mce

Yes, Zyxel Switch is in the network room on the same rack as UDMP. I will test on the weekend if I move UDMP next to ONT if that fixes issue. But it is nice to have all network stuff in a single, central location

heavydawson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122584368#Comment_122584368

I forgot to ask if you had attempted to force the speed rather than leaving it to auto-negotiation?

https://community.spiceworks.com/t/unifi-10g-sfp-udm-pro-and-pro-switch/825231/5

limnam

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122584377#Comment_122584377

I'm more referring to having to uploading large amount of data to somewhere remote.

I understand it's probably a bit niche and has some cost associated with it for the ISP.

ben_mce

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122584413#Comment_122584413

Yes tried this

ben_mce

just as an update on this. I moved the UDMP to the building with the ONT and it worked fine and I got my full 2gb speeds. I’ve isolated the problem to the Cat6 run into the primary building. That refused to negotiate at all whether I set is manually to 10/1gb. However worked fine when plugged into 1gb rj45 port. The run is about 30-50 metres in length and I’m using the official UniFi SFP+ adapter which is rated for 100metres.

Only other options are to possibly purchase the UniFi Flex 10gb as this has 10gb rj45 for testing. Or to see if I can run another cable and use fiver for the run.

Let me know if you have any thoughts

heavydawson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122593929#Comment_122593929

Get some exterior CAT 6A cable:

https://www.kenable.co.uk/en/networking/network-cables-reels/outdoor-ethernet-reels/10743-external-shielded-cat6a-outdoor-use-copper-ethernet-cable-sf-ftp-reel-50m-black-010743-5054338107431.html

Based on your demonstrated knowledge, pretty sure you'd be able to terminate the cable yourself?

ben_mce

I managed to borrow a cable tester today. I’ll use that to test the run. The issue might be linked to the wire used alright. Termination wouldn’t be a problem. Thanks for the suggestion