Donald Trump the Megathread part II - mod warnings in OP, Updated 18/03/25

aidanodr

Checkout out bloomberg and cnbc .. US FUTURES etc red red red

Wait for the asian markets tonight

SaoPaulo41

According to rte live tracker on rte website, Trump administration is planning seperate further tariffs on pharma

SaoPaulo41

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123321990#Comment_123321990

Check rte.ie live updates, Whitehouse has confirmed there will be additional tariffs on pharma, yet to be announced.

Emblematic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322084#Comment_123322084

Well I could be wrong but how I see it is, imagine that a country has a 50% VAT for its own goods and imported goods and another country has, say 5% VAT for its own and imported goods. It is going to be very hard for a manufacture in the second country to sell to the first. Yes consumers in the first country are going to pay a price but, other things being equal, the balance of trade will be in its favour.

Yes, it might be a business doing the importing but at the end of the chain are consumers who pay VAT.

LowOdour

As well as the economical impact this is going to cause, I would not be surprised if there was a push to increase anti-foriegn rhetoric in the US among people

Trump says that China, India tariffs are bad, what he is saying to his electorate base is that Chinese, Indian, European etc people are bad

Who Ate The Cat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123321988#Comment_123321988

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123321988#Comment_123321988

They might employ you if you pass the IQ test.

Kermit.de.frog

Ireland really needs the EU not to retaliate and deal with the barriers it has on US trade.

Trump made it clear that his administration will negotiate these tariffs down with partners on a like for like basis.

They need to get to table and hammer it out.

aloyisious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123321933#Comment_123321933

Yesterday he told Putin that he was very angry with him and that if he didn't go along with his peace plan for Ukraine and stop messing him about he would increase the US sanctions already applied to it by applying secondary tariffs on it's oil sales as well.

Genghis

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322084#Comment_123322084

Is it because VAT amplifies the tariff? I.e. because VAT gets applied on duties as well as the item cost? Effectively the tariff is multiplied when VAT is applied, whereas the local good has no tariff to begin with.

Emblematic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322088#Comment_123322088

I'm thinking of the anti-globalist protests that took place in the late 90s by groups like the anarchist Black bloc.

aloyisious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322106#Comment_123322106

One of the surprising things he said during his address was that there was a shortage of workers in the US and it could be filled by foreign workers, Quelle surprise.

Genghis

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322112#Comment_123322112

Ideally by getting close to the UK levels, e.g 10% or so in both directions.

The way some people go on though, we should snub the US, stick it to the Donald, abandon centuries of trade and start afresh with other blocs.

No, we should secure our US trade, and then continue to develop other trading relationships.

Wolf359f

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322104#Comment_123322104

If an American company based in the US sells a €100 widget to an Irish customer, the end customer pays €123 in total (excluding duty)

If the American company sets up an Irish shop and even produces that widget here and sells to an Irish customer for the same €100, they charge the same 23% VAT. Same €123 total in the end.

Every customer in Ireland pays the same VAT on the widget, regardless of where the widget was made. VAT doesn't give an Irish business a leg up over a US business.

astrofool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322112#Comment_123322112

The whole point of these tariffs is to retaliate and then negotiate.

Not retaliating at all would be a very stupid course of action.

The EU will retaliate, negotiate, give trump something to crow about while getting a favorable deal in place. If the US messes about, they'll look to other trading bloc and countries as the US gets desperate.

But do go on about how being a key member of the largest trading bloc is a bad thing ad infinitum while being proven wrong each and every single time.

Emblematic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322130#Comment_123322130

What about an American company that sets up shop in Ireland to mainly to sell back to the US? They only pay the US sales tax of wherever they are selling to. They don't pay the Irish 23%. If Ireland had lower VAT, say 5%, a lot more of the factory's output would be sold in Ireland. But that we don't means that the balance of trade is tilted in our favour. The same is true regardless of who owns the factory.

Wolf359f

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322116#Comment_123322116

Maybe for B2C it would be an issue. But you're talking about a % of a %. Like 23% VAT on an average 1% duty.

The majority of global trade is B2B in which case VAT is claimed back (ultimately the end customer pays it)

charlie14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322005#Comment_123322005

The U.K. are desperate to do a deal with Trump, and he knows it, so he will just screw them on that down the line.

Far as I know The U.K. will be charged the tariff on cars anyway, and if he introduces a tariff on pharma I don`t see how they will not get hit with the same as everyone else.

Emblematic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322134#Comment_123322134

I think I read that Ireland will be urging the EU not to retaliate as a trade war would not help Ireland.

Trigger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322141#Comment_123322141

Is there any such companies though? The vast majority of these companies have set up here, to give them access to the European market while also having access to a highly skilled workforce (to go alongside the corporation tax rate)

greenfield21

The only notable thing from the annoucement is that reciprocal tariffs dont start until April 9th. Giving plenty of time for countries to get in line.

Nothing on pharma, Trump must have got his pay day from the lobbyists. Can't see seperate tariffs on pharma with everything else going on over next few days. It's a strange one.

Kermit.de.frog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322134#Comment_123322134

The US trade secretary has just said that any retaliation and the tariffs will go up immediately.

That will destroy this country. You willing to see your own country wrecked because of the interests of French farmers, for example?

Emblematic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322148#Comment_123322148

I believe there are. But it is really just an example. The ownership in this case does not matter.

yagan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322150#Comment_123322150

Why would he tariff his blue pill from Ringaskiddy and silicone implants from Mayo for his ladies.

Wolf359f

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322141#Comment_123322141

So in your situation the US factory over here is producing a widget that is actually more expensive than the Irish factory next door?

If Ireland has a 5% VAT rate, the Irish factory would still be cheaper than the US owned one.

US factory here is selling the widget to US customers for €100. Irish customers would also buy it for €105 (including VAT) meaning there's an Irish factory competing with the US owned one, selling for at least €106 (inc VAT) or €86 exVAT. I'm surprised the Irish factory isn't selling to US customers.

In that situation both the US owned and Irish owned factory are on an equal footing, bit charge Irish and US customers the exact same VAT or sales tax rate, it's just the US owned one is less profitable/less efficient or greedy management or something.

fullstop

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123321480#Comment_123321480

MAKE DEPRESSIONS GREAT AGAIN!!

kowloon

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322112#Comment_123322112

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3n3LL338aGA

Yep, the EU should follow best practice in trade negotiations and roll over, exposing its vulnerable underbelly while begging for forgiveness from the orange god.

Have you Pavloved yourself into salivating at the mere thought of the EU hitting a setback yet?

CoffeeImpala

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322152#Comment_123322152

How will it destroy this country? There are 164 more countries in the WTO that we can trade with.

Let them increase the tariffs their consumers will feel the pain and fold quicker than any EU economy.

thereiver

Pharma companies need to have factorys in the eu to comply with regulations and sell products in the eu . There's more people in the eu than in America . The stock market is falling on responce to the new tariffs .this will increase the price of goods for consumers and decrease the value of 401k pension funds which Americans rely on to a large extent to pay for retirement expenses. Trump do,es not understand economics. He simply does not like Europe or thinks we are all liberal democrats or worse . At least in a few years there,ll be a new election and maybe there might be a democrat elected as president. Hopefully he won't destroy the social security system and medicaid which million of Americans rely on to live a normal life .

Emblematic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322162#Comment_123322162

Imagine there is just one factory in Ireland. Doesn't matter who owns it. Obviously they want to sell where they can. Ireland has a sales tax of 23% and the US has a sales tax of, say, 5%. Let's also assume transport and other costs are minimal. Then, other things being equal, more goods will be exported to the US than sold in Ireland.

Imagine another factory in the US. Again, doesn't matter who owns it. Since the sales tax is much higher in Ireland than the US, more goods will be sold in the US than exported to Ireland.

In both cases, the trade balance is tilted in Ireland's favour. This, of course, is at the expense of consumers in Ireland who have to pay higher VAT but nevertheless it works in Ireland's favour from a trade perspective.

So, yes, Trump is right to raise the issue of VAT though he is probably exaggerating its effect for political purposes.

charlie14

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123322112#Comment_123322112

How do you hammer out a deal with someone whose his word means nothing to him and tears up trade deals he had already made with Canada & Mexico ?

Trump is your classic schoolyard bully. He will keep stealing your lunch money until you stand up to him.