Zoe, i3 or other?

allinthehead

Looking at getting a second Ev for primarily a short commute. 50k round trip daily with a 100km round trip once a month. Was thinking a Zoe but i3 was also mentioned. We already have a Tesla M3 for the longer spins and budget is 8k. Thanks.

insular1

Im in a very similar boat myself so will follow this with interest. Had originally ruled out the Nissan leaf and Zoe due to reading about issues with battery degradation but reading more about it these issues it's seems to just be with the leaf? How do Zoe batteries hold up over time?

I love the Hyundai Ioniq but prices on those seem to be holding steady at 12k mark or so with the odd one dropping to 10k.

Also love the i3 but unfortunately not practical for family of 5.

I'm also considering a Kona due to the range boost over all the above, but hard to justify the price increase for a car that will rarely do over 150km.

allinthehead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086037#Comment_122086037

The zero Ncap rating on the Zoe is putting me off. We drive on the N25 everyday and the amount of deaths on that stretch of road between Castlemartyr and Little Island is staggering.

insular1

Hadn't actually considered that at all. My use case is mostly 80km/hr country roads. Rarely any accidents but some absolutely stupid driving on rare occasions. I'll have to take a look at the NCap ratings for the other and factor that into the choice.

unkel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086134#Comment_122086134

Zero NCAP is only on the newer models, the earlier models were a little bit better (but not great)

Also your budget is tight at €8k maximum. Be hard to get a Zoe (40), an i3, an eGolf or an Ioniq for that. But if you never need more than 100km, a 30kWh Leaf will do.

allinthehead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086369#Comment_122086369

Thanks, I do have some wiggle room in the budget for the right car. What would the range be on the leaf?

KLF

Have a 2019 i3s which is now mainly used by the missus. We have had it for about 3 years, class runaround car.

Drives like an electric go-cart and is surprisingly spacious inside. I'd recommend the 42kw/120AH version which is from 2018 and on.

Edit - Saw your budget is 8k, you won't be able to get the 120AH for that but if it's just for short commute then you could live with the previous version, 94AH, or even 60AH.

BMW was trying to make AH work instead of kw hence those figures.

AMKC

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086134#Comment_122086134

The Zoe us a very safe car structuraly. Don't that rating put you off. Its just because it did not have all the modern safety electronics on it.

allinthehead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086526#Comment_122086526

I'd do well to get one for 8k even to be honest. It's a cool looking thing, would make a great second car.

McGiver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086657#Comment_122086657

You're not gonna get 94 Ah for 8k. With a good negotiation, you could get a 60 Ah for it. But it won't do a 100 km roundtrip without charging en route or serious range anxiety.

...Ghost...

If you stretch the budget a bit, you could bag yourself a Leaf 40. Should be able to get one for 9k, or very near. Double the range you need. Very comfortable and reliable car. Take it over a Zoe any day. The cheapest one at the moment is from a dealer at 9.45k. That's a 9k car easy. Likely less if you can haggle. It's the premium coldpack version too.

https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/nissan-leaf-2018-premium-cold-pack-40kw/32635604

McGiver

From the other thread:

You won't find many ZE40s with battery leases as they stopped leasing here around 2017 (it's buried in the Zoe thread). We got a ZE40 a few years back. Great little runabout for a second car with loads of range for its price. Easily does 150-180km, and can be pushed to 200km in good conditions. The trade-off with the i3 is the tiny range. I had a preference for an older i3 but the other half preferred the practicality of the Zoe with more range and a bigger boot for shopping. That said, the i3 is a technical marvel of engineering.

Unless the poster meant the 60 Ah then the 94 Ah has the same range really, you could do 220+ km in summer on 80 roads if you know how to regen, but in winter time it's similar 150 km at motorway speeds perhaps. The 120 Ah has 28% more range but costs at least 5k more than the 94 Ah or 10k more than the 60 Ah.

The i3 is much bigger inside than the Zoe and has a better satnav.

Not sure if all Zoes and all i3's have a CCS fast charging - something to consider. On the other hand, the i3 can do 11 kW AC while Zoe can do 22 kW AC, makes a difference only if one has 22 kW access (like at work).

McGiver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086778#Comment_122086778

Chademo is a big minus and Type1 too, the latter matters less, but Chademo is a big minus. Why I went for a CCS car back in 2020 when things started moving to CCS.

prawnsambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086788#Comment_122086788

For all that, the new hub in Carrickmines has an equal number of Chademo plugs as CCS. It's going to be around for a while yet.

McGiver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086791#Comment_122086791

Yeah but what about outside of the Pale?

prawnsambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086797#Comment_122086797

No need for the culchie inferiority complex, I'm outside the Pale too. 🤣

I haven't seen any Chademo chargers being pulled up by the roots around me. In fact there's a new unit not yet live in a town near me with a Chademo on it.

There must still be thousands of Chademo cars in the country. A quick check on DD lists over 500 Leafs.

McGiver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086834#Comment_122086834

Ah 😁, I genuinely meant it in practical terms if OP wanted to venture out and about, it could be a tad harder with Chademo. Yes, they are there, but there's way more CCS.

allinthehead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086788#Comment_122086788

Is there an adaptor or something for type 1?

allinthehead

Wouldn't be a bad shout, that one's a cat D though.

vicM

RE: CCS vs Chademo - Im going to say it may not matter much as max the OP is looking to go on this car is 100 Kms round trip. Already said they have a longer range EV for longer trips

Personally Id go for the i3. Mrs has one and I personally prefer the drive and power delivery compared to both the Zoe and Leaf. Infact I prefer its drive to a lot of more recent EVs

McGiver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086868#Comment_122086868

CCS/Chademo, OK if that's the case.

The i3 is a sporty car and has one pedal driving. Very lovely car indeed. Unique one.

McGiver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086866#Comment_122086866

The Zoe or the i3?

McGiver

Not I'm aware of. It doesn't matter much just that you can't use the same AC charging cable for Nissan and Tesla while you can for the i3 and Tesla. Minor inconvenience. I just mentioned it so that you're aware.

allinthehead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086884#Comment_122086884

That would be an inconvenience as my charge point is tethered.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086878#Comment_122086878

The Leaf posted by Ghost.

...Ghost...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086788#Comment_122086788

It's a second car for local journeys. OP has a Model 3 for main car, like myself. I also have a Leaf 40 as the second family car….Leaf 24 until very recently infact. The CHAdeMO is a non issue for the use case described and there are plenty of CHAdeMO around still, with new ones still going in. When I bought my Leaf 2 last month in Cavan, there was a new CHAdeMO and CCS chargepoint just off the main road.

Leaf 40 is a Type 2, not type 1. Even if it were a type 1, like the L24 or 30, there are adapters for less than €100 for them.

McGiver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086897#Comment_122086897

Correction - only the 24 & 30 kW Leafs had Type 1 port. The 40 kWh has a Type 2 port - so no issue with tethered.

But it's moot unless you're considering a 30 kWh Leaf, given the 40 kWh is a write-off. 30 kWh Leaf is within the budget.

...Ghost...

Yes, there is, for under €100. However, the Leaf 40 is a Type 2, so no need. You can use the same charge point you use on the M3.

...Ghost...

I didn't see that. Good spot. Still, you won't have much trouble getting one for 9-10k. I looked at anything priced up to 14k and worked out how I could knock a few grand off.

...Ghost...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086916#Comment_122086916

A 40kWh is outside of budget only if the asking price is paid. Plenty of these cars have been up for months. Someone shaking a fist full of 50s in the region of 9k will bag a 40 Leaf without much trouble.

McGiver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086939#Comment_122086939

Like this one:

https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/nissan-leaf-2018-sv-premium-cold-pack-low-mileage/36729549

...Ghost...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086964#Comment_122086964

Potentially. There are a few under the 12k asking price that have been up for over 2 and 3 months. There's one there with an asking of 12.5k and I bet the seller is kicking herself she didn't accept my offer of 10.5k.

Car needed over a grand spent on it because the charger door actuator wasn't working and it needed a bushing done because Nissan only replaced one for the NCT. I was going to take it as seen and fix the actuator myself. No way in hell she will get near her asking price despite it being a Tekna with all the extras. Paint needs some attention too.

allinthehead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122087109#Comment_122087109

Was it the black one?

allinthehead

Any ideas what I might get this for if I told him I wasn't looking for the 12 month warranty?

https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/bmw-i3-stunning-i3-z-e-auto-low-mileage-sat-na/36255075

fafy

i’d have a look at this one, it has the range you need, NCT until March 2026, in or around budget, would get it for less than asking, has been up for a few months. and very nice truffle leather seats, they are are a really great fun car.
I test drove a 2020 135hp zoe once, a total donkey, compared to an i3.

https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/bmw-i3-nct-03-26/36797691

allinthehead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122087979#Comment_122087979

Ya I was interested in that one, I'm in East Cork though so it's about a 7 hour round trip just to look at it. There's another one in Kildare in blue for similar asking price. If I could get up on Saturday to view both it might be worthwhile.

Akrasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122086964#Comment_122086964

You think the seller is coming down by 3.5k on a 11.5k car?

No way. You'd struggle to get a decent 2017 24 or 30kwh Leaf with good specs and a healthy battery for 8k

fafy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122088228#Comment_122088228

The Kildare 2016 Blue i3 is a Uk import, from a car dealer, it has the much smaller screen, and some of the older model features like the previous incarnation of the rotary controller, the gold i3 in Lucam, is much better equipped, nct until 2026, 1k cheaper allthough higher mileage, and a private sale so better chance of a further reduction in price.

fafy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122088374#Comment_122088374

update:

The Blue i3 (kildare)is “Atellier” Interior, which has the smaller screen and the older iDrive controller

The Gold i3(Lucan) is “Suite” trim, which has leather seats, much larger screen and newer iDrive controller, possibly other improvements also.

The i3 2016 brochure is here :

https://autocatalogarchive.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/BMW-i3-2016-INT.pdf

allinthehead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122088564#Comment_122088564

Excellent, thanks for that.

Price on that Leaf just dropped to 10k.

https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/nissan-leaf-2018-sv-premium-cold-pack-low-mileage/36729549

allinthehead

What would a realistic winter range on that leaf be?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122089385#Comment_122089385

On N roads the minimum range was reliable 200 km driving normally and with the heat at auto 21 deg when we had one between 2018-2021. Didn't notice any real range loss, the SOH did fall to 92% while we had it.

allinthehead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122089426#Comment_122089426

Sound, that gives it a good 100km extra range in winter if we need it.

I just phoned the owner, I asked about the minor dent. He said the bumper needs to be replaced.😆

"Perfect condition with minor dent to front bumper" = needs new bumper.🤣

unkel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122089473#Comment_122089473

Offer €8,500 so 😁

(agree with others though, the i3 is a far superior car than any of the others mentioned here and your required maximum range of 89km is fine in winter on N roads if you take it a bit handy on the worst days, particularly if it has a heat pump)

gossamerfabric

Id. 3 keeps getting software updates...this is a benefit which is worth paying for over others which have no further support.

unkel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122089623#Comment_122089623

Do you still have to go into the VW dealer for the over the air updates? 😂

Not quite sure why you even mention an ID.3. Unless you can get it for close to OP's budget of €8k, but there is two chances of that.

gossamerfabric

You can make disparaging remarks about the I'd.3 but they are still supported. OTA updates are working and functionality is improving include charge speed… for instance the charge speed on the 45kWh battery is up to 120kW now which turns the car from a short range commuter in to a viable proposition for distance travelling.

unkel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122089877#Comment_122089877

Wow 120kW. Tesla had more in 2012 😂

Are you still seriously promoting an ID.3 in this thread where the OP's budget is about €8k?

allinthehead

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122089586#Comment_122089586

🤣. I'm just back from test driving a Zoe and an i3. I came back smiling after driving the i3. Clear winner, super little car and so interesting everywhere you look. I got back in to the Tesla and it was so dull in comparison.

Now if only I knew someone living in Lucan who could check out that i3 for me before I travel up from Cork. 🤔🤣

gossamerfabric

So, much more than 2c which would make it faster charging in relative terms than a Tesla Model s 60d.

You are being very selective in how you present information to denigrate the id.3

allinthehead

Here's the perfect condition minor dent.

I might still take a look. It'll buff out.

gossamerfabric

Credit is relatively cheap and I'd.3 is a bargain secondhand