Comapny Car EV - Should the company pay for my home charging and Electric bill?

omega99

Hi all,

Not sure if this should be in the Finance section but it definatly relevant to EV section.

I'm getting a new EV company car in the coming weeks as the BIK rates are still very favorable for at least the next two years or so.

I did not mention the subject of the home charger point or the extra electricity on my home bill to my employer yet however.

Is the company obliged to pay (€1000 approx I was quoted) to install the home charge point? (There is no facility to charge at the office and I'm on the road most of the time anyway.)

Also, regarding the expected increase in my home Electric bill.. what is the norm regarding claiming this. Do I just expense the company for Car Charging units used? If so, how is this done accuratly ? Will modern smart chargers give accurate KW/Hour consumption figures per month? We have a smart meter recenty installed so perhaps the Electric company will be able to give exact EV consumption figures. Anyone shed light onto this?

Even if the Smart Charger can give KW/H figures per month, this will not give me the amount that it cost me as there will be times I will have to charge the vehicle in Peak rate times as well as middle of the night low EV rates. How will this be accuratly computed ?

With my current diesel company car its my employers obligation to pay for 100% of its running costs and as we all know we pay for the privalage in high BIK to revenue.

The fact that there is a favorable BIK rate on EV's should not take away form the fact that my company car should be 100% expensed by the company. Paying for my charger and Electricity bill ongoing is waht I would expect.

All feedback appriciated.

B

Gumbo

There’s no yes or no answer.

You need to discuss this with your company.

Charger costs

Buddy Bubs

Just chat to them, there's no law or anything around this. It's up to you whether you're happy to pay for some electricity and save on BIK, maybe you are maybe you aren't and you're not right or wrong either way.

I probably don't see most employers paying for a charge point though but that's down to each company

...Ghost...

I would approach it like this.

Give them 2 options.

1. You charge exclusively on the public network. The rates will be considerably higher than a home charged car and you will lose time on the road.

2. They cover the cost of a charger installation, less the grant, up to a fair value. You provide your electricity bill each month and pencil in the sum owed due to kWh consumed by the car. Only expense the kWh on the cheap rate and eat the outside hours for the privilege you will have driving the EV for personal use. It will be small expense for you. I would also expense public charging but this will be less.

The charge point APP will record your kWh consumption over whatever period you need.

drunkmonkey

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121895151#Comment_121895151

Just on the first bit, does it make any sense to make a contribution towards running costs using after tax money which op would be using to pay their electricity bill.

I know it brings down the notional pay by the amount contributed but is there any actual benefit in doing this, seems like your just robbing Peter to pay Paul but you're no better off financially.

drunkmonkey

@omega99 I got recommended this to put on my dumb charger for finding out exactly what the charger is using, haven't fitted it yet as still waiting on a car, you could just get the cheapest charger and show this to the company to help them save a few quid, they might appreciate it.

https://www.amazon.de/dp/B0C3D3W2DT/ref%3Dpe_27091401_487027711_TE_SCE_3p_dp_i1?th=1&psc=1

listermint

What about a mileage allowance that caters for the price of the electricity?..

drunkmonkey

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121895339#Comment_121895339

Don't think you can do that when the car is supplied to you by the business. Can't have both.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121895339#Comment_121895339

Can’t have that and a company car.

Company car and fuel card or in this case electricity paid for by employer.

Gumbo

Get a Wallbox charger. The app breaks down what you charge and the cost of it.

But a small check meter online to the charger would be better in case the charger app crashes etc

ted1

When I had a company vehicle all my expenses including diesel was covered, I’d expect the same with electricity

BIK is between you and the tax man. And not a concern of your employer

slave1

Exactly, you can be paid whatever and it just becomes BIK, just ask your employer about cost of install but it should also be BIK if you want to be totally above board...

jimmycrackcorm

Isn't it like asking if you get a diesel car, is the company going to pay for your diesel?

If you are doing company business then yes they should pay towards the charger and electricity costs

RainInSummer

Lad I know working for DPD has an electric delivery van. He charges it at home.

Whatever charger they supplied him with dials home to DPD and they pay that portion of the bill.

Must ask the next time what the set up is.

Oscar_Madison

You’re going to average out work milage over time which in turn will provide you with expected number of home charging events required -converting those events to euro will give you a starting point for discussions with your employer.

I reckon the clearest method of refund will be around an agreed work milage rate per month - that can be easily documented - then use an agreed charging tariff - maybe an average of night rate and day rate - updated if significant increases or decreases occur

But if on the go charging will be your main way of charging then stick to that and receipt expenses- remember if you don’t have home charging available to you, then that’s the method you’d use anyway

I don’t see why the company would have to foot the bill for a home charger if the above method was used

KildareP

ePower and Ecoplex are two companies that can install a company managed home charger point.

The chargers have RFID cards akin to a fuel card, and they report charging usage to your employer over the mobile network, and then they compensate you at an agreed rate (usually based on your electricity plan unit rate - but make sure you pick a plan that suits your ordinary household usage and not necessarily one that offers cheapest EV rates).

Whether the company is going to pay you to go and install your own that they have no control over is probably going into goodwill territory. Your employer is not, for example, responsible for paying to put a paved driveway into your house if you haven't got one, or to compensate you for overnight pay and display parking charges if you live in a pay and display area.

Casati

important to note if you sign up to one of the EV rates, which typically allow v cheap EV charging for a few hours at night, you are going to pay a premium for all the other electricity your household uses. This is almost never mentioned

You are possibly better off having the cheapest 24 hour rate going - unless you already have a day / night rate

slave1

Just go for a Zappi, it's readout will tell you what electricity was consumed in a day/week/month and you can claim on a monthly basis

drunkmonkey

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121895681#Comment_121895681

That's what I did, cheapest 24hr rate. It works out better than any EV night rate for non car charging.

omega99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121895445#Comment_121895445

yes indeed Ted1. The time will come when EV BIK is the same as Diesiel is now

slave1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121895445#Comment_121895445

Just to say, BIK has to go through Payroll so is of concern to your employer given they have an Employers PRSI liability

Casati

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121900272#Comment_121900272

Also I know some companies have to date accepted electricity costs but I wonder how this will work long term- ie a rep charging at home on 24hr rate at 30 cent a unit could be a couple of grand in electricity if they drive all the time.

How can a company account for this level of effectively unvouched expense? Revenue aren’t known for taking peoples word, they usually want (vat) receipts

User1998

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121900692#Comment_121900692

The employee could give the electricity bill to their employer and they can work out what percentage was business use/personal use and expense the business use amount. That would be accepted by Revenue

Buffman

As with any company vehicle, anyone I know in that situation has all costs covered by the employer. The employee very kindly allows the employer to install a company charger on the employees property and the employer covers all the costs. If you're in a company who expects you to cover anything out of you're own pocket, just forget about it and stick with a diesel or public charging.

As someone mentioned above, a 'normal' setup is for the company charger to be directly linked to the company so they know it's usage in order to reimburse the employees expenses. The employee would just have to submit their bill/proof to show actual unit rates cost etc, in my experience the company won't force you onto any EV plan or anything like that as it's all expensable for them anyway so it doesn't really matter to them what type of rate you're on.

An issue may arise when you leave that job, the company might offer you the opportunity to 'buy' the charger at a depreciated price like any other company asset, remove it, or just forget about it.

I know of one property that needed a lot of electrical upgrades where an install cost around €6k, all covered by the company.

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058340983/comapny-car-ev-should-the-company-pay-for-my-home-charging-and-electric-bill

To give my experience. I got a company car, I already had a charger so never asked about that.

For the car instead of them trying to invent a new rate they just gave me the rate for a diesel car per km. I charged at home and then put in what km's I used for business at the diesel rate. az

Casati

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121900801#Comment_121900801

Humm I see the logic but what other bill will revenue accept in this manner? It’s still very arbitrary to work out what portion of electricity was for the company car versus the household - and in many cases whatever other EV’s might be in that household.

Casati

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121900859#Comment_121900859

Okay so basically you get a company car - which presumably you pay BIK on, and also receive a mileage allowance tax free? I didn’t know that was possible as tax free mileage allowances are based on the total cost to provide a car rather than just fuel but every day is a school day

Clo-Clo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121901404#Comment_121901404

I get a car allowance(which is taxed) or I get a company car. If I get a company car I also pay a "personal use charge" per month

For either option I get a fuel allowance per KM which is minimal to be honest

crl84

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121900840#Comment_121900840

The last point is definitely an issue that needs to be ironed out before hand.

I know for the grant, homes have to be brought up to current standard, which could be 1500+. Lots of homes without earth rods, without cylinders and sinks grounded, tails upgrades etc.

If its just a charging point install, it would need to be a non-RECI to install it without doing these upgrades, which probably isn't likely if the company is paying a reputable company to install the point?

TitianGerm

If it was me I'd do the following and it should satisfy revenue if any queries come up.

1. Set up an excel sheet. Have columns that includes date, odometer at start, odometer at end, travel distance, kWh/100km and electric unit cost.

2. Before and after every business trip you fill in the details I've listed above and take kWh/100km from the car dash. Have a sum formula to calculate the cost per trip.

3. Submit this excel sheet to your payroll department each week/month in line with their expense policy. Include a copy of your ESB bill when available to show the unit rate you are claiming matches what you are being charged.

4. Request a public charge card for whenever you need to charge on the go. Include these sessions on your excel sheet but remove the sum column so you don't end up claiming for these charge costs as well.

Buffman

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121902953#Comment_121902953

Ye, I'm not sure what exactly you mean with the last paragraph, any 'company' work should be 100% on the level and up to all relevant standards so not sure how a 'non-RECI' would be involved. A lot of company chargers would be installed claiming the ACA tax incentive which is basically 100% of total cost 'back' in the purchase year, and it has a minimum spend requirement of €1k for EV stuff.

https://www.seai.ie/business-and-public-sector/business-grants-and-supports/accelerated-capital-allowance/

drunkmonkey

ACA isn't 100% of the cost back, it's 12.5% corporation tax the company doesn't pay on said amount. For every €1000 spent their tax bill would reduce by €111.11