Neighbours Scaffolding in our garden

pippip

Our back garden backs onto a terrace of houses at 90degrees. i.e. the side of the first house is the back wall of the garden.

They are getting a roof put on which, without permission, have erected scaffolding in our garden.

In general I don't have a problem with this, unless they damage anything, but I'm very annoyed at not being asked. Its a dentist in the house, not residential.

I'm sure there are locations where builders must need it and have a budget for paying for such access.

I'm just pondering whether to approach the owner but before I do, i was wondering is there an unofficial daily rate I could request for it being there?

argentum

The Dentist should have spoken to you as a good neighbour.

The builder should have then called into you to show you the locations of the uprights and agreed their location

They will be as quick as possible and hopefully they don't damage anything but take pictures to be sure

Why would you look for a daily rate , would you charge a mate if he parked in your drive way while visiting

Mitch Connor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121596355#Comment_121596355

They aren't a mate.

If you lived beside a dentists office would you let them use your driveway for patients cars, for free?

pippip

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121596355#Comment_121596355

No, but a mate would ask. I'd be seeing the daily rate as compensation for not getting permission and a lesson learnt for them. I'd see it as if I say no it's going to cost them alot more to sort an alternative solution. I just wondered whether builders have a going rate they offer when met with a no to access.

thomas 123

Presents a health and safety risk to the OPs family also.

generally hoarding has to be erected and safety signs displayed - I’d be worried about something falling off it onto my child or something of mine getting broken when it’s taken down.

Bang out of order not to ask for permission or at least say they were doing X and it will be there for Y.

argentum

compensation is normally paid out to cover a loss ,what loss is there

Baybay

Free & uninterrupted access to your own garden?

FrancieBrady

This seems to be a perfect way to live in a house and not a community.

Why don't you just approach the owner, explain you would like to be consulted in future, make it clear that any damage should be either put right or paid for and leave it at that?

pippip

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121596401#Comment_121596401

Compensation would be if they damage my garden, what I'm effectively doing is renting my garden.

Ah listen I'm not trying to be prick but I don't want to be taken for a fool and afterwards someone says "oh you should have asked for x, everybody gets that for similar situation"

Furze99

I'd be calling into the receptionist and ask to talk to said dentist. Up to them to talk to the builder and ask them why the hell this was done without the courtesy of asking. Request a clear answer and explanation.

On other hand, if you use the services of this dentist, maybe best to be very diplomatic :)

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121596423#Comment_121596423

Compensation would be if they damage my garden, 

You are changing the tune rapidly:

I'd be seeing the daily rate as compensation for not getting permission and a lesson learnt for them

GBX

Approach your neighbour and inform him of your unhappiness and discontent. Highlight the issues: Access, Safety etc. See what their reply and the contractors reply is.

As for compensation or goodwill gesture - there is nothing that can be enforced. You can obviously ask him how he plans to address this but as you will not be disrupted in earnings, I cant see you gaining anything. I doubt access has been budgeted for - given permission wasn't sought in the first place.

Let us know what replies you get.

Squatman

theres a good chance that the dentist was unaware that the scaffolding 1 would encroach, and 2 has encroached in your garden. they are a dentist, not a builder, so could be clueless as the the practicality of the build

While there is no doubt the neighbour should have asked, just bear in mind that you may want to do upgrades to your own home at some stage, goodwill would then work both ways, as would spite, if some existed.

nelly17

A dentist could be a very usefull person to owe you a favour - I would'nt be too bullish about it. By all means let him know he should have asked as it would have been the Neighbourly thing to do.

10-10-20

i bet the builder will say "I knocked twice on Monday, you weren't there and we had to move on with the build. Sorry about that, finished on Friday. Bye".

AmpMan

Go around and knock his teeth it ?

😂

pippip

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121596437#Comment_121596437

Fair point, probably not my best choice of words. Suppose it could be compensation for violation of rights.....stretching.

pippip

Cheers for all the replies. I'll see how it pans out. I suppose I initially thought what's the point in going into them, if they didn't have the decency to ask I can't see what a conversation would achieve. Just wondered if a daily fee was even a thing for access.

Alkers

If it was me I would approach the builder tell him he's trespassing and instruct them to get off the property immediately. Then the ball is back in the dentists court and see what happens.

That is the height of ignorance to just assume access like that and there could even be liability issues with yourself were the scaffold to collapse or someone injured themselves on your property.

tabby aspreme

Has the scaffolding been signed off by a qualified scaffolder as being safe, there should be safety tags attached to the scaffolding with current dates on them, is it a proper building/ roofing company or some of the Northside, Southside, power washing, gutter cleaning roofer's

argentum

Maybe have a word with the dentist and get a free check up would be your best bet to be honest

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121596540#Comment_121596540

As of course would be your right. If it isn’t too much of a hindrance, I’d be inclined to mention it to the neighbour, but I wouldn’t want it to become an issue. Neighbour disputes often have unintended consequences down the line.

GBX

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121596515#Comment_121596515

Quite possible this and even the neighbour saying the same. Make it known you are put out by it and should have been asked face to face before the work commenced and see how it goes.

You could invoice the dentist a daily fee for disruption but that could backfire in time especially if A its not paid as you will feel further aggrieved and B cause long term bad relations with the dentist.

acceletor

Personally id just take it down myself.

thomas 123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121596608#Comment_121596608

Or just the legs on his property 😂

Victor

Critical:

Safety.

Insurance.

Security.

Boundary detail - no gutter overhanging your property without agreement.

Optional:

Emotions.

OU812

Absolute no without permission. Call in and tell them to remove it with. 48 hours. After that, solicitor.

This is trespass plain and simple.

martco

oh there's a hundred things wrong with this scenario

don't interfere with it yourself tho! get a solicitor with experience in property conveyancing etc. and get a cease and desist letter send to all parties (owner, builder, architect if one involved)

also is there planning involved on their part? if so get on to the planning inspector inform them

and also inform the HSA they are operating unsafely (they're nice and zealous I've heard)

the worst case is any accidents/damages you'll have a track record of attempting to objecting and resisting it, you can easily claim indemnity/take them to court etc

muffler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121596715#Comment_121596715

Seriously? Are you aware of neighbour's entitlements under the Land Conveyancing Act?

thomas 123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121596777#Comment_121596777

What are the neighbour's entitlements?

kabakuyu

Just had neighbours scaffolding in my property, he approached me with the builder to seek permission and explained nature and duration of job and to clean up and make good any mess/damage, no payment sought by me.The dentist/builder should have sought permission before going ahead.

kabakuyu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121596568#Comment_121596568

Not a great idea, dentist might say he needs urgent expensive work to help pay for his new roof.

RurtBeynolds

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121596568#Comment_121596568

I can see it now...

OP: "Hey dentist you've trespassed onto my property without my permission, what are you going to do to rectify this"

Dentist: "How about I drill into your face for free"

Hardly the most enticing deal.

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121596833#Comment_121596833

Pg 38 - Chapter 3

a2709.pdf (oireachtas.ie)

GreeBo

Might be also worth asking about insurance.

If you have someone over to your house and they get injured by this scaffolding its your insurance they will go after first.

thomas 123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121597496#Comment_121597496

Thanks @FrancieBrady , this refers to party walls though from a brief read - is there something here that says a construction company can set up in a neighbors garden?

granturismo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121596777#Comment_121596777

Where does it indicate that scaffolding can be erected on adjoining property without the adjoining owners consent. From Francies link:

Reg 44:

From will not causes stantial damage or inconvenience to theadjoiningowner,or

(ii) if theymay or will cause such damage or inconvenience, it is nevertheless reasonable to carry themout.

(2) Subject to subsection

(3), in exercising any right under subsection

(1)thebuildingownershall— (a)make good all damage caused to the adjoining owner as a consequenceof the works, or reimburse the adjoining owner ther easonable costs and expenses of such making good,and (b) paytotheadjoiningowner— (i) the reasonable costs of obtaining professionala dvice with regard to the likely consequences of the works,and (ii) reasonable compensation for any inconvenience causedbytheworks.

chooseusername

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121597605#Comment_121597605

"Where does it indicate that scaffolding can be erected on adjoining property without the adjoining owners consent. From Francies link:"

If you read on you will see the neighbour can apply for a works order from the court to access your property for essential maintenance to his property.

FrancieBrady

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121597557#Comment_121597557

‘Party structures’ not just walls.

Effectively this gives reasonable access to someone carrying out work.

The court will not look favourably on somebody blocking because they have the hump or are angling for financial gain.

I am somebody who had to use the act over works here.

RurtBeynolds

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121597665#Comment_121597665

So to clarify, it does not permit any old sod to enter your property and erect scaffolding without so much as a word to you first?

enricoh

Sod that, wrong time of year for kids in garden , but mine would be up that scaffold and me not knowing it's even there.

Height of ignorance imo, what are they at- plastering, fix chimney?

chooseusername

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121598292#Comment_121598292

Correct.

45.—(1) A building owner who is in dispute with an adjoining owner with respect to exercise of rights under section 44 may apply to the court for an order authorising the carrying out of specified works (a “works order”). [2009.] [ Land and Conveyancing Law Reform No. 27.] Act 2009.

Ash.J.Williams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058330642/neighbours-scaffolding-in-our-garden

You are rightly annoyed, I would tell him straight that it was erected without permission and see how it goes

thomas 123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121598512#Comment_121598512

The OP might clarify but this transgression is at the bottom his garden or to the side, his home is not attached by wall or other physical shared border structure to the property where the work is being carried out - that is my understanding from the first post.

pippip

Just to clarify a bit more from what I learnt when I got home ...

So we are one of three gardens effected.

Neighbour 1 was actually asked back in December if they could use their side access to work on the house but they never mentioned a full on scaffolding going in. They're garden is already wrecked so they're looking at least for a complete roll out lawn replacement.

Neighbour 2, an older single lady, received a call last Friday but again was given little or no detail and didn't realise the extent of what they were asking.

Ours is actually the least effected, when I got home it was just a single support in our garden with very little encroachment. To be honest when I initially started this thread I had a feeling that would be the case and I was more writing it from the perspective of the neighbour 2 as I really feel sorry for her.

All of us are planning on contacting the Dentist, who coincidently is "away" this week! Also has a history of disrupting neighbours before my time, so failure to ask is starting to look less surprising.

This project is a full on pitched attic roof (two rooms+) going onto a current flat roof so a sizeable project estimated to last 6-7 weeks (so they claim).

And just to picture it better these are small gardens, approximately 9-12 metres long. So this scaffolding is three stories tall and 9-10 metres from the rear of our houses so very very intrusive. Basically builders are eye level looking into my son and daughters bedrooms.

daheff

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121596401#Comment_121596401

This payment is not for compensation. Its for access and inconvenience. OP can't use their full property as somebody else is doing so, and there is a health & safety risk associated with it.

daheff

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121596568#Comment_121596568

dentist will only claim the cost of prsi.

no additional benefit for the op there as hes already entitled to a free check up.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121600933#Comment_121600933

You got the op’s eligibility of a free check up from their opening post?

Impressive.

MrRigsby

I wouldn’t bother contacting the dentist as he hadn’t the decency to contact you . Ring the owner of the scaffolding or builder (they usually advertise with a sign ) and tell them if it’s not removed that day you will sue them . Any debris or tools accidentally dropped from it could hit you or a family member in your garden and kill them . There is a reason hardhats are mandatory on building sites . They committed trespass when they erected it and are in breach of health and safety by putting it above an area in use by the public

GBX

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121600905#Comment_121600905

There was probably an assumption from the time they did their site survey, that they may or may not need access in your garden. That been said, permission should have been sought from all affected residents not just from 2 they asked.

as @MrRigsby says, there is the H&S element which cannot be overlooked nor understated to the contractor.