‘21 Leaf 40kw - very poor trade in value

Fastpud

Hi all,

Went to a couple of garages today looking to trade in my 2021 Leaf SVE and was offered really poor trade in value - best was €15k and worst was €13.5k. I was totally shocked, has the value of Leafs tanked that much.? I’m on PCP so have a final payment to make, leaving me with little value for deposit.

Leafs are much higher on CBG, most are over €20k for my car. Am I missing something , are the garages screwing me or is the Leaf that unsellable?

Thanks

godtabh

Garage needs to make profit. Not going to do that if they are going for €20k and you want €20k

Buddy Bubs

Is that chademo or CCS? If chademo I can understand low value, those chargers are disappearing from public infrastructure. You could look at buying it out if it suits you though.

User1998

They can be bought privately for as little as €18k on Donedeal so €15k as a trade in sounds about right. If you think you can get more for it then you could sell it privately.

ELM327

That sounds about right to be fair. The 40kWh leaf is seriously outdated in terms of range and charging methods by now, as well as being updated and semi-replaced by the Ariya so it's not really a current model anymore.

Orebro

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121356085#Comment_121356085

Is that really true though? ESB still putting in chademo at their sites, EasyGo also still doing chademo in new locations. In a funny kind of way you've more chance of not queuing at some sites as most others will be on CCS. Wouldn't buy a Leaf as a long distance cruiser anyway so it's a bit of a moot point.

@Fastpud it seems used EV values have taken a hammering in the last 12 months alright, heard of a few people with similar experiences. What was the gmfv on the Leaf?

ELM327

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121356394#Comment_121356394

As a leaf24 owner I can tell you not only are chademo stations being installed much less than CCS, chademo stations are actively being removed by ecars and replaced with ccs (eg waterford, galway). In additon, a lot of the new 150kW units don't work with the leaf.

Fastpud

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121356394#Comment_121356394

Unfortunately the GMVF is 13500 so I have no value at all for trade in 😩

I suppose I will have to drop a big cash deposit to start again.

I remember someone years ago on this forum saying that PCP was very risky for EVs as both the cars and the market was not mature at all.

Garzard

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058322172/21-leaf-40kw-very-poor-trade-in-value

I've no advice to offer as such unfortunately, but I have the same Leaf here (except for being a 222) and also on PCP with another year and a half left on it. When I noticed how far used prices had collapsed and did a Motorcheck value the other week, it came back as €18,000, so was also pretty dismayed.

I'd happily get rid of it for something that suits my needs better but I'm not really in a position right now to upfront the remaining difference on the PCP. As it's become outdated with the range and CHAdeMO, and I have no real interest in the Ariya (also don't want to go on another PCP) I feel the the best thing to do might be handing back the keys when it's up.

Comer1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121356681#Comment_121356681

Nothing wrong with PCP, if it suits your needs, especially if it's 0%. The issue here is the second hand market value of the Leaf (and many other EVs too).

Marcusm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121356681#Comment_121356681

It’s always going to be risky for niche cars and I suspect even newer Leafs like yours fall into that category.

unkel

The main reason many people bought a Leaf was that they financed it and got 0%. So it looked like a great deal on paper. But obviously that was done deliberately and now, a few years later, people are finding out why.

€15k as a trade in sounds pretty generous to me BTW

...Ghost...

Advertise it for 16k. Maybe someone will take it quickly before the end of the year and you wont be fluffing the pockets of the dealers. Throw it up for sale here too. Fact is, almost every car has taken a big hit recently. There's always a risk that with PCP, you go in with small change to the next one.

The new leaf prices were just reduced by 5k and have 0 percent finance so the used car prices have gone down. And there appear to be many second hand examples for sale.

Buddy Bubs

How much did the leaf cost in 2021? I think we are back to 50% depreciation in 3 years now for everything. Plenty of everything available now.

I got 17.5k back on a 22k Audi A6 last year after owning it for 4 years and 100k KMs almost, was delighted with that. But I think if I tried to move on my Born next year or the year after I'd be hammered. So thinking of moving it to herself and buying something new for myself. Sell her car which is older and worth less.

unkel

@Buddy Bubs - "I think we are back to 50% depreciation in 3 years now for everything"

No. Just for the Leaf 😂

Buddy Bubs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121358192#Comment_121358192

Wouldn't be laughing at a man losing a fortune on a car unkel.

unkel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121358203#Comment_121358203

Cars depreciate. Some more than others. Anyone asking here 3 years ago about what the depreciation on a Leaf would be, would have been told it would be far more than average. I have given that advice many times myself

And of course, anyone opting for 0% finance, knows full well it has to be paid in other ways. No such thing as a free lunch...

It's not like the buyer of the Leaf was unlucky or came upon misfortune, is it?

Padre_Pio

Worth noting that car depreciation was worse pre-Brexit.

Cars held value better after, then we hit COVID, chip shortage, and people were suddenly making a profit on 1 year old cars.

Anyone who thought that situation was sustainable was sorely mistaken.

I don't want to laugh at anyone, but EV tech is developing and there's a high possibility that owners are going to be left holding the bag when a newer technology comes along.

SteelyDanJalapeno

In this case PCP is a good insurance, if value fell below the gmfv you could just hand it back.

I don't think you should enter into a PCP deal expecting any surplus value over the gmfv at the end of the term, and should be treated as a bonus

Fastpud

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121358354#Comment_121358354

I think you are right, now anything over GMFV is bonus but it wasn’t always like that. Last two times I changed the car there was good trade in value - times have changed!

I’m looking at a Hyundai kona 2024 48kw, do people think that will hold value any better?

On a side note when handing back a car after PCP do they nail you for every little mark on the car, tyres, scratched alloys etc

...Ghost...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121358430#Comment_121358430

On a side note when handing back a car after PCP do they nail you for every little mark on the car, tyres, scratched alloys etc

This will depend on the extent of the damage, the dealer and what you are buying.

If you are just handing back the car and they have to spend resources bringing it back to saleable condition for a 3 year old car, you can expect a bill.

If you were buying something else from them, they would be more flexible I would imagine. If you can, sell it privately for 1 or 2k more than the dealership is offering. Better in your pocket.

kanuseeme

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121358430#Comment_121358430

The kona EV is/was over priced just look at the value of 2020 EV models, 20k for a 40k car, roughly the same price as the petrol versions, 23k new.

What is the cost of buying the leaf out right?

Surely its worth more to you than what you can get for it, some one else posted their friend was in the same scenario and they were going to hold onto the car,

I was reading Forbes and Tesla were going to cut prices again to keep sales up in china, putting pressure again on all makes.

cgc5483

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121358430#Comment_121358430

Have a look at what % of the Price the GMFV is. I was looking at the bigger 65 kw one and they were working off a GMFV of around 16000 which doesn't inspire confidence.

The other thing with PCP is that the 50% rule applies. Once you have paid more than 50% you can hand it back with completing the term. I looked at my contract and they included the grant in amount paid so you might find that returning it sooner may actually make sense.

joe1303l

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121358430#Comment_121358430

As times have changed in used car values, it might be wise to consider changing buying habits. Rather than give it away for peanuts, drive it away for a few more years or even into the ground. Spend your hard earned cash on something else.

unkel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121359889#Comment_121359889

If you fail to make the payments as per the contract you signed, will it not affect your credit rating?

Personally I feel financing cars is madness, I've never done it and never will. If I can't afford to buy the car I want, I save on for a little longer or I simply don't buy it!

cgc5483

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121360509#Comment_121360509

According to this it doesn't affect your credit rating (https://www.motorcheck.ie/blog/settling-early-on-a-hire-purchase-agreement/)

unkel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121360567#Comment_121360567

Thanks for the link. I would want that in writing though from the finance company before I would take that option. It makes no sense that if you default on a loan, it won't affect your rating. It should! If you defaulted on a loan to me, I'd never give you a loan again. Unless you are my wife of course 😂

cgc5483

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121360647#Comment_121360647

You haven't defaulted on the loan though. I checked my own PCP contract and it is clearly written that can hand back the car which terminates the agreement once 50% has been paid (gives exact figure).

Found an old thread here on it as well (https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2055601794/half-rule-hp-agreement/p1).

Flinty997

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121357837#Comment_121357837

What make makes a car niche. A leaf is still a decently ranged well equipped reliable car. A mini electric, a Honda E. An eGolf what?

It's this not all partly due to Tesla's price drop compressing the market beneath it.

What about people buying a used EV at the new market price where it's dropped 30-50% from new in 3 yrs is that risky?

If you are coming out of finance deal, PCP hasn't this been true in the past where the car is with less than expected.

The car industry over the past decade has had litany of issues with modern technologies, dpf, diesel gate, emissions, clutch's etc. Personally I was hoping an EV avoids much of that.

joe1303l

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121360949#Comment_121360949

Part of the “‘niche” aspect here is Nissan stubbornly not moving to CCS or even coming with a retrofit/adapter option. The Leaf has also ended up with a bad reputation for degradation on the early cars which isn’t helping. Bjorn has recently compared an early 24kWh eGolf with an early 24kWh Leaf. https://youtu.be/q7k_c2q_6ss?si=uhrw03j6taqaxXO0

zg3409

No ccs

No battery cooling impacting charging speed and degredation

Low efficiency at high speed

Many sold with smaller 40kWh rather that 60kWh which is standard.

Similar will apply to emini as bigger battery now an option. The initial battery was terribly small.

Flinty997

One of the options on the new emini is a 40kwh battery? eUp is 36kwh. Look at Bjorn with a 24kwh 9 year old golf.

https://youtu.be/q7k_c2q_6ss?si=SJNvX5omWT5u7fI6

I have no doubt range anxiety is a thing for new ev buyers. But it hasn't stopped the market getting to where it is today. It's an issue but it can't be what's causing the current poor values of trading in.

Marcusm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121360949#Comment_121360949

I just meant that when there are limited numbers of the car available secondhand then it is easier to have issues with the ultimate secondhand value as there may be insufficient buyers/sellers for true price transparency. A Leaf of that newness should be attractive to lots of people but there is a perception that range is everything, stupid as most stay local to their homes.

whippet

I traded a 211 leaf 40 SVE in April and was given a trade in value of €29.5k against a ex-demo EV of a different brand. that would give a bell weather indication of where EV trade in prices are. I know my father in law has had a similar experience with a 211 iD4 GTX .. was shopping around back in the spring and was being offered really good trade in values and now it is a totally different experience - the dealers are offering fractions of the value. I don't know if they are over stocked, can't sell 2nd hand EVs or what.

spakman

I was given estimates last week of 14k and 13.5k for 191 Kona 64kWh.

Earlier in the year, Tesla were offering 17.5k and I think they're acknowledged to offer below value.

slave1

Dealers will always chance their arm, give a car a wash and sell on with huge markup, there are plenty of current car owners that will not engage in selling a used car privately so dealers rightly profit from this.

Buddy Bubs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121362683#Comment_121362683

Yep supply and stocks are up. Another anecdote, but I know a guy that was massively lowballed on a q4 Etron 35 (which is an undesirable car to be fair)

denismc

A lot of second hand cars are bought on credit, the recent interest rate increases are starting to bite i'd say, prices for 2nd hand ICE cars seem to have dropped as well.

Also all those new ID4, Tesla, Hyundai sold in the last few years are entering the 2nd hand market about now with more to come in the new year.

So the supply issues of the last couple years are no longer affecting prices.

Its a tough time if you are a seller, but its great for anyone in the market for a 2nd hand E.V

joe1303l

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121362683#Comment_121362683

Generally dealers are overstocked and a lot of potential used EV buyers bought new EV’s in the last 2 years. (There was little value to be got in used EV’s until recently) UK imports of BEV’s and PHEV’s also starting to compound the issue. The tide has completely turned for used EV’s but some EV drivers got great deals up to now trading up from 1-2 year old EV’s into new ones for very little.