Alan Wake II

johnny_ultimate

(Search function is borked so sorry if there's already a thread - don't think there is!)

Out tomorrow and reviewing (mostly) well.

https://youtu.be/MEWgOlTIW4Y?si=xQvqW7uD4PJI-p5T

I wasn't a big fan of the original Alan Wake - a decent game, but ultimately pretty repetitive and one-note. But I think Remedy really finally started to fulfill some of the things they've been chasing for years with Control, so I'm very interested in AWII as it seems to push their aesthetic ambitions further again, including the likes of live-action footage integration.

Most importantly for now, it seems to perform well on consoles (a relief as Control was a bit of a disaster on that front) and push the boundaries of PC tech if you have the hardware. There had been some panic around the frankly restrictively high PC specs, but initial Digital Foundry analysis seems to suggest it actually scales better than the eyebrow-raising spec sheet suggests. Unfortunately an Epic Store exclusive for now, but I do believe Epic helped fund the game's production.

https://www.eurogamer.net/digitalfoundry-2023-alan-wake-2-on-playstation-5-remedy-raises-the-bar-for-visual-accomplishment-once-again

https://www.twitter.com/Dachsjaeger/status/1717528516739117498?s=20

Exclamation Marc

Another GOTY contender!

Cant wait.

Only downside is the lack of a physical release (and for me the backlog I'm gonna push through before buying it).

at the gates

Looks the business. Hoping it gets a few performance patches to make it more solid on ps5. Will definitely get it if i see it on sale on the ps store. Digital only unfortunately, didn't get a physical release.

Sephiroth_dude

Very interested in trying it, loved control, are control and alan wake connected in some way?

johnny_ultimate

While I’d always like a physical version for preservation reasons, at least Remedy has adjusted the price to reflect a digital only release - 50 quid is a lot more reasonable than the 60-70 quid norm these days.

recyclops

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121288576#Comment_121288576

In the same universe so it was wake, then wake DLC (not spin off) , then control and control DLC with wake in it.

Still have my SE from the original that looks like a book and came with a book. Best looking special edition I have. Sits on a bookcase 😂😂

at the gates

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121288583#Comment_121288583

Think it's 60 on the ps store? Not 100% on that but yeah better than the usual digital prices these days. Spider man 2 digital is 80 fuckin quid.

johnny_ultimate

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121288916#Comment_121288916

Oh sorry, seems to be 50 on PC and 60 on consoles. Regardless, still a notch below the standard AAA game pricing!

Ten of Swords

Is it going to be available on Steam eventually or is it perpetually an Epic exclusive on PC?

For example, Phoenix Point became available on Steam after 1 year of being Epic exclusive

johnny_ultimate

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289727#Comment_121289727

In the past, a year has indeed been the typical stretch of Epic exclusivity for third-party titles.

But it seems this one was fully funded by Epic and it's published by Epic, so hard to know if they'll adopt the same approach here. Could be exclusive indefinitely, as has been the case with Alan Wake Remastered.

johnny_ultimate

Played through the first chapter tonight. Very slow-burn, only one combat encounter (at the end - basically a tutorial) in two hours, and lots of exploration. But promising so far. Remedy has definitely grown in confidence with their presentation - lots of fantastic flourishes, and few studios use abrupt block capitals and live action footage quite so well :) Quite the opening as well - not every day the first playable character in a game...

Spoiler Warning

is bollock naked.

Playing on an RTX 3070 and the presentation is really impressive - proper next-gen tech. 60+ is definitely easily achievable with rasterised performance and DLSS. Looks great. But ray-tracing really improves the stability and depth of the image, especially in terms of shadows, reflections etc... The specs were right - low preset will get around 30 FPS in the forest areas, but I found I can go high with path-tracing in the Night Springs hub and still get a 40-60 FPS. It's the tree-heavy areas that really cause a big performance hit. I'd recommend pushing the ray-tracing in the Night Springs areas, even just to look around, as it really looks quite spectacular. It might be a rare game where the quality of the ray-tracing is worth the performance hit (obviously a lot more tolerable if you have a 40xx card and frame generation) but will see how I get on when the combat kicks off.

Thankfully the art direction, asset quality and cinematography mean it will look great regardless. Those path-traced reflections though... woah.

brady12

Few hours in & I thinks it's absolutely incredible . 10/10 so far . Atmosphere is class . Have to say iv been hardened towards horror games by playing evil within 1 & 2 and about 5 or 6 resi evils the last couple years & me not really being afraid but this game has me on edge a lot and terrified on and off .

Should I play Alan Wake 1 first? The remaster is only €9 until Monday.

I've played and completed Control, not that I can remember anything about the plot line!

recyclops

Wake one is a great game in its own right. Story is very good though combat does become repetitive.

johnny_ultimate

A bit further in and it's definitely picking up pace, although still very different to the original game - a lot more exploration than the combat-heavy original, at least so far.

When it gets into a groove, it's a massive step up from the original. The way they **** with reality and geography during the spookier sections is by far the best I've seen in a horror game - it all happens so fluidly, whether it's the unsettling smash cuts, the way the levels and lighting quietly (or not so quietly) morph around you, or the unpredictable movement of the enemies (some of whom have some very abrupt teleporting tricks up their sleeves).

Retr0gamer

Dogs

https://twitter.com/coolgoblinzone/status/1718392226336915505?t=zSPfnU8svR8GwGm1-ddYKg&s=19

Apart from looking amazing, this is a really well made story driven game.

The only thing I'm disappointed with is:

Spoiler Warning

that at the start I thought this was going to be a really good detective game, but actually you don't have to solve anything. The case board is just a recap of the game so far, presumably for those who leave the game for a while and come back.

recyclops

Yep it's quite hand holding in that respect but narrative and world creation is second to none really. MS should have kept onto remedy as exclusive really, the universe they have created between wake, control and quantum break is excellent the games are standard enough narrative wise but play like most third person narrative games.

Really enjoying the transitions with the lamp, similar enough to what blooper did in medium but impressed by the speed of it all

(Sam Lake really has SOME ego as well between playing Max Payne and in this the chap really loves himself)

one armed dwarf

The case board stuff is pretty weird. I don't love it, but some of it is optional. There's a lot of other cases in there that exist as a sort of additional commentary on plot developments.

I beat this just now, it's the most maximalist bit of video gaming in a while. They really put every thing they could think to put in a game in it. I know they love doing multimedia type stuff at Remedy but this might be the most intertextual sort of game I've ever played. Written word, films, TV, the written word all integrated into the non-linear hyperlinked structure of a multithreaded video game narrative where you bounce between two different realities progressing storylines at your own pace. Deciding when you want to change the flavor of the game as you go.

AWI was compared to Twin Peaks a lot, I dunno I never played it (I tried a bit and it was fairly shite). This is definitely closer to the style of Twin Peak's third season. Some will (justifiably) call it very self indulgent and bloated (which it is). But if you're on board with the things it's doing it's going to be one of those types of game you'll be lucky if we actually ever see again.

So if multi-layer realities and fractured identities are your type of thing you need to play this

My interested is starting to wane. I don't think I'm that far into the game and already the Dark Place is starting to grate on my nerves. I haven't gotten over my initial disappointment that you're not actually solving a murder mystery and I just haven't been grabbed by the dark mystery surrounding the Dark Place. It feels like its trying too hard to be too mysterious and reminds me of the Lost TV series where it becomes apparent there is actually nothing behind the mystery. I feel I've really lost trust and am not going to be rewarded in any way , either by interesting revelations in the story or by any rewarding gameplay.

There is lots to like about the game. It does scary moments very well, i mean it doesn't get any scarier than wandering around the dark with a tourch and the fantastic graphics really add to the realism. I love the snippets of real acting, the way it integrates so well with the game is a big evolution from Quantum Break. But gameplay is sparse and light and the world feels very empty, with many NPC's being nothing more than maequinns when you approach them (attempts to claim this is part of the story do not help to make it anymore enjoyable).

In the end, after initially misleading me into thinking this was going to be a fantastic rainy noir murder mystery the story has just failed to grab my attention.

Some weird mysterious dark power where fiction becomes reality? Ok not a.bad idea. But come on, this is no Never-ending Story level of story telling. Come on Alan, write up some interesting characters I can interact with!

Sephiroth_dude

I'm loving the game, I think it's a work of art and contender for GOTY for me, I just started Alan's first chapter.

Retr0gamer

3/5 from Eurogamer, same as metro game central. They'd a lot of positive to say about it but sounds like theres definitely some flaws there.

johnny_ultimate

I’m around five hours in. TBH the game isn’t ‘perfect’ - what is? - but it’s infinitely more interesting stylistically and presentationally that virtually any AAA or AA game made in the last decade. I don’t say that lightly, but anyone remotely interested in video games as a visual medium should be playing this. It’s an exceedingly rare example of modern tech (from fast loading to pathtracing) being used to fulfill a studio’s most ambitious storytelling and tonal goals, rather than just ‘ooh isn’t that pretty’ (although, to be clear, the global illumination and reflections are exceptionally pretty).

Obviously it has its limitations and issues, from some overwrought writing to gameplay limitations (although thankfully it’s a lot more interesting than the original, even if the so-so investigation stuff won’t be troubling Obra Dinn’s deduction crown any time soon). Like most things Lynchian, it can’t hope to reach the heights of the man himself operating at his best. But I’m pretty engrossed in it, and I’m finding it a rich and engaging culmination of everything Remedy has been trying to do for decades. I think, finally, they have to tech and skills to pull it all off.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121304564#Comment_121304564

I agree, it is most definitely a very polished presentation of the developers artistic vision and I am really enjoying having my PC's abilities pushed to the max (or to the "medium" as that's the setting I'm settled on). I'm on a 6800XT so alas no RT for me, it absolutely kills the fps. But even without RT it is a visual masterpiece and it really contributes to the games atmosphere. What Remedy have done with the medium really is fantastic and sets a new bar in video games, from a graphical and artistic expression point of view.

Scandinavian cheesiness and weirdness and dark mystery is well and good and you compare it to something from David Lynch, I can see that comparison. But I'm not sure I'd even enjoy playing a David Lynch video game. If this is a story driven game, which I think this is (albeit quite an artistic themed story) then it needs a stronger story. For example I think they could have conjured up some interesting characters to interact with instead of picking up manuscripts.

I am 8 hours in and having said all that I do feel the urge to finish the game. So there is something there to drive me on. But I think it is down to the fantastic graphics and artistic expression rather than having any urge or interest in how the story is going to unfold or anything to do with enjoyable gameplay mechanics.

I don't need this to be my GOTY to acknowledge that it is a point in video game history. It's refreshing that it has taken the discussion back to video games as an art and medium and not being dominated by optimization issues. I know some tried when the recommended specs came out but the game really shut the door on that topic as soon as it was released.

one armed dwarf

A truly 'Lynchian' video game is an impossible construction anyway as you can't really implement the free-flowing dream-like logic out of something as rigid as a computer program. It's inevitably going to be something more diluted and straight forward.

The closest you will ever see to any of that stuff is the FMV dabbling Remedy gets into. They get a lot better at it in AWII, hope it's something they keep doing

Completed this today. I think the story redeemed itself the more it progressed and in the end it turned out to be a very enjoyable game, on top of the magnificent craftmanship.

johnny_ultimate

Played through some of the middle chapters of Alan's section tonight and wow the game really goes places with its live-action footage integration. Delightfully playful stuff, sometimes pure spectacle and sometimes outright disorientating in the perspective trickery.

Jason Schreier notes on this week's Triple Click that Lance Reddick was meant to play Mr Door before he passed away. Would've loved to see him perform some of that stuff, although David Harewood does a great job.

Love the environment-changing mechanics too - always a sense of dread when changing a room to a more sinister plot device.

Had a few glitches as well tonight, though - fell through the floor at the same spot in the hotel a couple of times. Can easily see why an SSD is mandatory, but even then it feels like it's working overdrive here and there to keep things flowing.

Lance Reddick was meant to play Mr Door

I was wondering that but then I felt that was a bit racist to assume 😅

That ties it to Quantum Break in some way. Although I do not remember anything about the plot in that game.

one armed dwarf

Was reading that there's quite a few links to QB in the game, tho I've not played that game to know for sure. Makes you think tho that they might be intending to make it part of the overall continuity but can't right now due to not having its rights.

Big question going forward will be how do they keep these games integrated into an overall continuity without turning it into an MCU type of situation where it becomes offputting and everything feels like homework. Control 2 should try and setup a new angle that's fairly distant from the AW stuff imo

I'm not going to read too much into the connected universe. The.connections are quite vague, at most insignificant. I do think there is an overall grand story that will eventually come to a conclusion. But AW2 does not hide the fact that it takes homage from all the horror genres (book, film and game) that came before. As part of that, the intentional vagueness takes inspiration from the likes of Twin Peaks and (unfortunately) Lost, where it is mystery and weirdness for the sake of mystery and weirdness and nothing else.

Ending spoiler warning:

Spoiler Warning

But there is a glimmer of hope. I do like how AW2 ended with the loop being a spiral and his wife saying he is making progress, suggesting to me that the story will become less dark. If my interpretation is right, I think this is a very unique way to progress the story with Alan escaping by travelling up the spiral, progressing away.from the darkness.

It would offer something original to the video games. The last thing we need is more mysteriously dark and vague sequels.

But I will wait for people to point out the errors in my interpretation 😀

adrian522

Unless I'm missing something it seems buggy as hell.

Spoiler Warning

Basically I died and trying to get back to where I was I end up trying to solve this "Light Puzzle" in chapter 2 that I'd already done but seems not to be possible second time around.

Only option seems to be to go back to a previous save point but my last manual save is hours back.

recyclops

Playing last night after the KT taylor fight and it was the chapter in the old folk home.

Earphones in a dark room, that was probably the scariest thing I have played all year. Proper jump scares and great tension building.

Penn

Been playing a bit, making my way through the train station section. Enjoying the style and vibe of a lot of the game, but just not really liking the gameplay.

Not sure if I'll continue.

Penn

Decided to keep going and made it through a few more chapters. Thinking of dropping it down to Story Difficulty though. I just really dislike the combat in the game.

I'm enjoying the experience of the game, but the enemies are far more annoying than they are difficult, and both the flashlight and the general gunplay just don't feel that great.

johnny_ultimate

I actually quite like the gunplay, as it's channelling a particular mode of clunky, slow survival horror shooting that I think works quite well, even if the game isn't particularly difficult.

But I agree re: the torch. The 'boost' feels satisfying but to me it seems like they got the resource mix wrong, as you're almost afraid to use it because it drains battery so fast. I believe the resources are semi-randomised, so you will find what you need when you need it - including another pack of batteries. But still, it just feels like you're sort of discouraged from using the torch too liberally, despite it being the central component of the combat.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121440156#Comment_121440156

I wouldn't mind the shooting if not for the Shadow the Hedgehog Taken who zip back and forth or then split into two. That's when it just becomes an annoyance.

And as for the flashlight, for me the boost either doesn't fully damage them like it should half the time (especially trying to hit the speed taken) or in Alan's section where you can waste an entire flashlight on fake shadows, and then the one you don't check ends up being the one to knock you on your hole.

And that's my issue with it, the combat isn't difficult, it can just be annoying.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121440811#Comment_121440811

Took me a while to realise you're not supposed to attack them all with the flashlight. You're supposed to wait until you get barged. It's all part of the anxiety and suspense.

one armed dwarf

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121440811#Comment_121440811

With enemies like this I think the point isn't to engage in a reactionary back and forth, even on PC it's hard to line up those shots. Your character has a lot of 'startup' frames for every action. You're not supposed to be able to get off those potshots on the fast enemies

The point is more to put down pressure in the form of flares and stuff, which slow them right down. Or use the shotgun a lot. The game rubberbands resources so whatever you use will be returned to you almost instantly in some cases so there's no point in being too frugal about it. Especially with flares, they really want you to use them.

With Alan's enemies, I think some of the shadows might have little tells that show if they are violent or passive but I don't really know to be honest. Either way tbh, I enjoy getting baited and thrown on my ass, I'm fine with getting it wrong sometimes

Penn

I've gotten through almost all Alan's sections now as far as I know. To be honest, I just started running past shadows as much as possible. Even when attacked I just leg it, or in the few sections where I've had to fight, it's Flare Gun City.

The combat in the game just isn't for me, and that's grand. I'm willing to just plow through at this stage to finish the game off.

johnny_ultimate

Finally got around to finishing it.

Listen, the game's problems are obvious. The story and writing are all over the shop - good, intriguing ideas mixed with loads of repetition and odd tangents. The combat is mostly fine but most definitely plagued with little annoyances and quirks. Navigation of the open, forested areas can be quite confusing - a mix of busy map design and dense visuals. The game undoubtedly could've used a tighter edit, and is full of in-jokes and self-referential bits - some undeniably cool, some which overstay their welcome.

And yet... it features a lot of the absolute coolest **** I've ever seen in a video game. Some impeccable direction, set piece design and - especially in the back half - creepy bits. The integration of live-action footage is Remedy finally fulfilling something they've been trying since the Max Payne days, and obviously doubled down on with stuff like Quantum Break and Control. It's probably on a technical level the most advanced video game I've ever played (seriously - with ray and path tracing cranked up, this thing is peerless) but more importantly it has a bunch of fantastic visual and presentational ideas to go with it. I said it earlier in the thread, but if you have any interest in visual design, this is a must-play. Hard to even describe how great some of this stuff looks, with seamless or at least bold integration of live-action footage with real-time gameplay. It's hard to even describe - just go play it if you're curious.

And for all those minor annoyances with things like combat and exploration, it does plenty right in those departments too! Things like the nursery rhyme puzzles and words of power are fun, interesting collectibles, with nice aesthetic ideas to accompany them. Alan's 'change the story' powers are really cleverly employed - there are times when you're standing in the right spot, and the way the new version of the level kicks in after a *just right* build-up can be deliciously bleak (again, a good example of modern tech being used with purpose). While the story does meander, it hits some key plot beats very well indeed, and I quite liked the endgame sequences and ending itself - other than a slightly frustrating enemy rush and another need for a bit of fat trimming. As... undisciplined as some of the writing is, I also found its wild mix of references intriguing - it's much less of a straight pastiche than the original, and instead dives right into the weirder side of its inspirations (like Stephen King's eccentric take on a connected storytelling universe).

Again, there are undeniable issues here, and personally I had a couple of annoying tech hiccups too - namely a few occasions in the back half of the game when textures didn't load properly, necessitating a game restart to fix (I believe it's related to saving your game at coffee thermoses). But it's also one of the wildest, most intriguing games of this scale I've played - for every point I'd dock it for rough edges, I'd give it two for sheer ambition and craftmanship. It's self-indulgent, messy and overstuffed - but it's those while still being brave, bold and often thrilling.

Penn

Finished this last night. I still stand by my comments on the combat, and even in the last few chapters, I just repeatedly legged it where possible.

But the thing that got me through the game was the story and presentation. It can definitely be self-indulgent, too self-referential to games even outside of Alan Wake 1, and can be horribly over-written at times (particularly in Saga's mind palace where every clue or question leads to a slight variation of a similar answer you already got, or a lot of the echoes in Alan's sections though I get why they're like that). When the story beats work though, it's an astounding achievement in game design and direction, how it blends live-action, performances and set-pieces to provide truly incredible sequences. I also think a lot of the mechanics such as using the plot points to change the environment around you work really well.

It's a fantastic game, and I think earns a lot of the praise and GOTY nods it's getting. But for me, I enjoyed it far more as an experience than as a game, and I nearly wish it had been more of a puzzle-type game than the combat, or at least a better balance between those.

Grumpypants

I've been playing for around 8 hours now. Just got into the coffee shopping coffee world.

Really enjoying it. Just the right balance of exploring to get stuff and moving the story along.

apache

Gonna treat myself to it for Xmas. I enjoyed the first one.

Grumpypants

Just finished "the song" part. That's up there with the best / most unexpected sequences I've played.

There's a new Alan Wake 2 ending along with an NG+ mode

https://www.alanwake.com/story/unveiling-the-final-draft-new-game-plus-for-alan-wake-2/

Grumpypants

Wrapped it up this morning. Fantastic game, loved pretty much all of it. Only bits that got frustrating were the fast close combat parts where you had to reload, swap weapons and dodge. But I think there was only two of those and I just dropped the difficulty to story for that section and then put it back up.

New Game + is actually something that works really well within the context of the game's story. It's another "loop". Even the opening sequence has changed and you see it from another perspective with your new understanding of what everyone is doing.

apache

So I went to buy and download this earlier to have over the Xmas. It's only available for playstation 5? I have a 4 pro. Very disappointing as I enjoyed the first one. I'm only a casual gamer but wondering does this happen much? Games only available for latest console? I don't play enough to justify buying one.

johnny_ultimate

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121531189#Comment_121531189

Yep it’s next (or current) gen only - and one of the games that pushes the new consoles hardest.

PS4 is an increasingly obsolete console for new releases - only a small amount of new releases will make it onto it at this stage.

apache

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121531226#Comment_121531226

I didn't know that. I just renewed my subscription because I think it's worth it for the free monthly games alone. But yes I'm behind the times.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121531245#Comment_121531245

Once you go past about 2 years of a new console coming out, very few of the new bigger games come out on the old console. Usually just the more franchise type of games like the annual sports games. Mostly because newer games really start using the advanced performances and features of the new consoles and they just can't really be optimised for older consoles.

johnny_ultimate

Played through 'The Lake House' DLC. Quite short - not much longer than two hours, possibly even shorter if you're not being thorough - and nothing special but a nice little self contained chapter nonetheless. But it's definitely more a mini Control sequel, albeit using AWII mechanics and a more horror tint to proceedings. If you liked Control, I'd give it a go - it contains some overt sequel teases, but the environment you're exploring is very Oldest House. The game still looks remarkable, and runs smoother for sure than when I first played it thanks to the various updates.

Still haven't gotten to Night Springs but been saving that, so will get around to it in the coming weeks.