Has Paddy Cosgrave overstepped the mark?

Charles Babbage · 21-10-2023 1:53pm

Amazon becomes latest tech giant to pull out of Web Summit (msn.com)

Cosgrave is exactly the type of person who would give one of his employees a hard time if he or she expressed pro-Israeli views or anything else that did not agree with his current rant. So he should have thought about what his counterparts in big organisations would do.

unkel · 21-10-2023 1:54pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121266924#Comment_121266924

That depends. Not necessarily, see my definition.

BTW according to the more trustworthy sources like BBC verify, on the balance of probabilities the hospital got accidentally bombed by Palestinian terrrorists, not by the IDF. I'm keeping an open mind on this until there is more proof.

Peter Flynt · 21-10-2023 1:57pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121266986#Comment_121266986

Yeah. . . sure you're keeping an open mind.

circadian · 21-10-2023 2:27pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121266986#Comment_121266986

What definition, and why does yours carry more weight than what is agreed by the UN and international community? UN run schools have been hit, that is a clear breach. The bombing is without regard for surrounding areas or civilians. Several places of worship have been destroyed either directly or indirectly. These are clear breaches.

unkel · 21-10-2023 2:32pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121267186#Comment_121267186

It's a war, innocent civilians get killed. As long as the civilians weren't the target and the number of civilian casualties weren't disproportional, there is no war crime. The latter is a flexible term, if combatants operate from the midst of civilians, even using hostages and / or human shields, there doesn't seem to be any restriction

circadian · 21-10-2023 2:45pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121267220#Comment_121267220

2.b.iv

"Intentionally launching an attack in the knowledge that such attack will cause incidental loss of life or injury to civilians or damage to civilian objects or widespread, long-term and severe damage to the natural environment which would be clearly excessive in relation to the concrete and direct overall military advantage anticipated;"

https://www.un.org/en/genocideprevention/war-crimes.shtml

unkel · 21-10-2023 3:07pm

@circadian - exactly. Excessive is the key word here. From jurisprudence this is very flexible when combatants operate from within civilian areas / use human shields, which is likely the case here.

An example of when a bombing clearly is a war crime is dropping the atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki when the aim was to kill civilians

Peter Flynt · 21-10-2023 3:09pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121267220#Comment_121267220

Bombing a hospital is targeting civilians, many of them children.

Thanks for confirming a war crime.

circadian · 21-10-2023 3:26pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121267347#Comment_121267347

Has there been any evidence that the Israeli targets actually took out tunnels, weapons caches or high value targets? I've seen a handful of high value targets killed but beyond that, nothing. Claiming that they're human shields deprives them of their victimhood, it just equates them as collateral, another number and it's ok because the multiple civilian deaths were justified because there was the potential to slightly weaken Hamas.

In fact, there is documented evidence of IDF soldiers using Palestinians as human shields in the past.

https://www.hrw.org/news/2010/11/26/israel-soldiers-punishment-using-boy-human-shield-inadequate

They also have prior form, https://mondoweiss.net/2014/07/military-destroyed-hospital/

Not to mention countless denials, cover ups and subsequent admission of killing journalists, UN peacekeepers etc all in contravention of the Geneva Convention.

Strazdas · 21-10-2023 3:30pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121267347#Comment_121267347

A "war crime" can be any time that civilians are killed or injured as a result of military action, depending on the circumstances.

The human shields excuse is used by every terrorist group and terrorist state to justify their killing of civilians.

helimachoptor · 21-10-2023 4:03pm

He’s resigned

Thelonious Monk · 21-10-2023 4:10pm

I'm out of the loop with this fellow. Why does erbody dislike him?

Luxembourgo · 21-10-2023 4:21pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121266947#Comment_121266947

Nope, it's cos he actively encouraged online pile ons on Twitter. It's almost poetic.

Beefcake82 · 21-10-2023 4:22pm

"Unfortunately my personal comments have become a distraction from the event, and our team, our sponsors, our startups and the people who attend."

Guy is an absolute pillock, clearly used the web summit every year to promote his "personal feelings" on global matters and now its come back to bite him in the ass. I doubt him resigning is going to stop others boycotting web summit, not bringing back those that already backed out.

SouthWesterly · 21-10-2023 4:22pm

Paddy has resigned as CEO according to the Indo

Field east · 21-10-2023 4:47pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121266986#Comment_121266986

I assume that any projectile that is fired leaves fragments after it and which can be verified from it as to the type of missile it is , manufactured by who and therefor - more than likely- who fired it. I am surprised therefor why Hamas did not come out with such information within hours. Or maybe it did not matter anyway because it got the ideal reaction ie international condemnation against Israel and loads of demonstrations. And if Hamas did provide evidence re missile fragments - sure they could be from any missile fired by Israel at some other target.. I found it of interest the Hamas did not allow anyone near the bombed site in the first few days - most especially the media

Field east · 21-10-2023 4:56pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121267592#Comment_121267592

His resignation means nothing. He, for example, still hold onto his shares, attend ALL company meetings, have a big influence , more than likely on who his replacement will be, have a continuous ‘quiet word’ in his replacement’ and other influencers’ ears , etc, etc, etc, etc. look how he operates re DITCH. He might have a bit more time to spend on the operations of Ditch. So watch out Google Siemens, Meta, etc, etc.

Kermit.de.frog · 21-10-2023 4:58pm

I would be much more concerned about SF being in government mouthing off now than I was a few days a go.

What happened to Paddy is that he finally interacted with the real world whether anyone likes it or not.

Peter Flynt · 21-10-2023 5:55pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121267587#Comment_121267587

Because they're all FF or FGers or cronies thereof. He also points out blatant corruption which is never investigated by mainstream media. It ain't complicated.

Ardillaun · 21-10-2023 6:04pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121263849#Comment_121263849

It’s a huge and unnecessary risk to take. He has enough wars of his own to fight without wading into those he has no business in.

Varik · 21-10-2023 6:05pm

There's a difference between government and main opposition when it comes to these types of opinions. The opposition can be ignored generally.

You see some big swings from other countries being reported in the news (generally in the news media that'd agree with them) but when you look at it it's just a member of the opposition, generally the blow black for the country is minimal or non existent.

Spain's had their elections a few months ago but while the opposition were ahead in seat but they'd not the number to make a government and now the former and current caretaker government is trying to appeal to a bunch of tiny far left independence parties. So we're getting very strong comments from them about Palestine. So I can see them getting a lot of blow back if it continues when the government is formed.

Francis McM · 21-10-2023 6:13pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121267702#Comment_121267702

Correct. Only a few days ago Mary Lou McD gave a speech in which she accused Israel of "carpet bombing".

In her speech she began : "Israels carpet bombing devasted Gaza's medical infrastructure, ".

How could the explosion she talked about, which turned out to leave a crater 3 feet by one feet maximum , "cripple the ability of Palestinians to help the injured, the sick and the dying", as she claimed in her speech?

She said " Yet Israel believes that it has the right to bomb hospitals". What proof has she of that, as all evidence points to the fact it was a Hamas missile and not a Israeli missile, which would have left a much bigger crater?

As I said before, it is bad enough she seemingly does not know what carpet bombings it, ( given that the military wing of SF planted most, probably well over 99%, of the 16,200 bombs during the troubles. Just one of those for example, the Bishopsgate bomb, caused £350 million worth of damage (equivalent to about £700 million in 2023), he is making matters even more embarrassing for herself by not admitting to her mistake on her facebook page, and by having the audacity to lecture the rest of us on carpet bombing / morality.

What would our American multinationals think of her / her government ( if we have one), given they have boycotted the web summit over Paddy Cosgraves remarks?

I do not think Uncle Jo, who lit the white house in Israeli colours, or even the French, who lit the Efeil tower flag colours, would think too kindly of SF or even our Presidents utterances.

Just my thoughts, anyone agree?

unkel · 21-10-2023 6:17pm

@circadian - "Has there been any evidence that the Israeli targets actually took out tunnels, weapons caches or high value targets?"

Evidence of results isn't required, evidence of intention does matter. Obviously if there is evidence of results or even just evidence of legitimate targets being there, that would help the case of actor who did the bombing

But to answer your question directly, didn't Hamas acknowledge a few times when some of their leaders were killed? Although I hasten to add that I find "evidence" or statements from both sides highly questionable without independent verification

BlueSkyDreams · 21-10-2023 6:17pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121267915#Comment_121267915

All very true, but we have entered an age where the price of Free Speech is to be Cancelled.

Ironically, but predictably, we were able to speak more freely, before we enabled our right to Free Speech.

Clo-Clo · 21-10-2023 6:19pm

A big blow for Sinn Fein with Paddy having to resign.

It's not an apology either that he published, it was damage control by his PR team.

hotmail.com · 21-10-2023 7:16pm

It's very difficult to dispute or go against the established American view.

As stated above, let's see Sinn Fein behave when they get into government. If they go against America, it looks like they bail out.

Strazdas · 21-10-2023 7:20pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121268249#Comment_121268249

Not just the established American view, but more specifically the pro-Israel lobby in western politics and in huge corporations.....it looks like they are massively influential.