Not happy with new Quartz worktop 😢

zipee

Talk me in off a ledge here. My worktops arrived today. This is my one go at my dream kitchen. I LOVE the shape of it but it’s just not what I picked or expected 😢

I picked a worktop with little or no veins as I don’t like them. I know stone can differ but the sample is BS!!

photos attached of sample and actual. I know first world problems here. I am trying to like it but really sample is like false advertising!

lmk123

Completely different, sorry to say it but I hate what they fitted but that’s just me, I waited 3 months for tiles and they then tried to give me different ones, thankfully I noticed before I left the shop, they had a display up of the ones I ordered, the ones they were trying to give me were completely different, even a different size, spent an hour and a half arguing with the owner he eventually gave in and said they still didn’t know when the correct ones would be in, I’d bet any money that’s different quartz but sorry to say I think you haven’t a hope of any recourse, I’m guessing everything paid up front and signed a form saying that you accept there may be variations etc etc

lintdrummer

Not much help to you now, but we just had a kitchen fitted and we went to see the slab of stone in the workshop before we committed to it. We got Dekton, which is a man made product by Silestone, so there is no surprises in what you end up getting.

I would to talk to your kitchen supplier and tell them you're not happy, and that the sample doesn't represent the full product accurately. You've nothing to lose.

Sarn

Sorry, but I also wouldn't be happy. I’d agree that the sample is not representative. We also went for white quartz with a very subtle grain. As with lintdrummer, we just happened to view full slabs before choosing which helped make our choice. In our case the small sample reflected what we got.

awec

The way the marbling appears to run in straight lines across the stone really doesn't help, it doesn't look great IMO. Around the sink also looks terrible IMO.

I would also be very unhappy, and I would push this hard. The sample is not even a tiny bit reflective of what they've given you.

Duvet Day

I definitely wouldn't be happy with it, the back of the sink is the worse part imo, I think you'll have to go back and insist on a change, it's definitely not comparable with the sample.

You're kitchen design and colour is really gorgeous, I hope you can get this sorted without too much hassle. Stand your ground with them as I'm sure it cost a lot ,best of luck with it.

sydthebeat

i must admit, i quite like that, especially the "whoosh" shape coming up off the hob

it looks a lot more 'natural stone' than some of the quartz tops you see with thread vein like contrasts running through it. i much prefer the bigger contrasts which actually show the different layers of the stone

its natural stone, you have to expect some changes. but that being said, the contrast is very different from the sample which is more stippled than layered.

geotrig

yeah around the sink seems to carry the most of the marbling and its seems to be even more magnified by the splash backs being as bad or the same effect .Its a lovely kitchen and I can understand the frustation (i've looked at it from a perspective of wanting a plain finish) but if they company are really digging their heals in maybe a compromise on the splash-backs although the marbling around the sink might not look great next to a very clean piece either

893bet

Kitchen still looks well I would try putting your bits and pieces that are going to be normally stored on the surface in place (little, bread bins etc).

Hard to see them replacing unfortunate. It’s above the small claim court amount also. So difficult for you to get traction assuming you are fully paid which I assume you are already.

10-10-20

It's funny - it's divisive. I have to admit that I think it looks edgy and if I had decided on having that pronounced vein within the product then I would have been delighted with that end-result.

That is... except the sample does not represent the end-result. The vein is too strong, too directional and too contrasting. Not wanting to be sexist on the point, but I believe that my wife and many other wives would be in a similar position as she poured over the samples of a much plainer quartz for what seemed to be an eternity, and had the product arrived out with that level of variation from the expected image within her mind, then there would have been tears.

That aside, it's still a beautiful piece of work, but maybe just not to your liking.

HeidiHeidi

I got a granite worktop, and I wanted plain black (or as plain as I could get) - I went to the company and picked an actual slab that was used for the worktop. That's neither here nor there for you though.

I'm really not a fan of the "busy" stone look - but I really like your kitchen despite that! Agreed it's nothing at all like the sample you were given - but I wonder could you put that aside and look at it just as is and get to like it? It's very dramatic with the "swoosh" up behind the hob, and diagonally across the stepped bit of the countertop!

I wouldn't have picked it for sure - but I definitely think I'd be keeping it.

I would agree that it's very unlikely they'll replace it as that stone is now practically unusable unless they can find uses for very small bits.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121107321#Comment_121107321

I'd be fairly confident that it is not actually different. So I'll take that bet if you're offering 😁

lmk123

😂I’m broke so no, You could be right, might just be a poor sample or something, probably no way of proving it either way as the supplier will say it’s the same anyway

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058313620/not-happy-with-new-quartz-worktop

Samples for stone and solid surfaces are made by cutting up larger slabs into small pieces. If it's a consistent, homogenous material, then the sample is too. But when the material undulates, whether natural or artificial, the samples obviously will too.

The sample you picked has two colours that appear organically/randomly. That's a pretty good indication that the whole slab will have variation. Picking the actual slabs as suggested above is best, but at the very least it's critical to see photos of full slabs, and it installed if possible.

Looks terrible to be honest.

I'm not sure what you can do.

blackbox

If you don't like it, you need to replace it rather than have it annoying you for the next 20 years.

I don't think you can expect the supplier to replace it for free as parts of what was installed are like the sample.

I presume you have already told them you are unhappy with it. It might be worth asking if they'll negotiate a reasonable deal to replace it.

jonnybravo

Looks like a poor sample. The below is similar to what you got.

https://www.ocallaghansfireplaces.ie/product/ashford-grey/

ThreeGreens

For what it's worth, if I picked that sample, what you got is not what I would have expected.

What you got has two distinct areas. Some very dark and some very light. The sample is only very light so not representative of the final product in my opinion.

Someone mentioned that you'll be annoyed looking at it for the next 20 years. They are probably right. I'd go back and complain bitterly. If they don't agreed to replace it, then I'd speak to a solicitor to get an opinion on if you have a case or not. Probably worth a simple letter from the solicitor. At least they will see that you are seriously upset and not just disappointed.

chooseusername

Change the backsplash and maybe the upstand as well, and add a splash of colour. I think it links the dark base units and the light colour wall units very well.

skinny90

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121109892#Comment_121109892

yup id agree here...

If I was a manager / owner id take the hit or agree at a compromise figure as a lesson learned case.

Going forward, If customer wants to go with a similar stone again, reps should be warning customers about the likely hood of the stone changing...

At the same time they could lean back and say no

If I owned a kitchen company irrespective of whether it falls short on a legal issue to change it

I will not want any negative publicity of what you have experience.

Push the ball in their court and see what they say

Goldengirl

I like it .

As other posters said a) its natural stone so there will be variation in the slab and they do generally say this as a disclaimer. And b) it links the two colours of your units very well.

But you did not get what you thought you were ordering .

Don't know if you have any comeback here , sorry .

You can try , the sample is a very poor representation but is probably of a different part of the slab you got. They might change it for you , but it's a punt .

If not tell them you are taking it further and get on to the small claims if they don't oblige you , but they do say in the small print that the samples don't always match the full slab.

If not try and live with it ... its beautiful and might be much loved once you get over that first look/ feeling of loss for the worktop you had planned in your head .

Leg End Reject

It looks like mould growth to me. I'd be on to the supplier trying to get it replaced at a reasonable price.

Lovely kitchen otherwise!

legend99

As an aside, and without upsetting you more, that socket is very close to the sink? Maybe someone qualified could help out and confirm distance requirements but better safe than sorry with electrics...

RainInSummer

I like it a lot. Well ware.

For me the difference is how light in color the sample is, and how dark the fitted top is, you are losing the desired contrast with the darker coloured wood units. Personally I wouldn’t be happy with it, I know the sample can just be indicative, but the sample and the fitted top are just too different. Like others have said, when we had a kitchen fitted some years back, the kitchen maker arranged for us to view the actual slab before it was cut, and sign off on it.

Out of interest, what is the shade of blue used in the units, I’ve seen a lot of this color recently in advertised homes.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121109056#Comment_121109056

It's very easy to prove tbh. I was able to confirm it in a few seconds be googling the specification of the finish. Was also posted above.

When you see the full slabs there is very very obvious veining like in the OPs kitchen.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121109342#Comment_121109342

That looks exactly like what OP got. And matches the spec on the sample. It's pretty obvious that when that 2000mm long slab is cut up into 100mm samples, there is going to be dark sections and light sections - neither of which represent the overall slab. The onus is on the person picking the finish to look at the overall.

@zipee , you've made an understandable mistake, these situations are an example of the value a professional brings. I've no idea how the conversation went, but find it crazy that you placed an order with out seeing the other images on the finish on the website -either through your own research or them sales rep literally pointing them out.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121112671#Comment_121112671

Reading some of the comments. I think there's lesson learned for the posters who are clearly not really aware of stone/surface samples work.

The company most likely provides images of the full slabs, as well as pictures of finishes projects. On commercial sample approved is a very specific and important stage. That obviously didn't happen here. He could of course chance his luck with getting it swapped. But he'd want to try prove the rep failed to be clear on what what he was selecting.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121123508#Comment_121123508

For the sake of accuracy, It's not natural stone. It's synthetic and made to have variation like natural stone.

The small claims court would be a very hard pathway. I probably wouldn't advise that, as it's more likely to cost more month and achieve little. there was a error made when researching finishes, very hard to put that on the company.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121124460#Comment_121124460

Small claims court costs €30, no solicitor costs involved. It is designed to be a very simple pathway.

As I said above, kitchen maker arranged for us to go to countertop provider to view slab before it was cut, I’m not sure if op was instructed to do that. Certainly there is a vast difference between the sample and the fitted countertop.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121124501#Comment_121124501

I'm aware the fees are minor. But there are other time/cost investment for the OP. If somebody needs to take a day off work to attend, get a report by a professional etc. These costs add up. When there is a valid claim, there smalls claim court is hugely valuable in recouping losses. But I struggle to see where the supplier is at fault here.

I always view the full slabs. For some stones, maybe from photos. For Marbles I select them in person. As I said above, a sample is a piece of a large slab cut into small pieces. There is never an indication a sample is representative of a whole slab - for obvious reasons. If the supplier sold the material based on only that one sample it's one thing. But that's not what happens.

Looking at a supplier of a similar stone, in the specification page they have photos of full slab as well as the below. This looks very close to the images .This is what their specification and advertising material shows. If the OPs supplier has anything similar, then they misrepresented the product is a tough sell.

chooseusername

@zipee , If you still have the sample, see if that or similar could be matched to any part of your worh-top, if the answer is yes then grow to like it, it is very nice. Also as you start to put "stuff" into the kitchen- taps, kettle, toaster, microwave, coffee machine , air frier etc. it will be grand.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121124687#Comment_121124687

Mellor, SCC time taken literally involves filling out the claim form and paying the fee. At this stage there is no need for time off work or professional reports. The op appears to have the photo of the sample from the discussion with the sales person, and the photo of the fitted top. The additional info needed with the claim is the contract of sale, and any mention of differences between sample and fitted top, that will indicate exactly what representations were made at time of purchase,

You will also have to consider that the seller will need legal advice, which of course they will have to pay for, and will also have to take a day off work for attendance in Court. So if they are not helpful, there is very, very little time and cost associated with making a SCC claim.

easygoing39

The sample does'nt look like the whole slab,however I like the way it look's in you're kitchen now,the dark veins look very natural.Also the design of the layout of the kitchen looks fantastic.I'd keep the counter tops.

StrawbsM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121123617#Comment_121123617

a minimum of 300mm from edge of draining board to nearest edge of socket.

10-10-20

I'm with @Mellor on this. I can't see the SCC making a judgement on the basis of the sample alone as the indications from websites where photographic samples are shown illustrate that Ashford Grey has significant strata and variation in the colouring very similar to what the customer's photos show. On that basis I would suggest that while I agree that the sample isn't representative of the final product, that there isn't a clear-cut case here for guaranteed win at the SCC.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121124863#Comment_121124863

I think that is for the SCC to decide, and again, it really depends on what representations were made to the op, such as was he/she given written instruction that the sample/end top could be v different. It’s the T&Cs on the contract that will determine if the op has a good claim.

10-10-20

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121125182#Comment_121125182

This is true and all of this would have to be very well documented and presented. The better the presentation at the SCC level, the better the chance of a pre court-date settlement anyway.

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121124460#Comment_121124460

Yes. SCC suggested if the op thought it was a mistake on the part of the supplier because it is very inexpensive and simpler to do. Yes there is a day in court.

Point taken about the quartz.. Ithought it came from a natural stone slab.

Surely then the OP would have more recourse then if supplied something so different to the sample?

I would have gone in to see our full slab "in the flesh" but if the company did not suggest this to the OP or make proper pictures available then that is not good on their part. Not everybody would be able to get to see the full product in the warehouse but showrooms should have accurate representation of the finished product.

Such a big ticket item for anybody.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121124769#Comment_121124769

A SCC claim with no evidence, or anything to make a legal justification why they have a claim has 0% chance of succeeding, obviously. The professional report/opinion was to increase the chances from 0% to something very small. You can often bolster a claim, even if spurious so that the cost of defending is more than the cost of the goods.

The additional info needed with the claim is the contract of sale, and any mention of differences between sample and fitted top, that will indicate exactly what representations were made at time of purchase

The sample is irrelevant, it is not part of the contract. They did not purchase a that specific sample in large format. They sale will be for slabs in Ashford Grey, which appears to be exactly what was received, based on the information above.

Normally I'd be on the side of the consumer, and tell them to have a punt (They still can for the sake of a fee). But I don't want to see people inexperience get the OPs hopes up.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121125713#Comment_121125713

Sorry, no, what you posted is BS.

The op obviously has evidence of a consumer issue, a photo of the sample used during the conversation when purchasing, the the photo of what was fitted, they look nothing alike. So it will come down to what is written in the contract.

Of course the sample is important, why have them at all if they do not reflect what is being ordered? By your logic, displays is shops would be irrelevant, the buyer could receive something completely different to the sample on display. That is a unique viewpoint.

Whether the op’s claim has merit, is for a court to decide. For €30, it should be all upside, with little downside other than €30.

Professional reports are not needed for SCCs, but certainly they help. The SCC is designed to make it easy for consumer to seek justice when they feel they are being mistreated by a business, Judges are capable of ruling without the need for expensive professional/expert reports.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121125182#Comment_121125182

The sample has nothing to do with the sale. A random sample carries n more weight that the images on the website, less so infact. The specification is what counts.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121125257#Comment_121125257

Without with information that the OP was completely mislead by the supplier. It seems like the mistake was on behalf of the OP. as I said, it's an understandable for an inexperienced non-professional, but that doesn't change liability for a mistake. The order was not for a big version of the sample. That's the key that lay poster seem to be missing

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121125865#Comment_121125865

Christs’s sake, it isn’t a random sample, it is what was used in the shop to represent the product being sold. I accept that the whole counter top could not be expected to look like that, but what the op received is vastly different from the sample.

I don’t know why I’m even engaging with you on this, op if they don’t help you out, for the sake of €30 open a SCC case and ignore this nonsense.

Allinall

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121125908#Comment_121125908

This.

The order was made based on the sample, so the final product would be expected to be similar, if not exactly the same as the sample.

That's just common sense, and the SCC should, in my opinion rule in favour of the consumer in this case.

MacDanger

Isn't the SCC limited to claims of €2500? I'd say the countertop cost more than that so it's probably a moot point

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121125762#Comment_121125762

How exactly is is BS? No offence, but your posts are highlighting that you don't fully understand how it works.

a photo of the sample used during the conversation when purchasing, the the photo of what was fitted, they look nothing alike. So it will come down to what is written in the contract.

The sample indicates it is for Ashford Grey. The link below is what a slab Ashford Grey looks like. You are honestly saying that looks nothing like OP's kitchen? https://www.ocallaghansfireplaces.ie/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/ashford_grey_kitchen_fb.jpg

Of course the sample is important, why have them at all if they do not reflect what is being ordered?

Samples are so people can take a small piece of a product home with them. The images of the whole slab are the representation of what the whole slab will look like. I'd have thought that was pretty obvious.

By your logic, displays is shops would be irrelevant, the buyer could receive something completely different to the sample on display. That is a unique viewpoint.

Do you mean displays in shops? That depends what the display is on. A paint finish is homogenous it represents the a uniform finish. A natural product will vary within a range. A small piece of stone represents some of the colours in the whole slab. It means that "some of the slab" will look like the sample. Not all of the slab.

Your logic of " the buyer could receive something completely different to the sample on display" suggests you really aren't understanding how it works. If the slab installed were black with green veins, then he's have a clear and obvious claim. Because Ashford Grey, that was ordered, is not advertised as black. Pretty simple.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121125908#Comment_121125908

Sample are random pieces of a whole slab. That's literally how they are made. Stone samples are quite literally random pieces.

The shop probably has a dozen samples, and between the dozen they probably looked like every piece of the slabs installed. I don't know why you are engaging on this either. If I remember correctly, you've posted before looking for design advice, not as a professional helping others.

lawred2

wouldn't be happy either

kick up a fuss - that's definitely outside the realm of understandable material variance

lawred2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121125908#Comment_121125908

can't believe anyone would consider a sample of the product being sold as 'random'...

would the same apply to floor tiles? Wall tiles? wood flooring? There's always some room for material variance but seriously that must have it's limitations

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121125925#Comment_121125925

If the only information was that specific sample, he would have a case. But all of the information about the selected finish indicates that its has a high degree of colour variation and looks very similar to the slabs installed. The the supplier had no images of full slabs or the like, that's critical missing info could be used make a claim. And we don't know where it came form obviously, so maybe. But it's a bit odd to assume that was the case without evidence.

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121125865#Comment_121125865

But every customer is a lay person/ non professional.

The expert is the supplier and shouldbe giving better guidance

Looks like at the end of the day unless the supplier decides to take a hit for the sake of good customer relations which I think is unlikely, the op will either have to try the SCC or just live with the worktop.

chooseusername

From the sale of goods act;

—————————————————

“Sale by Sample

Section 15 of the Sale of Goods Act applies to a sale by sample. The sale is by sample where there is an express or implied term that this is so. The contractual provisions should clarify whether and what there is a sale by sample. In some cases, the sample is also the description. The sale may be by sample and by description, in which case, both implied conditions apply.

There are three conditions implied.

• 1: that the bulk will conform with the sample in quality;
• 2: that the buyer will have a reasonable opportunity to compare the bulk with the sample;
• 3: that the goods will be free from any defect rendering them unmerchantable, that would not be apparent on reasonable examination of the sample.

The provision applies to sales to consumers and non-consumers.”

——————————————————

No2 would appear to be the only reasonable grounds here for the buyer to reject the worktop, and a Mellor pointed out pictures of the whole slab are available on the website.

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121125938#Comment_121125938

Yes more likely 4. 5 to 6 k.

That suggestion is because it would be very risky and expensive to take a full civil claim.

Unfortunately many people go to SCC knowing it will not get all that they are owed back but it is better than nothing.

Mellor

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121126139#Comment_121126139

Sample are literally random pieces of a whole slab. That's been pointed out a few time, baffled that people are stuffing to grasp what that means. Wall and floor tiles sample are usually whole tiles not pieces of tiles. Wood flooring is pieces, so you get some variation. Stone (and imitation stone) is probably the more variable material.

Here is what a slab of Ashford Grey looks like, it's a few metre long. When this is cut up into 100-150mm samples, some will be very white with light vein, some will be a very dark with light specs - and a small amount will be a mix.

Typical advice is to get around 3 samples. And to view the slab (for natural stone). Viewing is less critical for recon and photos are fine as there is more consistency between slab.

@zipee it's unfortunate this wasn't made clear to you at the sale. A lot of idiots working in retail. Give it time. I think whole slabs you ended up with have far more character that the plain sample you based it on.