Carp now present in lough Corrib!

Bullrush11 · 03-09-2023 5:51pm #1

Hi all anglers/environmentalists,

We've all noticed the recent signposts about Japaneese Knotweed errected all along the roadsides during the last few years. Well here is more bad news!

I just saw the article this weekend (Sept 2 2023) in the Irish Times, reporting that a carp was taken from Lough Corrib. Of course there must be more out there as it is a rich and warming lake (climatatic driven) which will well suit them. This is a criminal act to introduce non native fish into our waterways. This kind of environmental destruction is all to common by clueless/ignorant morons. You've seen the documentated reports both of pike being introduced into the Owenriff lakes above the waterfalls/cascades and of chub being electronetted from the river Inny several years ago. There are also rumours of zander being introduced into lough Mask, and thugs wanting to introduce wells catfish into our waterways. Is nothing sacrocant? Our trout lakes are going to be ruined soon, these alien introductions and global warming are doing our trout any favours.

About 40 years ago during an afternoons fishing, I could see well over a hundred salmon leaping in a short stretch of river either side of the bridge on the Clare river at the Curraline/Headford road . I don't see any now but there is still a trickle of a fish run thankfully.

Has the Lagorosporium (plant invader) made it down into the lower Corrib basin yet? It should thrive down there and probably cover the area. Maybe carp like eating lagorosporium!

Please respond with your opinions/observations.

Thanks

Lewis_Benson · 04-09-2023 11:42pm

Was there a picture of the carp found in lough corrib? What breed of Carp was it?

Is this the article? This is from the connaught tribune..

https://connachttribune.ie/invasive-species-casts-renewed-threat-for-lough-corrib/

"There are also rumours of zander being introduced into lough Mask"

That was born out of a joke made on a social media group where the conversation became heated, due to pictures of several dead pike being posted by local trout anglers who went on a killing spree to annoy and provoke pike anglers. That won't happen.

I havnt heard anything about anyone wanting to introduce wels catfish, that would be downright stupid.

All of this stems from the hatred of pike by a cohort of anglers in the west, this hatred is ingrained into them and they will never change, even in the face of conclusive science.

Lewis

UnleashTheBeast · 05-09-2023 10:57pm

The IFI made a Facebook post about this but it was deleted within about 24 hours because they were getting reams of people taking the piss out of them.

Lewis_Benson · 06-09-2023 9:40am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121074525#Comment_121074525

Did they have a photo of the carp?

UnleashTheBeast · 07-09-2023 12:33am

There was a photo of a carp but no indication it was the fish in question.

Lewis_Benson · 07-09-2023 7:17am

I'd be very skeptical that it was really from Lough Corrib at all.

I'd say someone sent it to IFI to try make out they caught a carp so that IFI would go on a netting campaign to remove the "carp".

The real truth here is that a number of folks on corrib are anti pike, and anti anything else for that matter.

They want a lake which contains only brown trout and nothing else. Pike have been around for thousands of years, and will be for thousands more, and despite what some say, are native to the loughs.

UnleashTheBeast · 08-09-2023 5:31pm

Could not agree with you more.

I fish the Corrib regularly, for both Trout and Pike, and the attitude from a lot of locals towards Pike is honestly so backward, it's exhausting.

The same fellas are killing 3-4 Trout per session, then blaming the Pike for everything. You couldn't make it up.

Lewis_Benson · 11-09-2023 3:45pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121086333#Comment_121086333

This is it, go out and catch, and kill all the trout that come to the boat, and then complain that the fishing is suffering.

To the OP, this is not an attack on you or your post, just how I see whats happening on Corrib.

spaceHopper · 12-09-2023 4:17pm

Water quality has more to do with the lack of fish. That and lice from farmed fish. Pike have nothing to do with, they probably help control roach numbers. If carp were in the Corrib they would have show up in gill nets by now.

Lewis_Benson · 12-09-2023 8:46pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121101716#Comment_121101716

Indeed they would have.

twin_beacon · 13-09-2023 6:12pm

Just to clarify at the start of this, I'm an Angler. Not a "Pike" angler, not a "Trout" angler, or a "Coarse" angler, I fish for pretty much all fresh water species, and if there were more hours in the day, I'd do more sea fishing. I also spend a good few days on Corrib every year fishing for both Trout and Pike. I have also fished for Carp over the years, but not so much in recent times.

A few things the OP mentioned that I would like to address.

Of course there must be more out there as it is a rich and warming lake (climatatic driven) which will well suit them. Not really, Corrib is a large, deep glacial lake. Although the lower lake is not too deep, its still not an ideal environment for Carp to thrive. They can survive there alright, and they may spawn every few years if the parameters are correct, but their numbers would be tiny. Lough Ree (another lake I spend time on) has a tiny population of carp. They are not causing any problems. They were introduced when Pike Anglers from the UK brought them over illegally as live baits (a stupid and illegal act), and some escaped some time in the late 80s or early 90s.

This is a criminal act to introduce non native fish into our waterways. This kind of environmental destruction is all to common by clueless/ignorant morons. I agree, but how and when they got into the lake is a question that can never be answered. Have they been there for 1 years, or 30 years? People seem to forget that the old Central Fisheries Board introduced Carp into many lakes from their stock ponds in the midlands up until the late 1990s. Carp are indeed "non native", but like the Tench, they are not "invasive". A proper invasive species is Roach, as they reproduce in large numbers.

You've seen the documentated reports both of pike being introduced into the Owenriff lakes above the waterfalls/cascades Pike are a native species to Ireland, They have been here since after the last Ice Age. A PHd thesis proved this 10 years ago, IFI have an article on it here. Pike can be found from the west coast of Ireland, to the east coast of Russia, and again in North America. Pike have probably been present in Ireland since before the waterfall on the Owenriff actually existed.

chub being electronetted from the river Inny several years ago. Chub should not have been introduced, a stupid act whoever did it.

There are also rumours of zander being introduced into lough Mask, and thugs wanting to introduce wells catfish into our waterways. Is nothing sacrocant? Our trout lakes are going to be ruined soon, these alien introductions and global warming are doing our trout any favours. Rumours are indeed all they were. The facebook "war" back in 2018 when Sean Kyne introduced that stupid by-law (that the Irish Pike Society got overturned in the High Court), is one of the worst things I've seen since I started fishing in the 90s. It was a stupid tit for tat back and forth argument for around 18 months. Things were posted online that people wouldn't have the balls to say to someones face, and rumours were spread like Zander being introduced into Mask is just one of the many stupid things that was said.

About 40 years ago during an afternoons fishing, I could see well over a hundred salmon leaping in a short stretch of river either side of the bridge on the Clare river at the Curraline/Headford road . I don't see any now but there is still a trickle of a fish run thankfully. I would have love to have seen that, but I know I never will. Our Salmon are getting hammered on 2 fronts, at sea, and when they come back to our rivers to spawn. I would wager that we are probably less than 20 years from Salmon being pretty much extinct from some rivers in Ireland. Its a disgrace.

flended12 · 14-09-2023 6:17pm

Maybe the carp in the corrib are out of control due to the dwindling pike numbers?

*adjusts halo*

Was down that way a few years back and whilst I wasn't fishing the knuckle dragging attitude to pike was astounding.

Lewis_Benson · 18-09-2023 10:34pm

Sickening

rpmcmurphy · 19-09-2023 8:39am

Absolutely disgusting. They are sadly not protected by any bye-law in that part of the country.

Yellow_Fern · 24-09-2023 2:34pm

People who illegally release fish should be locked up for years. Absolute biotreason.

People on the thread claiming pike are native don't understand the topic. It isnt clear that pike area native. The argument is based on genetic modelling but it is rather ambiguous to say the least as it assumes rates of mutation. We don't aDNA or bones that would verify. have any If they are native it is odd that so little literary records mention them in medieval sources.

twin_beacon · 25-09-2023 12:13pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121150621#Comment_121150621

I remember the one of the Clubs on Corrib (probably Oughterard) referencing the book "Topographia Hibernica", written in the year 1188 as "evidence" that pike are not native (because there was no mention of Pike in the book), while not knowing that that book is a work of fiction, not fact. I responded with a few extracts from the book where it mentioned haunted milk churns, a large church bell that would fly through the air every night, and my personal favorite was when they described the Irish race as a bunch of wild savages. I think that's when they banned me from their page.

I don't understand the logic of culling pike on the western lough, or the claims being made that IFI want to to be a "Mixed Fishery". The horse has already bolted on that. The lakes have good stocks of Bream, Roach, Rudd, Perch and there are also good numbers of Tench. It already is a mixed fishery. They complain that the 2006 byelaw protects the coarse fish on the lake, while at the same time they are killing the largest predator on the lake that will keep their numbers at a healthy balance. They wan't to reduce that bye law's reach so it doesn't apply to the western loughs, but I don't understand what their plan would be if that was to happen? Try to commercially net the coarse fish on the lake?

The Western Loughs are very different when compared to 50 years ago. The most common fish in the lake now is probably the Roach, an invasive species. Zebra Mussels filtering the water. Lagarosiphon major clogging up some bays, and the Zebra Mussels attaching themselves to it meaning their population can increase in a given area. Water quality issues due to the increase in intensive farming due to slurry and fertilizer run off, causing an increase in weed growth in the spawning rivers, choking up the gravel. I find it mad that despite all these issues, for a large amount of anglers, public enemy number one is still the Pike.

Lewis_Benson · 27-09-2023 9:24am

The long and short of it is that pike have been on this island for thousand of years. And will not be going anywhere any time soon.

Loughs ree and derg are proof of the fact that pike and trout do coexist and there aren't loads of trout being eaten up by the big bad pike.

Both lakes are fishing their socks off for all predator species. Trout, perch and pike.

I personally don't believe that there was any carp found on corrib, they would have turned up in the nets by now if they were there.

delboythedub · 27-09-2023 9:54am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121078997#Comment_121078997

Pike is an invasive species my friend

Lewis_Benson · 27-09-2023 10:04am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121162601#Comment_121162601

They aren't though.

Invasive species take over an environment, like roach have done.

Pike have not wiped out any other species in the thousands of years they have been here.

delboythedub · 27-09-2023 12:33pm

Pike is an NON NATIVE invasive species my friend

twin_beacon · 27-09-2023 7:57pm

take it up with IFI my friend https://fishinginireland.info/2013/pike-reports/32589/

Yellow_Fern · 29-09-2023 5:47pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121154273#Comment_121154273

Topographia Hibernica has some fiction but also a lot of truth. Historians do use this book. We have indigenous sources too, like the Zoilomastix, which is a The Natural History of Ireland. We have many other sources too.

PowerToWait · 06-10-2023 9:27pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121163421#Comment_121163421

I'm with the poster a few posts above yours.

Seals, cormorants, fish farms, eutrophication, slurry run off, poaching, zebra mussels. None of this matters as long as there's dem foreign pike invading our waters. All of them undocumented as well.

Doe Tiden · 30-12-2023 8:11pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121163421#Comment_121163421

If pike are so invasive in the corrib why haven’t they finally got the better of the trout yet? I’m listening to the threat from sex mad cannibalistic invasive pike for 40 years,

as for the owenriff how many slatted houses have leaky tanks or houses with dodgy septic tanks or changes in the water due to deforestation?

all of these need to be considered definitely pike were wrongly introduced to the owenriff system but the decline in trout isn’t simply down to pike imo,

I'm not an angler as some people call themselves , I’m a fly fisherman, if it’s not a brown trout I’m not interested in it I only fly fish for trout but the rep pike have taken is ridiculous as far I can see pike help keep a system healthy look at sheelin and derg lough Ree too.

Lewis_Benson · 01-01-2024 8:34pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121551340#Comment_121551340

Spot on.

A certain cohort of trout anglers don't want to fix the real problems...just blame pike anytime the decline in trout numbers arises.

Bio Mech · 03-01-2024 3:53pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121558455#Comment_121558455

Eating is a basic concept that simple minds can understand. Sure havent their ancestors been eating trout for centuries, but now the pike are eating them all. Now more complex concepts like eutrophication, invasive species altering the ecological balance and genetic analysis, well now that sounds like fancy witchcraft to me. If they could burn all the pike they would, burn em good like a hotel earmarked for refugees.

RoboRat · 03-01-2024 4:20pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121163421#Comment_121163421

The first written references to Pike in Ireland appeared in the 16th century and from analysis conducted on Pike, it was determined that they came here around 8,000 years ago:

"Pedreschi and her team took tissue samples from 752 pike, at 15 locations, and compared their DNA with that of fish from Britain and mainland Europe. A curious genetic picture emerged. It shows that pike reached Ireland and Britain soon after the end of the last ice age, about 8,000 years ago." This is from the Genetic Structure of Pike and their History in Ireland by Debbi Pedreschi, a Post-Doctoral Researcher, Fisheries and Ecosystems Advisory Services for the Marine Institute. I think she might have a better understanding than most.

I would assume that if something has been here for 8,000 years, it's now indegineous, and if it's been here for that time and other species are still thriving, then it's not invasive either.