Another Serious Car Crash

kippy

Breaking news this evening from near Cashel.

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2023/0829/1402364-tipperary-crash/

Obviously details to be confirmed. There've been a lot of serious incidents on our roads this year so far - while probably down on numbers from a decade or so ago the trend is worrying and these injuries and deaths of profound impacts on families and communities.

I don't wish to speak of any singular incident, especially this one, but do any incident reports come out after these incidents and is there anything to be learned from them in relation to reducing the causes of them again?

I wish the best of wishes to those involved in the incident above.

Will_I_Amnt

Local media reporting 3 fatalities of 5 passengers in the car

Be right back

What is going on? Really terrible news again for the same area.

Lisha

It’s just seems so close (time wise) to the other tradgedies . A terrible burden for families and the wider communities too.

ive a nearly 16year old who can’t wait to get driving. Then you hear about these mass tradgedies and you are tempted to drive them around always. Not possible I know. God love those left behind after this accident. So sad.

giveitholly

Reports that there are 3 fatalities including a child

BagofWeed

There must be something in the air it's been a tragic summer all round.

AMKC

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121044824#Comment_121044824

ive a nearly 16year old who can’t wait to get driving. Then you hear about these mass tradgedies and you are tempted to drive them around always. Not possible I know. God love those left behind after this accident. So sad.

All you can do is make sure you get them the best instructor you can and teach them what you have learned from experience then hope they listen and do not pick up any bad habits.

As for this latest crash it is very sad and so close to the last tragedy.

NewbridgeIR

We always hear that Gardai are investigating crashes but then time passes and I don't think that the results are often made public when the reasons are established. You'll always get people saying that "this is not the right time" etc so invariably it gets glossed over or swept under the carpet. It's the same with most suicides.

People will speculate when the facts are suppressed.

Goldengirl

Think this thread is more than a bit insensitive given that people have died and families are in mourning .

I am sure ye will all find out eventually what happened but maybe put a lid on it for the moment in case anybody grieving should read this .

RIP those that have died .

JP Liz V1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121044838#Comment_121044838

Oh Lord, RIP

TedBundysDriver

I drive a coach for a living and have driven all over Europe as well as been all over the world on my motorbikes. I have no idea what caused this particular crash and am not speculating on this particular accident but we have a serious problem with how people in rural Ireland drive their cars and motorcycles in regards speed compared to other parts of the world I've driven/ridden in.

I've observed how for whatever bizarre reason in Ireland despite the road itself getting more dangerous the driver/rider tends to instead of slowing down views it as some sort of challenge and in fact speeds up. I've noticed the complete opposite in other countries.

Princess Calla

I agree, I do think it's in the public interest to know what was the main cause of the fatality.

With air bags, side impact bars and airbags in theory cars are much safer now than 20 years ago.

As a road user I'd like to learn from others "mistakes". Covering up the reason for the fatality let's the person die in vain. If they were on their phone, watching Netflix, not wearing seatbelts let it be known. Let them be the poster child of what happens if you take stupid risks.

While I know most of us fast forward adverts etc I do think the safety campaign adverts from the late 90's early 00's should be updated and re-released.

Atlantic Dawn

BBC reporting it was a male and female rear passenger and infant boy who died. Driver and passenger being treated in hospital for serious injuries.

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/ce7w0kn8n5eo

.Donegal.

Irish times reporting 2 adults (grandparents) and their 3 year old granddaughter died. Child’s parents suffered serious injuries.

https://www.irishtimes.com/ireland/2023/08/29/number-of-people-dead-following-single-vehicle-crash-in-co-tipperary/

Beasty

"I don't want to speculate but....

...I'm going to anyway"

None of us know what happened

Thread closed while I delete some posts that are totally unacceptable

Beasty

Thread re-opened. Please show some respect when posting in a threads like this. People who may be close to the people involved could be reading these comments.

And for those who claim that the reasons for such crashes are not released, that's exactly what inquests are for. Let the relevant authorities determine any cause or fault.

Any questions PM me - do not respond to this post in thread.

RIP to those who have lost their lives. Hopefully others involved will be OK.

Be right back

I really hope that none of the emergency services that attended last Friday's incident were involved in this awful accident.

TheValeyard

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121045022#Comment_121045022

That is just absolutely horrific

RIP

knucklehead6

A number of years ago two friends of mine lost family members in separate incidents.

one had a massive stroke or brain haemorrhage (according to his brother who survived) while driving and was probably dead before the car hit the wall.

the other had a heart attack. He was able to talk to first responders before he passed and described what happened.

both of those were attributed to road fatalities, however they could just as easily died at home.

not all car deaths are car deaths. Not all details are released to the general public.

prunudo

I can't remember the last time I saw a traffic related garda checkpoint. Maybe this is leading to a level of complacency about traffic laws and seat belt wearing, particularly rear passenegers.

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121045223#Comment_121045223

I would concur that road safety enforcement is pretty much non-existent. When the Gardai don't police the roads and the RSA spend their time telling schoolkids to put on builders vests if they don't want to be killed then you invariably see road users flout the laws with impunity!

Edit: just to clarify that I'm not speculating that recent fatalities are the result of flouting the laws.

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121045219#Comment_121045219

You’re making a great case for regular medical certification for all drivers. If we’re going to have people operating lethal equipment in public places, we need them to be safe.

Details of such deaths would come out in inquests.

prunudo

Truck and bus drivers require a medical every 5 years. Don't see any reason why other licensee's can't have a medical every 10 years upon renewal, or at a very minimum a fresh eyesight test.

893bet

don’t know where that young couple are going to look for support when they wake up, devastating

i124Q

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121045223#Comment_121045223

I was overtaking a male driver, in his 60/70s who increased his speed during the maneuver, putting everybody at risk. There are entitled pricks out there who should be banned. I caught it all on dash cam, reported it and all the gardai could do was call him and warn him. He potentially got a couple of penalty points. The system is a joke. Hence you have lunatics out there.

Field east

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121044957#Comment_121044957

I agree re not commenting/speculation on this tragedy. RIP on the three lost souls. But is there a balance somewhere ? The ideal time , from a learning , technical , objective perspective, to highlight something - whatever the tragedy is -and to have the highest impact is to explain the background/ what happened / the cause/ solutions, etc is when it is still FRESH in our minds. That’s when the message re how to avoid a repeat can be the most effective. Having said the above we still need to be very sensitive to the families left behind.

There is a county, on the road between Athlone and Sligo, which has put a white cross, for every person killed, on the spot where it occurred. I found them VERY striking. There are clusters of them at black spots, bad bends , etc.

what better reminder - A CONSTANT REMINDER -can one get to drive more carefully - ESPECIALLY ON SPOTS WHERE PEOPLE HAVE BEEN KILLED

SEPT 23 1989

No idea why this could be happening

The laws have never been so restrictive and yet we are seeing more deaths

it’s a strange one

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121045300#Comment_121045300

Was it made even more dangerous by the fact that it was a narrow road with a bad bend a short distance in front and you had no way of seeing oncoming traffic? He should have known your time was more important than everyone else's.

The most dangerous thing on the roads are entitled drivers with no sense of their own faults and blaming everyone else

Field east

Gov should now carry out a really DEEP ROOT AND BRANCH review of the whole driver/ road user area of our society - including driver testing , refresher testing, road surfaces, signage, sight lines, categorisation of reasons for all crashes over the past , say, 5 years, etc, etc.

irrespective of general road /driving conditions, the driver is the KEY as to whether each journey will be carried out safely or not. Another key is any passenger in the vehicle may be in a position to advise the driver on better driving practices. A third key is those parents/guardians - especially re young people who have just passed the driving test - who have ‘some influence’ to have rules/ ‘advice’ around giving the family car for them to drive.

One aspect I think that needs a very serious review is the driving test process. It , in no way , captures the whole driving experience that we all - almost all- will come across in our lives. Could special testing centres be set up where a learner driver can experience the effect of driving on bald tyres, aqua planing, speeding around bad turns, etc. I know that there would be safety issues involved . But they might be carried out by professionals in a very controlled fashion. , shown real life situations on video, etc.

Princess Calla

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121045314#Comment_121045314

It's a combination of things I think.

Some roads are in shyte , hit a pothole at speed , you'll probably end up in a certain amount of bother!

Not wearing seatbelts, more a country thing than a Dublin thing, but I've still seen it in Dublin.

As I've kids that are older than baby's I've noticed carseats are not as prevalent in cars. I'm just on the required height for a seat so I have a fair idea of how tall a child is (or isn't) ...granted it's mostly the school run or training sessions, so Dublin suburb driving. I would hope the carseat comes out for motorway and long distances.

Phones, people can't leave them out of their hands for any length of time.

Then just taking stupid risks. They eventually catch up on you.

nullzero

It's probably better to discuss road safety in general than specific incidents.

Something is very wrong at the moment and a new approach is needed to address the issues that are leading to these tragedies.

Lillyfae

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121045302#Comment_121045302

I know the one you're talking about but what struck me is that the money would have been better spent on improving the road which was barely drivable at the time. Those metal crosses wouldn't be great on impact either.

NIMAN

Another tragedy, more lives lost unnecessarily. May they rest in peace.

But we do need to have an honest discussion about our roads and the high number of deaths on them. To continue to call these incidents 'freak accidents is just putting our heads in the sand and not helping any side of the argument at all.

I don't think blaming the guards for not enough checkpoints or not enough speed vans is a valid thing to do. When we all pass our test, we have to realise we are in control of a very dangerous piece of machinery, and we have to handle it responsibly. Don't speed, don't take silly risks, stay off the phone, respect other road users etc. It's all quite simple really, but unfortunately too many people ignore the basics. I witness examples of all the faults every single time I go out in the car. Mobile phone use is the major scourge now. The number of drivers approaching me with their eyes focused down to their lap is frightening

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121045490#Comment_121045490

Actuaslly, enforcement is critical. If you have no enforcement then people will do things they should not be doing.

Expecting that drivers having passed the test should know better is the approach being taken by the ever-incompetent RSA with their endless crusade of reminding and urging drivers not to break the law.

BagofWeed

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121045223#Comment_121045223

Meet 2 of them in the last 2 weeks.

lisasimpson

There needs to be a lenghty road safety campaign with garda presence. Its like we have forgotten to drive.

Earlier in the summer I was driving home from work near 5pm on the M7 near birdhill and a car in front of me was constantly swerving between the lane going 100k. I eventually managed to pass to discover female early 20s applying her foundation while driving. Makeup brush in 1 hand mirror in the other.

NIMAN

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121045524#Comment_121045524

But even if the Gardai put out 100x the number of checkpoints, you have to remember that it would still only affect a tiny tiny proportion of those using the roads.

There are hundreds of thousands of cars on the roads at any one time, over the same amount of kms of roads, the chances of ever meeting a checkpoint are still negligible.

The guards are easy to blame. It's not them speeding, driving dangerously, driving under the influence etc. Is there no personal responsibility at all?

NIMAN

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121045584#Comment_121045584

If we need a road safety campaign to tell people it's not right to apply their makeup whilst driving, I despair for the human race.

Gusser09

We need to get away from the revenue generated approach of how we tackle road safety. We all know and see it. Speedvans in locations where there is low to zero serious risk of accidents. Checkpoints for tax. When was the last time your tyres were inspected at a checkpoint?

AGS and the RSA have a huge part to play in the lax approach to the rules of the road that has set it.

NIMAN

Re: trying to catch people speeding.

We live in a country where 99% of the population will flash an oncoming driver to warn them of a speed trap up ahead.

Or where we have Facebook accounts telling you where checkpoints are.

AndyBoBandy

When you see these utterly tragic news stories, and then you see 'single vehicle crash', the only conclusion you can arrive at (rightly or wrongly) is excessive speed was involved..

In the RTÉ article on yesterday's crash, they reference the tragic crash from Friday, and the below line is quite startling;

They were on their way to celebrate when the car they were travelling in overturned and hit a stone wall.

Cars can easily overturn when struck by another car, or if they are a big SUV type vehicle, but for a car to overturn on its own... that'd take some doing.. or hitting something at very high speed.

There is simply no enforcement of the rules over here... Are there even any fixed speed cameras in the country? I see some lines on the M1 where there used to be a camera, but the camera hasn't been there in years... Anyone ever drive around the U.K. in semi rural areas? Every single town/village you enter/leave has speed cameras at the entry/exit of these places...

Seth Brundle

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121045663#Comment_121045663

How exactly would you tackle road safety if fines aren't part of the punishment?

The money generated from speeding fines doesn't cover the cost anyhow!

whisky_galore

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121045314#Comment_121045314

Laws are f all use if ignored and not enforced.

Kimbot

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121045664#Comment_121045664

I can tell you that its far less than 99%, on my way home everyday there is always a van on one side of the road. Approx 1 in 20 vehicles may flash to warn others but alot of the time nobody flashes anymore.

I wont flash to warn anyone because if they are speeding then they should be caught plain and simple.

Viscount Aggro

RIP.

rogber

Very sad, though was quite surprised to see the two adults in their forties were the grandparents, not the parents!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121044824#Comment_121044824

Get him his W licence and he can drive a 4 tonne tractor with a silage trailer on the road legally. He won't even have to do a test. 😡

thebourke

How many people have died on the roads so far this year?

howiya

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121045740#Comment_121045740

124 so far. Significantly up on the 100 to this date in 2022.

BobMc

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121044957#Comment_121044957

Herein lies the problem, a terrible terrible tragedy and I'm so so sorry for everyone who's suffering such an un imaginable loss this morning,

but for far too long this is all swept over and no lessons learned, the dust settles families are destroyed and suffering but nothing changes, at some point the facts must come out and despite the loss perhaps people might learn lessons, there was a local crash near me many years ago and despite speculation etc we never heard what actually happened, we all know it was speed as it was clear to see for everyone who drives by the memorial left on a daily basis, enforcement is needed and it needs to change, penalties and fines at a level where most will think twice, red lights, dangerous overtaking etc, and mainly speed

John_Rambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121045461#Comment_121045461

Obvious issues & desperate road tragedy in Tipperary & other parts of the country so Gardai set up a checkpoint in slow moving sedate traffic in South County Dublin.