Aer Lingus Pilot Training Programme

Designator

Heard about this fully sponsored Aer Lingus pilot training programme today, going to chance my arm and apply , no harm in trying. But curious if anyone knows any extra details about it? I know the training is 14 months in Spain and it says you get a small allowance while training but just wondering what this is exactly? It’s fine to get free training accommodation and meals but like myself if you have a mortgage to pay back home is this allowance going to be anything sufficient? Just curious

Staunton96

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058307306/aer-lingus-pilot-training-programme-2023

Allowance is minimal (you get accommodation and food), between 100-200 a week. So you won't be able to pay a mortgage - you'll need to save up for it I imagine. But go for it anyway

Nova160

Would anyone know the pay scale in aer lingus for first officers

Designator

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120941736#Comment_120941736

Starts at 70k rising to 90k and captains start around 130k rising to 180k

They seem to be on a big drive to encourage more female candidates, I suppose to have a wider choice of suitable people. I believe the raining is in Jerez where the prevailing good clear weather speeds up, at least initial hour building.

airy fairy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120941810#Comment_120941810

Aer Lingus first officers are 45k to 55,520k.

Info is available online.

Ryanair is similar.

I know someone personally who has recently taken a job with this type of salary.

Designator

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120941922#Comment_120941922

I must have read different somewhere . That’s a pretty low salary for the job even if it is starting salary , train drivers are paid more

airy fairy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120941942#Comment_120941942

I presume there must be a theory behind it somewhere , probably committment and how someone isn't being a pilot for the craic. It's a long hard slog, and long unpaid hours of training, both academically and in the skies.

sailing

There is an incremental payscale in Aer lingus which starts at approx €55,000 basic salary for a newly qualified First Officer. This rises to a max of €206,000 basic salary for a Captain.

You also earn sector pay, which is a payment for every flight that you complete. That would average an extra €10,000 per annum tax free for both a captain and First officer.

You also earn a bonus for every hour you fly annually above 620 flying hours. So, if you fly a full 900 hours you can expect to earn a further €21,000 a year for a First Officer or €28,000 for a Captain.

You will also receive a defined benefit pension which is worth a contribution by Aer Lingus to you of 21% of your basic salary annually.

You will also receive an allowance of €60 per annual leave day you take and you will be paid for any time away from your home base.

As a captain with 24 years total service as a pilot in the company you will earn approx €250,000 plus a further €29,000 in pension contributions. There is no differentiation between a long haul or short haul pilot. You all earn the same.

As a newly qualified fresh First Officer you will earn approx €90,000.

If you go down a path of becoming an instructor, either as a First Officer or Captain you are additionally remunerated.

There is an ongoing pay process in progress at the moment where it would be expected that the above figures will rise by a moderate percentage. Pilot pay in the United States for example has just returned as the highest paid profession in the country, having recently overtook the Medical industry. This is in part due to a pilot shortage over there which hasn’t hit Europe as severely as yet. Many operators around Europe are increasing pay significantly at the moment.

Its a good package for anyone interested in a flying career in Ireland. The competition for a place on a cadet scheme is intense, and only a very small percentage will be successful. From memory approx 5000 applied for 12 or so positions last time around.

For anyone interested in the career it is welcome to have the opportunity to apply for a fully funded training programme which would normally cost well over €100,000 to complete on your own in a similar training organisation.

Staunton96

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120943407#Comment_120943407

Thanks for this message and detail you went into.

I just want to point out though that as far as I'm aware, basic 55k would be true for a DEFO (non type-rated). This is not the case for cadets, who will be on considerably less to "pay back" the cost of the integrated training school in FTE. What that figure is exactly I don't know, but it's quite a way from the amount quoted.

Larbre34

Any realistic chance of a fit, healthy 47yo with 6/6 vision, looking for a career change, getting on the programme?

Lustrum

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120943407#Comment_120943407

Just to correct some of this - the cadet scale starts at a little over €42k and you stay on it for a couple of years to essentially repay the cost of your training. As someone else pointed out, the DEFO scale is close to €55k, as a cadet you would join that at year 3 I think it is.

Sector pay is split into taxable and non-taxable portions, and is different depending on the routes you fly ie. different rates for UK, European, Canaries and Transatlantic.

The "bonus" pay figures are overstated in this post, if you max out as a first officer you're looking at about €18k, which is taxable.

Pension and annual leave payments are correct.

If you work yourself silly, you'll make about €90k after 5/6 years, no chance of getting near that when newly qualified.

There's no point in going into this thinking you're going to be creaming it in straight away, you won't. It's great money after a good few years in the left seat, which at the moment is probably 10/12 years from joining the company.

If you can, find someone who works for them and ask all your questions. Undoubtedly this is the best cadetship going in Ireland, and will get you the best flying job if you want to be based in Dublin.

Best of luck to all who apply

munchkin_utd

slight tangent, my daughter (not school leaving age yet, but slowly getting there) finds the idea/ job of a pilot very interesting.

My question though is whether the cadetship is limited to irish based candidates or can folks living abroad also apply? She has an irish passport in case they are just discriminating on basis of passport rather than residence.

Astral Nav

It's not strictly Irish based, lots of nationalities there who came from elsewhere. Having an Irish or EU passport is the main thing.

She's not old enough yet but AL are VERY keen to attract female candidates as is clear from the advertising.

giseva

Having submitted my application and uploading my CV, I received a link to submit a formal application, and upload a CV again.

This formal application has some questions about candidates education and flying experience, if any.

I have a level 9 PGDip, yet the drop down menu doesn't give options in terms of the NFQ. I'd imagine the odds of getting a place is comparable to a lottery win so every detail counts.

Although my qualification is at Masters level (30 creds short) I don't want to put Masters in case it goes against me. Similarly, I have a higher level than the other option of Bachelors degree so I don't want to select that either.

There is also a yes/no question about aviation experience. I don't have commercial aviation experience yet I was a member of the Irish Air Corps for a number of years, working in a service support.

The stress 😅, not what you want for a prospective pilot.

Could anyone offer any guidance?

Designator

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120983065#Comment_120983065

They advertise this as a position that’s for everyone and you don’t have to have any previous flying experience but from the questions and the online assessment it’s fairly clear that in reality they only want people that have previous flying experience or some sort of licence already. Disappointing

CoisFharraige

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120983160#Comment_120983160

Not true whatsoever. They do this to collect the info because previously they did it in person at the group assessment stage.

Flying experience is completely unnecessary, but could strengthen your application. It is just about the individual sitting in front of them and how they perform in the assessments. Previously people have gotten through with zero hours and with a PPL.

Ádh mór gach duine!

Shoden

Any idea when the assessment results will come out?

Shoden

Also, how did people find the assessments? Found the verbal reasoning tough.

Michael132

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121007651#Comment_121007651

Verbal reasoning was tricky, I also found deductive logical thinking tricky but got the hang of it half way though. The rest I found grand. Fingers crossed now and wait till the end of the month or early next month for results. GL all

Shoden

Think everything else went well for me except verbal reasoning. That part didn't go well at all.

giseva

Some of the questionnaire part threw me a bit. Hopefully not too long of a wait for results. Fantastic opportunity for the few that make it.

Beersmith

I applied weeks ago but didn't get anything about an assessment. When did this happen?

giseva

They are probably still working through applications. I received a link to the online assessments Friday gone, and was given 72hrs to complete from time of email.

Shoden

Is there any other conversation going on about this elsewhere?

Michael132

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121024115#Comment_121024115

Not from what i can find, 1 or 2 comments in the 2019 thread. V quite this round

GTTDI GOD

Just over on pprune, that’s the only other conversation I can see.

Shoden

Thanks, I'll look for the conversation on pprune.

CoisFharraige

Anyone hear anything

GTTDI GOD

We won’t hear anything for another week or 2

MarkN

Declines gone out today.

BOR95

did anyone get a rejection email ?

BOR95

Did anyone get a rejection email?

Shoden

Not yet anyway, so fingers crossed.

GTTDI GOD

Just got an email for invite! Hard luck to those that haven’t got through this time, keep at it! This is my 6th attempt!

MarkN

Fair play to you. Got my PFO last week. Had been practicing the cut-e for months but was my first time.

Best of luck with the rest of it!

Irishhumanbeing

Anyone know what will be involved in the group assessment? What kind of questions etc will be asked/ if it will be similar to the online tests we did?

Thanks in advance!

TestPilot007

How did we all get on? Few tricky points in the final interview for me but overall an enjoyable day and it left me with a good impression of the company.

AnthonyGrady

Hello, great to see someone who passed the tests!

Just wondering have you previous flying experience or what is it you think that made you progress in the process?

Would love any tips for the future as its really hard to find people who have succeeded in this!

Thanks!

Staunton96

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121481336#Comment_121481336

I know many who got through and almost all had PPLs, the one that didn't had hours under her belt.

MarkN

Good luck to all involved

podgeandrodge

Just curious, with all the testing, is there a bias towards females now i.e. could a female have a better chance of getting in, even if performing less well in the tests, or is it black and white at that point i.e. encourage females, but no special treatment following application?

StephenRy30

Anyone know what a roster would be like for a pilot? Do you get much time off or do you work crazy hours . Do you spend alot of time away from family? . Would you ever be able to work 1 week on 1 off ?

Locker10a

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121603832#Comment_121603832

Most airline crew only actually fly 3/4 days a week, sometimes 5. Followed by 3/4 days off. This varies airline to airline.

The days you are working can be long, and can mean staying overnight somewhere.

ProfessorPlum

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121603832#Comment_121603832

Aer Lingus standard short haul roster is 5/3 (5 on, 3 off). Days can be long, especially during the summer roster period. Part time is available in seniority, on each fleet and in each seat, but you have to be quite senior to get it. 1 week on/ 1 week off doesn't exist currently and unlikely to do so in the foreseeable. Overnights are part of the roster, but there's not that many and you can bid for (or not for) them.

ProfessorPlum

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121601411#Comment_121601411

There's a concerted effort to attract females to apply, in the same way that Aer Lingus are continuing to push the cadetship - they want people who would perhaps not consider flying (whether for financial or other reasons) to be in a position to become an airline pilot. Once the application is in, the same standards apply regardless of who you are.

basill

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121603832#Comment_121603832

To put more meat on the bones. When under training you can be rostered up to 6 consecutive days eg: as a new joiner, 320 to 330 CCQ or command upgrade for example etc. As stated above the short haul roster is a fixed pattern 5 on 3 off. There is a bidding system for pilots for work. It has been called many things. The most polite would be a preferential bidding system. You can bid for trips, overnights, destination countries, doubles, singles - pretty much anything. More senior folk would be expected to get more of their bids than a new joiner or junior colleague. Nothing is guaranteed with the roster apart from the days off you are due. The 5 on 3 off pattern is subject to "flex" which you can bid for or be directed to in inverse seniority. A flex roster can reduce your days off to 2 and last a full roster period (4 weeks). So you could be doing weeks of 5 on 2 off. Then you pick up where your 5/3 pattern would have been once the flex roster is completed. Some people get away with easy flex rosters and others find themselves fatigued irrespectrive of which seat they are in. So the "fixed pattern" sales blurb is a bit of a misnomer if you ask me as you could be dumped with a flex roster. Having some seniority might insulate you somewhat from its affects but eventually everyone has to take their turn and do flex which can destroy any long term plans you might have had. You can swap duties which might dig you out of a hole if required but is not guaranteed obviously and sometimes easier said than done eg: trying to get off on a weekend, or swapping during the summer when many people will be maxed out on hours so the swap may not be legal.

The 330 is a random roster. You can bid for trips, destinations, days off and just about any combination thereof. An east coast trip is rostered a minimum of two days off. West coast 4 days. The 330 does a fair amount of flying in europe during the summer with morning rotations to Malaga and Faro before returning to Dublin and heading to the USA again in the afternoon. Summer 330 rosters can be killers. Up to 6 days work with early morning starts to Malaga followed by an East Coast trip to JFK, BOS or ORD wouldn't be all that uncommon. Its not uncommon for the 330 to be tasked to cover for breakdowns if an airframe is idle and crews available across the short haul network. Winter is quiet for the most part so the rosters are a lot lighter. Some lucky folk have been seeing the RHS of the 330 inside a few years. Command on 330 is well over 20 years. I think its actually closer to 25 but if you are joining later in life then bear that in mind.

Part time is generally available in the RHS and from what I hear has historically been undersubscribed. The part time days are attached to your normal "free days". An example would be 4 on 4 off with the associated salary drop. In the LHS on the 320 (short haul) you won't see it without 20 years of service presently.