Advice (edit: homeowner travelling for 12+ months)

Marty984

Hi, I'm a home owner (value 400k) with a 25k mortgage. I'm moving soon to work in Europe for one year minimum. I was thinking of renting out the house while I'm away but another piece if me is pondering if I would be better off selling. I'd have a big chunk of cash to invest or just deposit but I'd have nowhere to call home here. 39/m/single with no kids. Any advice if you could put yourself in my position please. Tnx.

L1011

Right now, you need to assume that you will not be able to get a tenant out in a quick or easy manner; either due to legislation changes or overholding. This may mean that you cannot return to the house when you come back.

Marty984

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120868099#Comment_120868099

That would be a solid reason for me to not rent it, the thoughts of legal issues would stress the s**t out if me. On top of the taxes, changes to home ins etc. On top of that I'm not looking to become a landlord but it would be a waste to just leave it there uninhibited. I'm leaning more to a sale the more I think if it.

kevgaa

The main things to think about is what you want when or if you return home?

Selling will give you a lump sum but with inflation and rising house prices unless you invest it wisely you may not be able to get a similar house in the same area with your money when you return.

Also do you have somewhere to live when you return as renting is difficult these days?

You could look at short term lets e.g people doing up houses etc so you have more confidence in getting the house back.

Lots to think about for you but you need to look at the pros and cons of renting versus selling. In the current climate if you are only going for a year and plan on returning I would look to keep the house even if you keep it vacant.

newmember2

Employ a management company to let it out in five month terms until you return.

Marty984

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120868173#Comment_120868173

Thanks, plenty to think about there.

herbalplants

You need to think which country you want to call home eventually?

You may go to Europe for work for a year and discover you don't really like living there for more than a year.

You need to test the waters first.

Do a 5 months contract and see how you see things in 6 months.

suvigirl

Just rent out a room, you can get up to 14,000 euro a year and gives you time to decide if you will stay away or come home.

You also have somewhere to leave all your stuff and stay when you visit home. You could easily charge the full 14,000 as the tenants will basically have the place to themselves.

herbalplants

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120868685#Comment_120868685

If you don't live in the house, you cannot claim 14k tax free

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120868695#Comment_120868695

It would be his principal residence and he would clearly still be living in it, travelling only to work.

I know people that did it.

Mrs OBumble

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120868695#Comment_120868695

S/he will gave annual leave and would be wise to spend some of living I the house, while here to visit family.

The problem with selling and buying again is that you have to find somewhere you want to buy.

Del2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120868701#Comment_120868701

Just because they did it doesn't mean that Revenue won't chase them for tax or start looking into more. They "might" have gotten away with tax fraud, others might not.

tvjunki

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120869614#Comment_120869614

Also after 6 months the lodger could claim they are a tenant and have indefinite tenancy.

Marty984

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120868685#Comment_120868685

I could do this but as others have said it could get sticky with revenue, it's probably the best solution if I could find a relative or someone who I can trust. It would still be my primary then when I'm back on hols etc or over Christmas but my taxes would be paid in another country so I'd either have to keep it quiet from revenue or let them take half....

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120869713#Comment_120869713

If you rent out the whole house you will be paying revenue anyway, this way you still have your house with your stuff in it and somewhere to stay.

just my own experience, I sold a house and went overseas for 2 years in 2017, now Covid did feck things up, but I'm still renting and paying big rent!

herbalplants

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120869802#Comment_120869802

Agree, it is best to keep the house and keep a room in.

newmember2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120869659#Comment_120869659

Don't let anyone stay 6 months - do 5 month term tenancies only.

tvjunki

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120870854#Comment_120870854

They lodger becomes a tenant as they can prove the owner is not staying there over the 5/6months. Also if you a tenancy agreement then they are a tenant. The owner will pay tax as expected on the full rent.

newmember2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120870929#Comment_120870929

"Rent a room" does not apply in the OP's case. After a tenancy of five months the tenant will have limited rights. The landlord is taxed on his profits rather than the rent he charges.

tvjunki

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120870966#Comment_120870966

Agree that the 'rent a room' does not apply in this case. As soon as you give the person a tenancy agreement of any kind they are registered as a tenant and you need to register with RTB within a month. Also if you go away you now have to register as a non resident landlord. New thing Revenue has introduced.

Ginger83

OP you would be absolutely nuts to let anyone stay in your home and move away, family or otherwise.

You are giving possession of a 400k asset to someone with no guarantee of getting it back and as many know in today's market possession is 9/10s of the law.

tvjunki

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058305577/advice-edit-homeowner-travelling-for-12-months

By the way. Nice to be in a position to have only €25k mortgage. If you are worried about paying the mortgage then go interest only for the year. Get someone to call collect post, pay any bills and keep the garden clean/clear. Leave it empty. You will at least have somewhere to go back too. You do not know if you would like the job and may want to come back sooner.

Marty984

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120871542#Comment_120871542

Thanks! I worked my arse off the last few years to pay it off but I imagine with no kids etc it was a lot easier😉 chance to move now and make big bucks so the temptation is there. I'll think a bit more about leaving it as you say.

DubCount

Is there a relative you could ask to stay in the place with a caretaker agreement. No rental income, but no tenancy rights either.

Marty984

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120876108#Comment_120876108

Had thought of that but nobody comes to mind, I believe there are now implications for the tenant in that kind of scenario now as they must declare they are getting free accomodation.

DownByTheGarden

Try a house sitter service. I havent seen it in Ireland but ive seen it work in the US. Might be worth checking to see if there is such a company in Ireland. BEtter check too that the sitter dosnt get any rights to your property you dont want them to get. Such as being a tenant after a certain tine etc

DownByTheGarden

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120876840#Comment_120876840

A friend of mine paid his friends son a small amount to stay in his house and look after it while he was gone. I think it was €10 a month or something like that. The kid got somewhere to live for a year. His "job" was to keep it clean and fight off any burglers. All were happy with the arrangement. No tenancy and no tax liability.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120868099#Comment_120868099

Right now you need to prepare for Sinn Fein CPOing, to all intents and purposes, your rental property without compensation.

Do not let.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120876108#Comment_120876108

The way things are now, could even a relative be trusted to vacate when asked?

mrslancaster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120937406#Comment_120937406

How would that CPO work?

spaceHopper

I'd sell, or leave it empty. Been a LL is not easy, even if you rent it a friend or family, things can get ugly when you want to come back. You could keep a room and rent it to family so you can always have access to it but you could be stuck living with them if you return, If you decide to stay and sell the house you'll be the worlds worst for doing it,

If you sell now you cash in and invest but you might not beat inflation. If you keep it prices might drop but they will come back up.

I would go and leave it empty if it doesn't work out abroad that you can always come back. If it does then sell it but don't sit on the fence for to long as there would be some capital gains tax to pay once it's not your ppr

DubCount

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120937412#Comment_120937412

The way things are now - anything is possible, and anything that is possible today could change tomorrow without notice. Its the wild west of property markets at the moment.

According to the RTB "A landlord is the owner of a property who leases or rents it to another person. The person who rents the property is a tenant. The agreement between the landlord and tenant is a tenancy.". If there is no rent, I dont see how the person could be considered a tenant with all the rights associated. I would even pay a small fee to the caretaker for providing the caretaker services, and have a caretaker agreement, to further underline that it is not a tenancy.

herbalplants

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120937412#Comment_120937412

Nope a relative couldn't be trusted because they know even more about you than a stranger.

xyz13

I would rent.

Put any expensive items (furniture etc) in storage and hire a reputable letting agency.

80sDiesel

Very difficult to find any investment that can get the returns on a private resident in Ireland . No capital gains tax.

So keep and hold and dont rent.

Buddy Bubs

Don't do anything straight away. See how you get on abroad, leave it empty. You might get itch to return quickly. If you're staying away, reassess then.

DFB-D

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120940121#Comment_120940121

Not sure of the wisdom of that?

Why not rent it out? Should be 25 to 30k in income...

Marty984

Thanks for all advice so far, I will be leaving next week and am not going to rent it for now. I'll see how I get on and revaluate at Christmass.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120937423#Comment_120937423

They don't have to CPO anything, just take away whatever rights landlords have, it's a process which has been under way for years already.

If you can't evict anyone ever, do you still really own the property?

DownByTheGarden

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120948701#Comment_120948701

Fair point. You cant even raise the rent if you need to.

enricoh

I'd rent it out to someone refurbing their house. Builder lined up n looking for 6 months ish. Wouldn't consider anyone else nowadays.

arctictree

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120948701#Comment_120948701

Without getting too philosophical about it, the concept of 'ownership' is a bit strange anyway. It really just gives you more rights than other people to have exclusive use of a property and to buy and sell that right to other people. When those rights are eaten away, the concept becomes a bit stretched.

Buzwaldo

What about the national scheme where local authorities are coordinating housing of Ukrainian refugees. Payment of 800 per month tax free and they are staying under licence and the responsibility of the local authority re licence and security of the property. Minimum 6 month period.

I have a solicitor friend availing of this for an apartment he has, and he wouldn’t be doing it if he wasn’t happy with the legal arrangement.

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/moving-country/ukrainian-refugees-in-ireland/accommodation-recognition-payment/

Marty984

Hi all, just to update this thread. I left and worked last year but am now back in my house but will be going abroad soon again. I have a family friend who is from the USA and coming to do a bachelors in UCC for one year. I have decided to rent the house to her but I will keep the granny flat to myself as I will be on rotation of three weeks on/one week off so will be home for my week off. I will be taxed in the Netherlands so cannot claim rent a room. It's better to rent as I cannot keep an eye on the house and have nobody who can live there to mind it for me, with break ins etc I would feel better having someone I trust there while I'm away. Do I register with the RTB? Thanks again to anyone who chimes in, it isn't a situation that comes up often here if at all.

Ezeoul

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122403541#Comment_122403541

If you have a granny flat, why dont you rent her that part?

Marty984

I may do that but for using the kitchen the house is a better option. I'm fairly easy going and don't cook much nor spend too much time at home so I thought it might be easier for me to have the more basic set up....

Anyway is there a difference in which one I lease out?

mrslancaster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122406121#Comment_122406121

Could make a difference in whether you need to register with the rtb or not, and if the renter is a tenant who gains rights after 6 months, or is a licensee/lodger who is a paying guest in your home. If your new situation means you are still living in your house - even if it's only one week in four plus maybe some extra weekends - why not just let a room to your US friend?

Check the revenue rules about tax-residency also if you decide to rent the whole house. Different regulations for non-resident landlords.

27cyrix

I am really curious about the percentage of landlords who experience overloading in their rental. I see that rental in Dublin(my own experience) is extremely profitable.