Second-hand EV market of 2023

September1

It seems that market for second hand EVs will be correcting from excesses of 2022 and already there have been quite a few price drops. To see how EVs differ from ICE I compared all registrations in 2020&2021 with available offers on Carzone - if there was 1000 registrations in a yead and 100 cars on carzone that would be 10%. This is very crude, as I think registrations do not translate 100% to particular plates - if one type of car is more likely to be imported second hand than other this will skew the numbers.

There are 3.27% ICE for year 2021, but 7.96% EVs and for year 2020 this goes to 4.60% for ICE and 13.13% for EV. I think this suggests that strong second prices enticed owners to trade-in for new car and now there is quite a big stock.

I checked also most popular models and it seems LEAF has best inventory, there is 23.6% available of 2020 stock and 11.01% of 2021 stock. If you are looking to buy one I think you would have upper hand in negotiations.

If we look at 2021 there is 5% ID.4 and 3.6% Tiguan. ID.3 is at 8.1% and Golf is at 3.4%. I think this holds for most cases where similar cars are available in same versions.

Keep in mind this is very loosely related to prices, for example M3 avaliablity (0.41% for 2020 and 1.28% for 2021) is very small but because of price cuts it is much cheaper now than six months ago.

ELM327

I think your data is flawed/incomplete. How have you account for used imports, particularly those who will not arrive now that did arrive in prior years?

An interesting thought experiment nonetheless

Stevie2001

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120781154#Comment_120781154

Why insult the guy for posting some data?

I read through it and found it interesting

September1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120781460#Comment_120781460

I agree with that, there are data issues on both SIMI Motorstats (imports) and Carzone (poorly classified and duplicate ads). I think overall market numbers are less affected so the supply of secondhand EVs is relatively better than ICEs. I wish they provided data is machine friendly formats.

the_amazing_raisin

I do agree in general the market has seen a correction this year, there's been significant price drops on some second hand cars

It's worth noting they're coming from a ridiculously high point last year and are approaching more normal levels of deprecation IMO

I also think there's still a good few dreamers out there, for example I looked at 2016 Leafs and they're mostly around €7k, same as the trade in value I got two years ago (with much lower mileage). I imagine those cars are probably worth closer to €5k today

ELM327

The other missing point is when dealers place one ad but have say 5 cars to sell or 5 ads on multiple platforms for one car.

I do think it is interesting nonethelss and I agree with the outcome, I think the time of mad priced EVs is over. I just bought a leaf24 with test and tax and 80k km for 2600. That wouldnt have happened a few months ago.

September1

I think cheapest ID.3 are now more keenly priced than cheapest 62kWh LEAFs which suggests that there could be correction coming for LEAFs. They have larger boot but shorter range and problematic DC port. Perhaphs whey would be move to 20-25k braket pushing 40kWh and obviously 30kWh down. I think this could result in 5-10k bracket to finally get a good selection of cars by Autumn.

Obviously grant removal could make my guesses wrong...

Jaymacc

Any idea how much a 202 id3 first with 60,000km would sell for today?

joe1303l

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120786419#Comment_120786419

€25K-€26K private sale or trade price. Retail with warranty may command more.

joe1303l

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120786278#Comment_120786278

e-Golfs also dropping in recent weeks and they have started to appear in greater numbers on the used market as people trade up.

liamog

Mod Note: Removed bickering

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120787059#Comment_120787059

Anyone else wondering if Liam deleted the posts, or sent assassins after the bickering posters? 😂

fafy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120786483#Comment_120786483

A tad optimistic for a 2020 1st base model, i’d say, there are “style” trim 2021 models for sale which are 25k, and they have the very useful led headlights & some other extras, the base model does not have.

Later this year, many of the 350+ ID3’s registered in 2020 will come onto the s/h market, so further price drops are inevitable, then next year many of the 1,200+ ID3 models will also be on the s/h market. I don’t know what the % of the sales were PCP, but i’d guess the majority were.

It appears those who offloaded their 2020 ID3’s in the first half of 2022, did well, and had very low depreciation losses.

But for those who bought on PCP, it also depends on what your GMFV is

joe1303l

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120788013#Comment_120788013

1st Edition cars are well spec’d and not a base model. Agreed that a lot of ID.3’s likely to become available if not bought out on PCP deals.

September1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120788421#Comment_120788421

There were three trims and base one was very simple. It can be easily recognized by unique pattern on seats. Anyway trims specs and prices are still on their website https://www.volkswagen.ie/idhub/content/dam/onehub_pkw/importers/ie/models/product-guides/ID-3-1ST-ProductGuide.pdf

AMKC

Any stats on the resale Values of used Renault Zoes? Have they gone down in recent years?

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120789575#Comment_120789575

They were always kind of tricky because a lot of them had battery leases.

You'd spot one several thousand below other and then find out you have to pay Renault a monthly fee for an 8 year old battery 😕

They were offering owners a buyout a few years ago, I assume most went for it

Just checked DoneDeal and the cheapest one is €5,500 but battery leased. Next one is €7,900 for a battery owned on (frankly I'd say they're dreaming at that price)

AMKC

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120789613#Comment_120789613

Thanks.

zg3409

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120789575#Comment_120789575

Most are 22kW AC charging which is very very slow on motorway stops. A very few are 43kW AC but very few ESB chargers still support this speed so often these cars are also 22kW max

Recent Zoe's have CCS ports for faster public charging but beware these were an optional extra, so do your research, as most are not suited to long motorway trips.

handpref

@zg3409 nailed it, the Achilles heel is charging, even if you found a rare 43ac Zoe most of the chargers have had the ac43 charging cable reduced to do 22kw max, or removed it altogether and left a 22kw port to connect onto with your own cable.

Zoes were great back in 2013-2017 when the leaf was the main competition, when chademo chargers were few on the ground, broken or hogged and the slow charging speed, the Zoe could keep you out of trouble on a 22kw scp. Really only a city car now, good range on the ze40 (200-240) but it’s an out and back machine on one charge, couldn’t be depending on it for a family. Any early adopters would remember the lad from cork who’s special topic was Zoe’s and he went everywhere in it.

Ze40’s are going from €16,000 up to €21k!, the early ones €7900 for a 2015, if you could get a Tekna (6.6) leaf for a grand or two more I’d take the leaf, nicer place to be and the Tekna led low beams are good. That’s presuming your using it as a run around and not public charging with chademo now disappearing.

The Zoe’s are light and I wouldn’t want to get a bang in one, also underpowered. Struggles to pull from 120kmph and tops out fully at 140kmph. The lights are terrible, the windows fog up badly due to poor heating controls/ vents. The new ze50’s don’t all have cc’s and there were issues with removing air bags. Think it got demoted by ncap.

Great little run around but I’d be using the now defunct charging network as a bargaining tool. Renaults seem to depreciate hard so a new one would lead to big losses. It has its shortcomings but they are a nice little car. Good battery bms, cooling and not showing degradation like the leaf. More stylish than the leaf and a perfect second car if got for the right money.

MojoMaker

Very nice to drive and in mid-spec and up you have all the toys. Deceptively spacious inside compared to its outer dimensions and really nippy in the key city speed ranges of 30-70 km/h.

4 doors a bonus and has a bigger boot than the Clio which is in the segment above it. 22kw OBC a real bonus which means public AC chargers are a doddle. Summer real range on the ZE40 (assuming all in good order) is 275kms and winter about 190/200 - which is plenty for the average suburban usage profile for which it was created.

unkel

@handpref & @zg3409 - I don't agree that the early Zoe is a city car. It's main strength in Ireland is that it has 22kW AC charging and there are literally over a thousand 22kW charge points in Ireland, they are everywhere and most of the time they are not occupied. You have not much competition! Obviously you need to take your time when you do the odd long distance trip in it. But I'd rather do it in a Zoe than in a similar range early Leaf where you'd need to rely on CHAdeMO or otherwise you are screwed

The only thing about the Zoes is that they are hugely overpriced for what they are: a very basic and spartan econobox EV that is very slow too. Early ones with battery owned shouldn't be more than €4-5k at this stage.

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120791984#Comment_120791984

IMO the Zoe is probably one of the best cars if you don't have home charging

1 hour shopping trip to a supermarket with a 22kW AC charger gives you probably 3-4 days of juice

jkforde

just started thinking of getting rid of my 201 39kW Tekna Leaf (107k km, full battery, 250km) for a used CCS EV (ciao Chademo!)...

any opinions of a fair dealer trade-in value of the Leaf?, it's in very good condition imho.

and was thinking of something along lines of the Peugeot e-208 or similar.. all thoughts appreciated!

unkel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120793636#Comment_120793636

A dealer might give you €16k cash. Private sale you could get a few grand more.

September1

This VW dealer is giving a free charger now with second hand EVs https://www.facebook.com/vwwexford/posts/pfbid0S6x2n9EGUd1ThQDM6hF7YjnEmmfQP5A91J4K3w6kc3cJJkDUgxgSFGRs1n8qdBaWl

zg3409

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120793636#Comment_120793636

If you are trading in car and buying another one from same dealer then trade in price means nothing. The price to change is what it really costs you and trade in may be under or over and new car price may be under or over.

If you trade in elsewhere and don't buy from them and walk away with cash that's the real trade in price. Ring around you don't have to trade in where you buy.

Beware if you have a trade in then buy price, if you arrive with cash having sold your old car elsewhere the price may suddenly change.

Typically you get more money selling privately on done deal but it can be a hassle with time wasters but we'll worth the savings which could be thousands.

September1

I did quick comparison of today stock with June one and it seems that supply of ICE has grown much faster than supply of EVs.