Billboard Chris in Dublin

charlie_says

A man in city centre Dublin who is wearing a sign saying children can't consent to taking hormone blockers has caused a bit of controversy.

https://twitter.com/BillboardChris/status/1659927650175991808?s=20

Can children consent to taking hormone blockers? If so should they be allowed to?

Geuze

No and no.

Billboard Chris is 100% spot on - children should not be taking "puberty blockers", drugs that have never been tested on children long-term.

As the lady says in that video, so-called "puberty blockers" have only ever been approved in adults - to treat adults with certain diseases, including specific kinds of cancer. They were never tested nor intended to be given to children for any other clinical indication. Therefore the use of these drugs is experimental in nature. Whether people agree with that experimentation is another matter.

But what we should all agree, is that it's a legitimate debate to be had.

In the footage, the police officer makes a total fool of himself. Without checking the CCTV footage, he blames Billboard Chris, demanding that he not appear near the store in question (i.e. considered guilty first).

And all this, without the new "hate speech" legislation having been passed. Which isn't really about hate speech at all, but rather about what some people - a minority of people - consider "offensive speech", which is entirely subjective in nature. Expect the police reports to come flooding in once this legislation passes.

Imagine how absurd it will become once the legislation is passed? Who wants police resources wasted on cases that involve decent people saying experimental drugs should not be administered to young children? Just because some people, a minority of juvenile adults who have never grown up, claim to be "offended".

Seriously!?

This is an obscenity. It's a violation against children and an added obstruction to freedom of speech.

Long may Billboard Chris persist. I had never heard of him until yesterday, but if he can shine a light on the injustice committed against children, then that can only be considered a good thing - no matter how loud, violent, abusive, aggressive and censorious opposition voices may be.

And for anyone who may not have heard of Billboard Chris, he was on GB News this evening. A perfectly tame, moderate, sensible voice who is airing legitimate concerns whilst also being respectful to others at the same time.

https://twitter.com/GBNEWS/status/1660356445664051200

bokale

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058297368/billboard-chris-in-dublin

I feel the garda was quite clear that he didn't want to arrest him?

suvigirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120625279#Comment_120625279

The guard didn't do any such thing. He was given a call to do and he did it to its end. It's not so long ago that people were moaning about gardai not doing calls.

And kids don't get those blockers here. Non issue.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120625509#Comment_120625509

The "kids" from Ireland attended the now-closed Tavistock Clinic in the UK.

The reason this clinic was closed was well-established.

quokula

Man tries to goad garda into arresting him, fails, then posts a video falsely claiming the garda threatened to arrest him.

A lot of respect for the way the gard handled it, he had the patience of a saint.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120625530#Comment_120625530

A cursory review of the footage shows that's not what happened.

You have either deliberately or otherwise misrepresented what happened in the available footage.

I.R.Y.E.D

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120625530#Comment_120625530

Idiots will disagree with you but nothing new there.

Hodger

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058297368/billboard-chris-in-dublin

This is what the Nhs had to say about puberty blockers.

" Little is known about the long-term side effects of hormone or puberty blockers in children with gender dysphoria.

Although GIDS advises this is a physically reversible treatment if stopped, it is not known what the psychological effects may be.

It's also not known whether hormone blockers affect the development of the teenage brain or children's bones. Side effects may also include hot flushes, fatigue and mood alterations.

From the age of 16, teenagers who've been on hormone blockers for at least 12 months may be given cross-sex hormones, also known as gender-affirming hormones.

These hormones cause some irreversible changes, such as:

• breast development (caused by taking oestrogen)
• breaking or deepening of the voice (caused by taking testosterone)

Long-term cross-sex hormone treatment may cause temporary or even permanent infertility. "

https://www.nhs.uk/conditions/gender-dysphoria/treatment/

When " Little is known about the long-term side effects of hormone or puberty blockers in children " how can children be mature enough to consent to make life changing decisions when underage ? as it stands children can,t buy alcohol / cigarettes / gamble or even buy a grand theft auto videogame as age appropriate comes into the equation, in the same way age appropriate comes into the equation about life changing decisions.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120625530#Comment_120625530

The Garda lied and told him if someone finds his sign offensive he could be arrested. He then tried to make him leave the area.

He made a tit of himself and got his bluff called. A clear attempt at police intervention over an opinion but it failed. It’s all there in the video. What was the Garda’s business even speaking to him?

Do you think children should be given puberty blockers?

Grayson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058297368/billboard-chris-in-dublin

Except the parents consented on their behalf. You know that the decisions are made by doctors, parents and the children together. And for occasions where there's a dispute between the parents and children, there's a process for that. The same as the process used for any medical course the child wants to take and a parent doesn't. Most noticeably when a parent refuses to let a child terminate a pregnancy. It's rarely used because 99% of the time when a child attends a doctor the parents agree with the treatment.

Personally I think the rational way to determine if a child needs any treatment is consultation between doctors, parents and the child. I wouldn't ban a child from receiving all treatment because children can't consent. BTW, most drugs aren't tested on children or pregnant women. They're used off label for treatment. It's standard because of the extra costs involved in getting a drug to market. But if you want to ban all off label treatments, you're going to have a lot of dead children on your hands.

But I have a feeling you knew all that and you don't care about other off label prescriptions. can you name all other other off label treatments you want to ban? And you don't care about parental consent for other treatments. Do you want to stop parental consent? Do you want to stop teenage girls getting terminations? I'm guessing no and you probably just find trans people icky.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120625509#Comment_120625509

The Guards made up call was done after 30 seconds when he was told he wasn’t in the Disney store. End of conversation. Instead he starts asking him about the billboard and what his motivation is.

Clearly an attempt by the Guard to force him to stop and it failed. The Disney store call was bull.

And people are ‘moaning’ about Guards not doing anything about actual crime. Instead they’re now the offence police. Do you consider this a good use of police resources?

Str8outtaWuhan

This is why the hate crime legislation is so dangerous.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120625863#Comment_120625863

The entire foundation of your argument is based on the idea that these kids were sick and needed medical intervention, which is false, and that puberty blockers with permanent affects is any sort of medical treatment, which it isn’t.

These decisions were not based on medical care for the children but ideological dogma and virtue signalling.

Just because parents consent to something doesn’t mean it’s their right to. There are lots of things that should not be forced onto children, regardless of parents consent.

gmisk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120625530#Comment_120625530

Grifters gonna grift

Grayson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626024#Comment_120626024

My entire argument is that doctors, who are specialists in their areas, along with parents and children should make these decisions. That isn't an irrational opinion. Let the people who know the medicine and the children make the decisions. Not someone on the internet without the knowledge.

BTW, the medical establishment do believe that there are times when puberty blockers should be used. They're already used on children who start puberty too early. I would counter that the people against their use are the ideological ones. they believe that there should be a blanket ban on a treatment independent on the individual circumstance. They're not about nuance.

astrofool

Attention seeking nutter gets attention from raZZists, racists, far right extremists and conspiracy theorists (sometimes an all-in-one!).

General populace stays away.

I do believe you call that a failure.

Annasopra

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120625568#Comment_120625568

He actually said in the video he wanted to be arrested. Quokolas summary is correct.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626069#Comment_120626069

Sorry but I don’t believe just because someone is a doctor they are infallible or even necessarily have good intentions. Those kids weren’t sick and did not need medical intervention and it has nothing to do with starting puberty early.

What’s your opinion on doctors who carry out genital mutilation? Should I butt out and leave it to the professionals in that subject also?

mikethecop

Can we not just ignore theses attention seeking aholes

the like of this fool, the burkes, gemma and the like . its attention they crave and the lack of it will neutralize them

the appropriate response to some deranged fool standing in the street with a billboard hanging off them is to ignore him or a most a small laugh at his expense and go on about your own day

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626119#Comment_120626119

The Tavistock Clinic and Mermaids in the UK were packed to the rafters with health professionals, yet they had to close on the basis there was a massive lack of safeguarding of children - including with their use of puberty blockers. Mermaids secretly sent children "chest binders" without the consent of parents.

I don't think people should underestimate the social pressure applied to healthcare professionals here. 35 psychologists alone resigned within 3-years. The Hillary Cass report condemned the clinic and its zealous misuse of the "affirmation" model. Many physicians had to silently speak out as they feared the consequences if their words became public.

More than 1,000+ families are set to sue the Tavistock clinic on the back of what happened.

So no, those peddling the myth that it's a question for healthcare professionals are clearly unaware of the evidence to date about what has transpired at these and other clinics.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626257#Comment_120626257

That’s a fair point. Except someone couldn’t ignore him and called the police on him. When the guard realised he had no good reason to intervene he could have left it at that but he still questioned him for ten minutes and tried to tell him he could be arrested if someone was offended by his sign.

So now we have a ten minute video and a thread. You’re welcome to leave the thread if you want

Unless your real motivation is you don’t like a light been shined into this subject

RobbieTheRobber

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626285#Comment_120626285

But sure we all know the UK is a tory rundown shíthole. What has that got to do with billboard Chris?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626314#Comment_120626314

Billboard Chris is highlighting the concerns of the evidence to date re: puberty blockers and the affirmation model.

All the evidence to date from Western clinics shows that this is both hasty and often harmful to the child.

RobbieTheRobber

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626326#Comment_120626326

So nothing to do with Billboard Chris got it.

Who is he highlighting these concerns to, is there a big issue with puberty blockers on Grafton street?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626415#Comment_120626415

You are asking quite a lot of questions, skirting around the issue - but seem to have no question about the application of puberty blockers in children. And this, despite the fact, that thousands of families are suing clinics in the UK and elsewhere as a direct consequence of the use of puberty blockers in children.

The fact you'd rather talk about Grafton Street rather than the substantive issue behind his messaging, tells me that you're not interested in seriously engaging with this discussion.

Be facetious if you wish, but don't pretend this isn't a serious and legitimate discussion, because it is.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626084#Comment_120626084

And yet someone called the police on him and the police threatened to arrest him if anyone found him offensive. So whose failure is that?

RobbieTheRobber

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626428#Comment_120626428

The UK left the EU so what they do medically has little to do with Ireland anymore.

How may children have been prescribed puberty blockers in Ireland?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626451#Comment_120626451

Really!?

Irish doctors were referring children to the Tavistock Clinic in the UK.

In light of the announcement by the HSE two days ago that it is to continue sending Irish children to the Tavistock GIDS for gender healthcare, despite the overwhelming evidence that this clinic is unsafe, and the decision of the NHS to close it, we request an urgent meeting with you to further discuss the risk this presents to Irish children

Brexit has nothing to do with this issue.

Grayson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626119#Comment_120626119

Female genital mutilation is against the law. It has no benefits at all, Physical or psychological. However the vast majority of Dr's accept that trans people exist, that gender dysphoria is real and that affirmative care is the correct method to use.

There were problems with tavistock. they were overwhelmed with referrals. So what the government did in the UK was close it and open a load of regional centres which offer the same support. The UK has not banned puberty blockers. the UK has not banned any treatments. So although the anti trans brigade cite Tavistock as a victory, it wasn't. It's actually expanded the availability of treatment.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626508#Comment_120626508

 which offer the same support

Totally false.

The Cass Report recommended a "holistic" approach that treated patients from a multitude of angles, and not to rely on the affirmation model of accepting what the children say and then going straight to puberty blockers.

You clearly have not read the Cass Report.

Failures included:

GIDS took an approach that was predominantly affirmative, rather than exploratory

Assessment was not standardised

Mental health and neurodevelopmental assessments were not conducted comprehensively, leading to ‘diagnostic overshadowing’ whereby gender dysphoria was attended to without taking into account any co-existing diagnoses

Safeguarding processes were lacking

CatFromHue

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626508#Comment_120626508

Asking for evidence based medicine is not anti trans!

In this country alone saying the vast majority of Drs accept that affirmative care is the correct method to use is just not true.

Lionel Fusco

A man who cares so much about his kids that he travels the world wearing a billboard rather than staying at home and parenting them.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626508#Comment_120626508

And yet doctors partake in said mutilations. So doctor's aren’t automatically right

And you’re whitewashing what happened at Tavistock. They completely misdiagnosed kids and gave them life changing drugs on ideological bases. And if was a victory for common sense as it brought light on what was happening.

And can you back up that statement about a vast majority of doctors.

mikethecop

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626288#Comment_120626288

thats some top class point missing right there

If you want a point ill clarify , not every ones opinion is valid or important or needs to be forced into peoples faces , that is the major negative of the web and social media , media in general as standards in media fall dramatically in the last 10 years or so

ie i dont care what this ahole thinks or gemma or the burkes because none of them make any difference to the issue

they are just empty mouth pieces who's only goal is to get attention from people who despise them

therefor denying them that attention is the logical response or lack of response if you like

TooTired123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120625509#Comment_120625509

Wether kids here are given puberty blockers or not is not the issue here.

The issue is that someone from the Disney store in Dublin made a complaint to AGS that a man was in the store being offensive in some way.

The Gardai were dispatched in a squad car to investigate the claim. They arrived at the scene to find that nothing untoward appeared to be happening.

Instead of going into the Disney store to clarify the situation by looking at the stores own CCTV, the Garda immediately approached the very calm Canadian and was very soon telling him that if he had offended someone he was at risk of committing a crime.

When the Garda did go to the store he tried to leave the area without speaking to the Canadian again but the Canadian approached the squad car and the Garda was forced to admit that there was no evidence of the Canadian ever being in the shop, never mind harassing customers/staff.

That would mean that if you are a Liverpool FC fan and I am a Man City fan and I am wearing a T-shirt which has a slogan saying “Man City are the greatest football team in the world” on it , that you could ring the Gardai to claim that you were offended and you wanted me dealt with. Do you understand how unworkable that is?

tesla_newbie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120625530#Comment_120625530

Bizarre conclusion

bokale

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626648#Comment_120626648

They were both annoying to listen to. But the tweet text is just clickbait.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626616#Comment_120626616

No I got your point completely and his opinion is as valid and as important as yours or anyone else’s. The fact you could say differently shows the mindset you have.

That person has 300k followers and the video has 4.6m views. He’s drawing attention to this issue and I think that is what you don’t like. I think you care a lot about it.

TooTired123

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626653#Comment_120626653

The Garda approached the Canadian having done no investigation whatsoever into the report of harassment in the shop. A few minutes in the Disney shop would have informed the Garda of the whole circumstances.

But look, this posters sees things completely differently to you and me . I could say that I’m offended and report the post to a mod🤣🤣🤣 but I’m just too busy right now.

tesla_newbie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626699#Comment_120626699

A mortified cop would have told billboard Chris he had to check it out and left immediately, this meathead jumped in with both feet and started quoting laws that don’t exist

“ that billboard could be offensive to someone and therefore grounds for arrest “

I doubt the guard received any complaint by someone in the Disney shop. It was an excuse to harass him because of the subject. Sinister.

Id imagine if someone stood there with a board that says “Children can consent to puberty blockers” the cops would be nowhere to be seen.

He needs to do some actual police work or he can go get a job as security in centra.

tesla_newbie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626708#Comment_120626708

Some guards just like to wade in, quite possible he had no strong political - ideological opinion on it

Burty330

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626508#Comment_120626508

There were problems with tavistock. they were overwhelmed with referrals. So what the government did in the UK was close it and open a load of regional centres which offer the same support

Not true. The NHS shut it down and replaced it with a totally different method of treating gender dysphoria

The sole service in England treating children and adolescents for gender dysphoria will be shut down and a network of regional centres established, after a review concluded that a single specialist provider model was “not safe.”

The Gender Identity Development Service (GIDS) at the Tavistock and Portman NHS Trust in London will be discontinued after recommendations in the interim report from Hilary Cass, former president of the Royal College of Paediatrics and Child Health.

https://segm.org/England-ends-gender-affirming-care#:~:text=The%20NHS%20strongly%20discourages%20social,an%20explicit%20informed%20consent%20process.

Sweden also and its only a matter of time before other courtiers realize the dangers of gender mistreatment

https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20230208-sweden-puts-brakes-on-treatments-for-trans-minors

Grayson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626867#Comment_120626867

All of these new places will still have specialist endocrinologists. All these new places will still prescribe hormone blockers. They will still recognize that trans teens exist. Trans teens will get support. The difference is that there won't be one central place where it all happens. The waiting list will also be shorter. It's why some trans groups have welcomed the changes, althought it's a cautious welcome. Because the tories are always promising healthcare to everyone and constantly cutting back. So the trans groups like the plans but don't trust the tories to deliver.

Grayson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626667#Comment_120626667

There are medical specialists. Just because you don't like their field of expertise doesn't mean you can dismiss them. You just end up sounding like a climate change denier who says that all the climate scientist are under the thumb of big windfarm. Or a flat earther who says that there's a conspiracy to hide it all from us.

Witcher

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626706#Comment_120626706

I think you'll find there is a law covering exactly that.

mikethecop

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626683#Comment_120626683

Im sorry to say after two simple explanations you arent even close to understanding the point but at least your eagerly displaying the theroy that social media is a massive negative influence on civilization

Thank god your here to tell me what i think and what i care about . id never have known without you 🙄

tesla_newbie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626910#Comment_120626910

No , not yet

tesla_newbie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120626896#Comment_120626896

A minority of doctors advocated for “ zero Covid “

a minority of doctors are active on the whole trans thing