2minutes sitting on Luas at OCS lights

SteM

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120350463#Comment_120350463

Almost always. When I worked in Grand Canal Dock it was quicker to get a Dublin Bike there and cycle up to James' and get the Luas to Saggart than it was to get the Luas from Spencer Dock. Same on the way in.

brianc89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120353104#Comment_120353104

I can't recall tbh, maybe 16minutes. About 2-3minutes per stop, plus 2minutes at OCS junction. I felt it was relatively quick apart from stopping at 4 junctions waiting for green lights.

Most stops were less than 15seconds but longer when you consider the stop start motion.

Jamie2k9

The wait was longer before Green line was extended and they improved the sequancing and reduced it as well.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120353023#Comment_120353023

You are right, its normal rather an exception. While I fully understand why its very frustrating. If TII were to pull the data it would actually show its negetivly impacting traffic overall and also causing congestion on the Red Line. Unless both trams are stopped both will not get cleared accross together unless your exceptionally lucky.

The 10-15 second delay for the Luas clearance plus improvimnets to the triggers would easily be offset by the long periods where road traffic has greens and no actual traffic.

Jamie2k9

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120352850#Comment_120352850

Might be a more complicated junction but far more efficient and keeps both directions moving even if one tram is only approaching while the other has been cleared. They tend to get double clearence across both junctions together and trams are not held up as often as they would be either side of OCS. Only issues there at times is traffic onto Gardner St can mean they get caught between the junctions.

Capel St is another one that needs to be reprogrammed to account for the changes there.

dfx-

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120353023#Comment_120353023

Around 9am at OCS, the trams from Heuston are bunched together. It is a regular thing - two Point trams and a Connolly tram within 3 minutes and then a 6 minute gap.

Often it's not just a wait at the lights but waiting for the tram ahead to clear through Abbey St.

There's similar blockages for traffic trying to right onto Fleet St with northbound trams...which blocks College Green and College St north/westbound buses to Westmoreland St.

Daith

Getting the Luas from Westmoreland St and watching it slowly get to Dominck St is a right pain. The number of traffic lights (and pedestrians and car traffic, sure), but frequently the Broombridge bound tram has to wait for the Parnell boud tram at O'Connell St. It's a pity there's no area for Parnell bound trams to "rest" that doesn't block a Broombridge one.

brianc89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120365132#Comment_120365132

I think it should be possible to remove the left turns from OCS North and South onto Abbey. This would simplify that junction. As for the Parnell Street junction, definitely a bottleneck and I'm not sure what solution save for removing cars from crossing Parnell westbound.

Daith

Yeah, it just comes down to too much traffic on that street.

Abbey St has a lot of deliveries in the morning and buses setting down too. Am sure some of this could be shunted off elsewhere.

ArmaniJeanss

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120365212#Comment_120365212

I'm confused as to where you are sending traffic. It looks like its down Bachelors Way which is not wide enough and it has a height restriction so no buses. Then you swing onto Abbey Street, across the Luas tracks and down the laneway to the left of Penneys? Again this laneway isn't suitable for anything wider than a bicycle.

This is Bachelors Way Bachelors Way - Google Maps

and this is the 'road' to the left of Penneys, Williams Lane. Good luck. William's Ln - Google Maps

brianc89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120366004#Comment_120366004

No buses turn left onto OCS from the quays, so only cars would need to use Bachelor's Way, which it is wide enough to accommodate. Taxi's use this regularly.

William's lane, however, is clearly unsuitable thanks. Didn't realize it was so narrow.

Basically the only reason cars need to use OCS is to access the carparks, which is very poor reason to complicate Abbey/OCS junction. Any other suggestions?

Daith

Yeah, Arnotts Car Park causes a lot of issues.

LXFlyer

How would businesses on Middle Abbey Street get deliveries, including Arnotts if you banned the turn from OCS?

Bachelors Way is far too small for any form of delivery truck to use.

Access from OCS to Middle Abbey Street is needed for that reason alone.

The amount of traffic making that turn is minimal to say the least.

The turn from OCS to Lower Abbey Street is needed for Bus Éireann, Collins Coaches and several Dublin Bus routes. Most of these stop on OCS, and if you re-routed them would have a massive gap in stops due to not being able to stop on Marlborough St.

That’s not very passenger friendly.

brianc89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120366980#Comment_120366980

The Arnotts side of Abbey street is difficult alright. On the East side though, it's hardly unreasonable to relocate the BE and Collins buses. As for DB routes, upon completion of Bus Connects, I didn't think any routes will need to make that turn?

Citrus_8

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120353474#Comment_120353474

Relatively quick? Is this a joke? It should be 7-10 min max. PT in Ireland, particularly the Luas, are very slow.

brianc89

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120367410#Comment_120367410

This just reflects my expectations!!

Also, the journey planner on TFI, which I used a few times recently, showed 20minutes on Luas (4minutes per stop) between Heuston and Connolly.

I was checking connections for my mum from Belfast to Galway via train and it massively over-estimates the connection time in Dublin, especially when you include waiting times for a Luas.

Citrus_8

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120367544#Comment_120367544

Dublin is not that huge city, but because of a poor infrastructure it feels big as it takes much longer to get to the places as it should.

alentejo

Some things about the center of Dublin which I cant figure out regarding traffic and public transport.

Compared to 20 years ago, there is far less car traffic in the city center, yet public transport times on buses has remained slow.

OCS for example is primarily taxis and buses, yet it seams to take an age to get from OC bridge up to Parnell Sq! I think Dublin City center is a peak bus! New transport channels are needed including metros and tunnels.

There is also a over reliance on traffic lights. Yes , you do need traffic lights at certain junctions, however there should be way more zebra style crossings and road design which caters for pedestrians, but allow public transport to move a little bit more freely.

markpb

Considering the enormous volume of bus passengers alighting and boarding in the city centre, there is zero infrastructure to support them. Buses weave in and out between each other and to avoid traffic and stopped buses, queue for bus stops and board near (but not at) bus stops. It’s an efficiency nightmare. And there’s before you see the space dedicated to parking out of service buses, a necessary evil that could be better managed with designated bus garages and facilities for bus drivers.

And that’s before you think about the lack of seats or shelter of any kind. Luas passengers get both of those (in limited amounts) but bus passengers are stuck in limbo.

Pixel Eater

Why do some Luas only go to Parnell and turn back southwards? Why don't they all simply go to Broombridge?

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120378683#Comment_120378683

There is far higher demand on the core Sandyford-Parnell section than the rest of the route.

Service patterns are generally Sandyford-Broombridge and Brides Glen-Parnell.

By turning trams at Parnell you deliver maximum capacity between there and Sandyford.

Ronald Binge Redux

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120351147#Comment_120351147

Cut and cover? My God it would never have been built. It was bad enough when people were spreading ridiculous scare stories about 'Dublin never recovering from Luas'/Red built to 4'8.5" and Green built to 5'3" etc ad nauseum. When you have trams queuing up to cross OCS then there is something fundamentally wrong and clearly the NTA have zero interest in addressing that.

road_high

This is the beauty of an underground. You avoid all this mayhem. That’s what Dublin needs but try impressing that onto the decision makers

Ronald Binge Redux

Dug by unseen moles and with evaporating spoil no doubt.

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120369754#Comment_120369754

To be fair, the number of bus routes terminating in the city centre has dropped significantly in recent years, and many of the old termini reallocated to LUAS.

But what you are seeing on a daily basis presently is increased numbers of buses parked up due to there being no driver available to take over the second half of a journey on a cross-city route as a result of the ongoing driver shortage.

Beta Ray Bill

I've experienced this too, it's an absolute pain.

The sad reality here is that the Luas Red line design was fudged. Red line intersects far to many very busy roads. It's widely accepted now that if you were to build a new rail line of any type, it needs to be either elevated or ran under ground to avoid these issues. Ireland went for the cheap option again.

I think its one of the main reasons why the Green line is such a success (Built on an old railway line) when compared to the Red line as it intersects very few roads up until Stephens Green

brianc89

I can't understand why they don't overhaul traffic on those Red Line city centre streets. There are loads of rat runs there which I use regularly, but they should massively restrict that.

A bunch of one way streets and local access only streets would massively decrease the conflicts with the Luas line.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120411590#Comment_120411590

Remember the little diddy trams the Red Line was saddled with at first - emblematic of the complete lack of vision.