What would they have done with the Twin Towers if they hadn't collapsed completely?

Brid Hegarty

Take the north tower that was hit first, and hit higher up than the second tower; lets say the fire it created just went out after a while. What would they have done to the building then? Could it have been salvaged? For anyone who remembers it when they saw it on TV just after the first tower was hit; what were you expecting the end would be?

I'm guessing that no matter what happened after the second tower was hit, that because it was because it was hit so far down, that they'd have had to demolish it if it didn't fall.

Oops!

Your answering your own question.

o1s1n

It really must have been something else to see them falling in person.

I visited New York in 2002 and the sheer size of the hole left in the landscape at ground zero was a sight to behold. Couldn't get my head around trying to imagine that two skyscrapers had stood there.

BrianD3

I only heard about the attacks after the South tower had already collapsed. Rushed home to watch sky news and still didn't expect to see the North come down. I well remember the camera was focused on the top of the tower, the large mast on the roof started to move down and that was it.

Even If the North had stayed standing would the foundations have been compromised by the South collapse, necessitating hugely expensive works?

silliussoddius

The thermites would have got to them eventually.

Jim_Hodge

As the OP answered his own question are we just reverting to another 'where were you when the twin towers were hit?'

buried

Built a Third Tower.

And called the place "Ground Adidas"

Graces7

A shocking sight... They would have had to down the rest for safety due to associated damage to foundations and structure of the explosion .. I was on " chat" on the internet when it happened, to a journalist friend in the US. The internet chat facility was a great support to so many that day as the shock waves reverberated .

Brid Hegarty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120295785#Comment_120295785

Of course you'd have to be nasty... like all smokers are. I didn't answer my own question, I'd said "I'm guessing" what the outcome would be; and that was only with regard to just one of the towers.

Brid Hegarty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120296631#Comment_120296631

Can't see how it would weaken the foundations. If the bombing in 1993 didn't weaken the foundations, then this hardly would've.

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120300766#Comment_120300766

It's really hard to know. The force exerted by a big plane like a Boing 767 traveling at a few hundred km/h would be huge.

A B-25 flew into the Empire State Building in 1945 and it's still standing today.

Size wise though it's a hell of a lot smaller than a 767. Great comparison below showing the sheer size of what hit the WTC versus a B-25.

Lewis_Benson

Built a GAA pitch.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120300928#Comment_120300928

Was there grants available ?

AllForIt

l think they would have taken the shorter one and put it on top of the other one.

Lewis_Benson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120440170#Comment_120440170

Indeedn there was.

Danny Healy Rae and Micheal Conners O'MacGillicuddy put up the fees out of a local raffle for a 1994 Rover 216, they made 600 pounds!

kirk.

What about the fella that did the tightrope walk between them

cj maxx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120442678#Comment_120442678

I have that doc ‘man on wire ‘ recorded

Electric Gypsy

If the north tower was the only one hit, and if the fire eventually went out, then they'd only have had to re-build about 15 floors.

If only one tower fell and the other was left intact, then there'd be more pressure to rebuild a new tower, which of course would have to be identical. And that would be interesting, if there were two towers looking the same, but with one having been built with dated building regulation codes, and the other being a house of cards in the event of an severe accident. A lot of people at the time wanted to rebuild the towers exactly as they were, and Donald Trump was a big advocate for this; as he of course wouldn't really empathise with the fact that people had died there!

https://www.quora.com/WTC-One-is-a-strong-building-Would-the-same-attack-that-happened-with-the-Twin-Towers-be-capable-of-bringing-down-WTC-One

kirk.

How would they get the stuff up to rebuild

I thought these cranes went.up with the building

Strumms

The B-25 would have had multiple tonnes less fuel than the 767. It weighed multiple tonnes less itself, a much smaller airframe.

The B-25 would have hit at a far slower speed.

SuperBowserWorld

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120443548#Comment_120443548

Physics is amazing.

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120443548#Comment_120443548

You will note I touched on those things with the comparison photo showing the absolutely massive difference between the two planes.

Will_I_Amnt

Some buildings around the towers were taken down, and they had to take them down one brick at a time and analyze ever single brick for any tiny specs of human remains (just as was done with the debris from the towers themselves) to assist in the process of issuing death certificates.

Sad.

orourkeda1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120442678#Comment_120442678

That guy should donate his testicles to medical reserach.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120442678#Comment_120442678

No one will ever repeat that !

Brid Hegarty

I wonder if they could have actually saved a few lives by having a helicopter hover close to the north tower above the impact zone, and throwing a rope to people hanging out the windows. If the person tied the rope around their waste (through the belt), and if the helicopter pulled off at the right angle, then my guess is that a few lives have been saved! I wouldn’t blame anyone for not thinking of this at the time.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120451709#Comment_120451709

definately ....

or if they had a big slide, and they could have slid down and landed in the Hudson....

MEGA BRO WOLF 5000

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120442745#Comment_120442745

Where have you it "recorded", 1995?

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120451724#Comment_120451724

Apologies. That was a very stupid suggestion................

Where would they have stored all the lifejackets required for it !!!!!??

Duh ..... Silly me.

Brid Hegarty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120451752#Comment_120451752

Well your suggestion depends on an ‘if’, mine doesn’t. As in if the clock could be turned back, that would be the only way to save lives within the time limit.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120451783#Comment_120451783

Maybe if they had put the lifejackets over their desks, or under their seats !!! AHA !

Or would parachutes have been a better idea?

Could store them in the bottom drawer of desks .......

But no, lifting a couple of thousand out by helicopter one at a time, is better ....... Why wasnt it used ?

Its a pity no one thought of that before it happened....22 years ago.....

rossie1977

Chief architect suggested the Natwest tower be demolished after the IRA bomb in 93 and Natwest was nowhere near as damaged at WTC

https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/art/news/architecture-update-reprieve-for-the-natwest-tower-1486176.html

Brid Hegarty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120451834#Comment_120451834

Who said a couple of thousand???????? In reality they might have ended up saving 10. Or maybe they could have got 30… who knows. But it would be worth it?

Why didn’t anyone think of it? Well maybe someone did, and maybe someone like you mocked the idea and stopped it going ahead.

Jim_Hodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120451709#Comment_120451709

This wasn't a movie, you know.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120452963#Comment_120452963

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/poor-info-hindered-9-11-rescue/

Couldnt land on the roof due to antaena ...

And how could the hook a belt around terrified people hanging out of windows.. It would be nigh on impossible.

"Why didn’t anyone think of it? Well maybe someone did"

I would imagine it was suggested, and immediately discounted......

mojesius

One of the police helicopter pilots was filmed on a documentary (Nat Geo 6-part "9/11 - One day in America" . They said the South tower was completely engulfed, so landing on the roof was out of the question. They said there was a clear patch on the north tower roof where they could have landed, but there was no one there to rescue, they got so close, they could see pebbles on the roof but no people there :(

https://youtu.be/rspC_2ujO24

(53:25 for next 3 or so mins.

Warning that it contains upsetting accounts/scenes).

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120453747#Comment_120453747

"age restricted "... blah blah blah ...... 🙄

mojesius

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120453756#Comment_120453756

Why the roll eyes?

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120453763#Comment_120453763

because Youtube have deemed it for adult viewing.... 🙄 so you need to sign in etc ...

Jequ0n

I wonder why nobody thought about giving the towers a really stern “don’t **** with me” look. Surely they would have thought twice about collapsing then.

mojesius

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120453777#Comment_120453777

Yeah, there's a lot more 'raw' footage and accounts than typical 9/11 TV documentaries so has the age restriction applied.

Coming back to the discussion regarding parachutes etc., From reading some survivors' and witnesses' accounts online, many of those who worked in skyscrapers afterwards invested in parachutes and stored under their desks. I'd imagine you'd need some significant training to be able to confidently use them in an emergency situation with fire roaring around you

Brid Hegarty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120453715#Comment_120453715

Hanging out of windows?? You’re not going to sneak that one past me. They weren’t literally hanging out. If it were me, I could hold my breath for a few secs while I’d step back from the window to tie the rope onto me. The only issue would be that someone might jump before instructed to do so. I suppose the next thing you’ll say is that they wouldn’t be able to throw the rope from the chopper without it getting blown back by the wind!

The north took about an hour an 45 minutes to fall. I do wonder how long after impact the last jumper was.

Jim_Hodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455186#Comment_120455186

You honestly think it's just a matter of throwing a rope a hundred floors up, with turbulence and the rush of air created by the fire itself?

cj maxx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120451732#Comment_120451732

No St Patricks Day. Documentaries are normally shown after the event 😷

Brid Hegarty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455275#Comment_120455275

If it were just a matter of throwing a rope then they’d probably have been able to save about 40 lives. I wouldn’t expect it to work that well though. In reality they’d probably have to throw it two or three times for someone to catch it. You’d of course want a light weight tied to the end of the rope before throwing it. In any case, they’d definitely have saved a few lives.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120455659#Comment_120455659

Do you play GTA a lot ?? 🙄

I really want to get into the pros/cons of how ridiculous this suggestion about dangling ropes towards windows with weights on them while theres a raging fire beneath , whilst trying to navigate in between/around skyscrapers, with the heat of said fire blasting upwards towards the helicopter creating an updraft with 100's (?) of workers trying to get out in panic .....

But i wont ...................

Brid Hegarty

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120463900#Comment_120463900

Navigating between skyscrapers???! It’s not like they’re 20 feet apart!!!! Nice try though. But the pilot would do the navigating before - not ‘while’ - the rope would be being thrown. There’s 4 sides to the building; it’s a matter of going to the one where there’s least smoke. A bit of smoke isn’t necessarily that dangerous… many people passed right through the impact zone in the south tower and survived. That's a fact.

greenspurs

Im not being serious......

I hope youre not either ..............................

NattyO

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058286124/what-would-they-have-done-with-the-twin-towers-if-they-hadnt-collapsed-completely

I doubt they'd have ever gotten any engineer or architect to sign off on the structural integrity of the building after the damage it sustained in the initial hit, not to mention the fire damage afterwards.

The only solution would have been controlled demolition and rebuild.

greenspurs

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120465403#Comment_120465403

"controlled demolition"

Some argue that that happened on the day .....................

gameoverdude

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120465354#Comment_120465354

I'm lost here.

Have you ever seen the twin towers? They were pretty big. Not to mention the surrounding buildings. It's downtown NYC!

A couple of helicopters to rescue people was never on the agenda. The thought of it being an idea on even a normal day is ridiculous!