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3000 km of hedgerow destroyed per year

  • 03-02-2023 7:39pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 6,437 ✭✭✭


    So, very little native forest and 3000 km of hedgerow removed every year.

    What a depressing country this is.

    And if the argument is "blocks the view of the road", crops up, can't trees/hedgerows be planted away from roads ..

    What do people want to pass onto their kids ? Tarmac and potholes ?



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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 13,074 ✭✭✭✭jmayo


    I would love to know where the 3000km are?

    I have seen feck all removed over the last number of years and have known people fined for doing so.



  • Registered Users Posts: 81,447 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    About 80,000~95,000 km of road in Ireland

    3,000/yr would be at such a relative rate you indeed, might not notice the frog boiling. 10 years to notice when a third is gone, etc.




  • Registered Users Posts: 2,530 ✭✭✭Car99


    I see alot getting cleared down our way , limerick/tipp, to make way for more super green forced grass with not a weed I sight for some reason.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,492 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,064 ✭✭✭gussieg


    Living in maynooth /celbridge /kilcock area, its disappearing at a fast and saddening rate. Concrete and roundabouts is all we'll have soon.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 441 ✭✭Conversations 3


    For every Km of hedgerow you remove you have to replant elsewhere or else you get a massive fine.

    Satellite inspections are particularly good at picking this up.

    Although the county council could be a different story and do what they like.

    Post edited by Conversations 3 on


  • Registered Users Posts: 81,447 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    This is the length of your intestine:

    Do you know how many lengths of string you could lay out on irelands roads without ever touching one another?

    (It's about 95,000 km, according to Statista..) Nobody said it was a single road from A to B going 3,000 km as the crow flies, hey.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,074 ✭✭✭✭jmayo


    The only places I really see removal is where someone is building a house.

    The one that has really change from years ago is the cutting of hedges in the backend.

    Years ago they were trimmed back earlier in the year so that they weren't growing out all over the road.

    Now you find they are cut back to nothing for the winter as they are only cut once a year at the very end of growth.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,530 ✭✭✭Car99


    I presume hedgerow isn't just roadside hedgerow it include all hedgerow including those between fields



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,149 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    Yes it would include field boundaries.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,492 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    This is the claim - So, very little native forest and 3000 km of hedgerow removed every year.

    every year?? really?? Those were some busy people during 2 years of Covid lockdown, They must have been really busy in the years after the Celtic tiger crash, no the claim every year does not stack up.

    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users Posts: 81,447 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    He said that the organisation is recognising a pattern where large investment companies are buying up large tracts of land and pursuing a "short-term unsustainable form of agriculture, facilitated by the current rules around hedge removal".

    Up to half a kilometre of hedgerow can be removed without environmental assessment or scrutiny.

    In cases above half a kilometre, there needs to be permission.

    Mr Moore said that 95% of applications for hedgerow removal are approved, which he described as a "very worrying pattern".

    Whether it 'stacks up' or not there are reportedly receipts.



  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    Development of land from agricultural to other use is the main one, I think, from working in the field so to speak. Areas near any town or city, you have developments removing hedgerows wholesale. Also road realignments, active travel etc. Some agricultural intensification too, but not the majority. Very few councils, a couple in Dublin and Co. Offaly are trying to halt this.

    There is some replacement by replanting but this stat relates solely to removal. Ecology 101 stuff but generally the more longer established the habitat, eg hedgerow the more diverse, often with concealed (genetic) diversity.

    And I haven't read the report detailing the figure of 3000km, so can't comment on accuracy, but as an order of magnitude it seems possible.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,437 ✭✭✭SuperBowserWorld


    Very little native forest is true

    The hedgerow claim, is something RTE should get proof of before they publish it. They are heavily funded by the tax payer, license payer and advertising ... they should follow through on these claims.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,492 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande


    Another consideration suburbia is not a desert. 13,000-20,000 years ago, this was was a barren ice cap. It because tundra for a while, likely 8,000 years ago the area was heavily forested or a swampy mess. As far as we can tell humans have been active on this island for 8,000 years. In that time both our ancestors and ourselves have been reshaping the landscape to suit our needs. Hedgerows are entirely a man made intervention from the time of the Normans on. The last of the native forests were cut down to build the British navy. During the 18th and 19th centuries the land was mostly used for tillage, which fell off after the end of the corn laws and farmers switched to cattle farming being unable to compete with the United States. Practically everything you see in the Irish countryside today was shaped by man.

    Let's look at suburbia there is no shortage of trees, or shrubs, there is an ecosystem there that supports wildlife. How many of you have bird feeders? That's a real plus for many species compared to the countryside during Winter. Do you think insects have nothing to feed on in these gardens? I spend part of my time Dublin and I've built up a buffet for birds and insects. Right now I have crocus open across the lawn, Daphne in bloom, this is a major plus at this time of year for queen bees and these plants are non native to Ireland. Mice nesting in the compost heap are a problem, but they are managed with cats. During the Summer my garden has lots of bats in the evening and Swifts nest tin the eaves of houses.

    The idea that the country must be turned into a wildlife theme park is ridiculous, the landscape will continue to change. The ubiqutpus magpie did not exist in Ireland before the 11th century, the rabbit came in with the Normans, the collared dove only arrived in the 1960s. The harriers are non native they depend on coniferous forest. Different species will come and go and adapt to the new environment.

    That area you are looking at in suburbia is not mono culture agriculture, it is much more diverse.


    Net Zero means we are paying for the destruction of our economy and society in pursuit of an unachievable and pointless policy.



  • Registered Users Posts: 81,447 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Dublin:

    much diverse (some green cars in there maybe)

    Still just sowing doubts for no reason when its reported there are receipts.



  • Registered Users Posts: 537 ✭✭✭GNWoodd


    The hedgerow claim is BS . There is no way that 3000 km of them are removed . Maybe they are referring to hedges being trimmed ? These folks tend to exaggerate



  • Registered Users Posts: 81,447 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Still just sowing doubts for no reason when its reported there are receipts.



  • Registered Users Posts: 537 ✭✭✭GNWoodd




  • Registered Users Posts: 225 ✭✭rdhma


    3000 km a year of hedgerow cut is not enough. A danger to road users, blocks any view of the countryside.

    They are man-made, not some gift from nature and plenty of other countries don't have them.

    Yes, plant more forestry, create wildlife reserves, wetlands etc. But get rid of the roadside hedgerows.



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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 12,614 Mod ✭✭✭✭riffmongous


    The figure doesn't seem that unlikely considering the below.

    Estimates of the length of hedgerow in Ireland range from 300,000 - 700,000kms..

    A Teagasc study on the matter

    County specific hedgerow results were presented for Monaghan described by Shirley Clerkin, Heritage Officer, Monaghan County Council as a drumlin, wetland, hedged county...

    The study was split into two phases in 2010; baseline hedges which were randomly chosen from twelve 1km2 squares; and hedges which were perceived to be of High Ecological value, namely townland boundary hedges and those connected to native woodland. Both sets of hedges were re-surveyed and results outlined in this report.

    With the results showing a decade of change, the news is very poor according to Shirley. Extent, floristic composition, physical structure and management of hedges were assessed. In 2010, there was an estimated 12,845 kms of hedges with over 1,000 kms removed in the following decade – based on a survey of 108 hedges. In the 12 sample squares surveyed, over 10 kms were removed. This equates to 0.9% may have be removed annually in County Monaghan, far higher than the EPA estimate of 0.3%. The main reason was agriculture - in three-quarters of the cases.



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,842 ✭✭✭tabby aspreme


    To me this report lost all credence as soon as I read NGO, just more grifters looking to big themselves up, to get on the government funding tit, I'd travel a lot of the country and its very rare to see hedge's/ ditches removed, except for housing or road development, and I'm speaking as someone who's added 600m of hedges and planted 6 hectares of native forestry on my own land .

    It would be more in their line to highlight the absolute shi#show that is the forest service, which anyone trying to plant trees has to deal with.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,209 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    It's a serious thing to remove a hedge on a farm without settings space aside to replace it, the total stock of hedge has increased in the last few years, thankfully.




    I personally have planted about 3km of hedges and will be putting in another 1km this year.


    .



  • Registered Users Posts: 76 ✭✭Condor24


    Where are the Greens on this? Once upon a time they cared about the countryside. Now it's all about 'cycle access' and 'sustainability'. All urban Greens have forgotten their roots.



  • Registered Users Posts: 14,149 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    I was answering another poster and confirming that the total figure for removal includes non roadside hedgerows.

    Clearly you are doing a good job on your farm and are not part of the problem.



  • Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 38,684 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    There is a huge amount of nonsense in there.

    Let's look at suburbia there is no shortage of trees, or shrubs, there is an ecosystem there that supports wildlife.

    Many plants in urban areas are non-native and therefore useless for bird nesting purposes.

    During the Summer my garden has lots of bats in the evening and Swifts nest tin the eaves of houses.

    Swift don't nest in hedges or trees so not sure why you're mentioning them. However, with modern building methods, their numbers have dramatically fallen due to the lack of suitable nesting sites.

    Much of the rest of what you posted really is daft but the cherry on the cakes this bit:

    Different species will come and go and adapt to the new environment.

    So we should just say f**k it and let whatever happens happen?



  • Registered Users Posts: 35,555 ✭✭✭✭BorneTobyWilde


    I believe it, it all adds up, just yesterday I saw a complete hack job done in a housing estate, every tree in the place was cut back, 100% of the budding twigs removed, all that is left is the truck and the stems of large branches.

    Surely that is not the way to prune a tree into shape



  • Registered Users Posts: 81,447 ✭✭✭✭Overheal


    Did you read the article or the posts preceding yours comprehensively?



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,209 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    May well be for that type of tree, I'd guess it is a Lime sub species and like limes very susceptible to cankers.


    I would say that the tree will rebound quickly, hard prunings are like hard times, they can drive success.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 9,489 ✭✭✭John_Rambo


    You're obviously unfamiliar with the byroads & backroads of Ireland if you're using that transcontinental high speed motorway system as a comparable. Take yourself off the motorways in to rural Ireland and you'll see the difference.



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