The Last of Us Megathread - Spoilers

Zero-Cool

Between the current discussions of the show and game across tv and games forums and dancing around spoiler talk, I thought it would be handy to have an open thread to discuss TLOU 1, 2 TV Show, upcoming Factions game and the possibility of TLOU 3 without the need for Spoiler Tags.

So....beware of Spoilers.

I just read that the same guys who voiced the clickers in the game will be doing the show as well which is cool.

I really really hope we see the Abby story play out in the show. I think it would be incredible telly to watch Pedro take a golf club to the head in season 2 and Bella go full on revenge tour and that finale would be unreal but do Naughty Dog really want to go through all that backlash all over again over a new medium?

gimli2112

sigh, what I was trying to say was I hated the direction Mr Druckmann took 2 and while I'll watch the first series I'll be taking a pass on the second.

CastorTroy

I'm thinking they may have to recast Ellie for season 2. At the moment Bella is 19 playing a 14 year old. She's 5' 1.5" (according to imdb) and likely won't grow much more than that. Couldn't really see her taking on someone like Gina Carano in a fight.

Retr0gamer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120123675#Comment_120123675

The small ones are the ones you have to be careful of. Al Pacino in scarface, Joe Pesci in Goodfellas and Casino.

Zero-Cool

Florence Pugh as Abby is a great shout.

https://twitter.com/FirstKnivesClub/status/1614843524486418432?t=Y350XvbP9MpYqxhw8xAZaQ&s=19

Retr0gamer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120130091#Comment_120130091

She is tiny though!

Zero-Cool

That's what Hollywood Steroids are for :)

Oh ****, i just googled and she's 5'3 which is just 5 inches shorter than Abby in game so lifts in her boots, be grand. I think she definitely has the acting chops and likeability to get people on board.

Perhaps introduce her differently though. Have the flashback scene be the introduction of her and her dad before he gets called to the hospital and she finds him dead, might warm people up to the notion of 'yeah, I can see why she wants to go golfing with Joel'.

Will be very interesting to see how the tv show ends it, I'd say it will definitely make the audience more sympathetic to the doctor he kills to soften the blow.

Retr0gamer

Abby is 5'9, not sure Florence can make up that half foot with camera tricks. She is a bit dainty as well. I don't think she could pull off the physicality of Abby.

I actually think that last of us part 2 would work a lot better on tv than as a game. The excess killing and how everyone from their village was like a ninja batman killing hundreds of people was jarring and also made Ellie seem like an even bigger sociopath.

If they make Ellie a lot more relatable rather than the ridiculous unrelatable character she is in the game it might work a bit better. I still think that the existence of part 2 damages the perfect ending, Joel's lie, at the end of last of us. To me that was the start of the breakdown of their relationship due to Joel's selfishness. To see her so close to Joel felt like a betrayal of that ending to me.

Zero-Cool

Yeah TLOU 2 has some great story beats and characters drowned out by combat second, I'm genuinely excited about how they portray it on the show.

I reinstalled TLOU 1 remastered and mid chapter 2, I feel like playing TLOU 2 instead. I only finished it once, at launch, and it was too heavy for another playthrough but I'd like to experience the story again.

Zero-Cool

New blog and YouTube series called Building the Last of Us where they talk about how they created parts of the game and show. Episode 1 all about that intro.

https://youtu.be/Vbzz6A2ElB4

Retr0gamer

I see that the TV show has changed the mode of infection from spores, which actually make sense, to ingestion, or well hinting at it. The Last of Us has a pretty flimsy relationship with science but this one really annoys me.

Zero-Cool

Yeah, they said they couldn't have half the show filmed with the characters in gas masks which is fair enough. Plus the new mode of spreading, tendrils coming out from the mouth, is well creepy.

I started up TLOU 2 again this evening and I forgot how sad the starting of it is, the way Joel is trying to talk to Ellie about a joke he's heard. No confidence and sheepish and Ellie almost treats him like an older relative she has to entertain. Such a contrast to the first game. Great way to show how the ending of the first game broke their relationship before Ellie even found out about the lie.

Zero-Cool

So actor Shannon Berry has been 'followed' by Neil, she followed back and also followed the show, Bella and Pedro. She's the head off Abby in the pic on the right.

https://twitter.com/TheLastofUsNews/status/1616414262091730950?t=3Kk37OMGAY6W8NimwzEhIA&s=19

Retr0gamer

She'd definitely make a great Abby.

Zero-Cool

Hopefully they have Abby show up at the end to at least lay the ground work for season 2 but I think season 2 will only get a good start of they can nail the ending to 1. Playing the first game, my first time reaching the operating room, i opened fire without a 2nd thought just to get Ellie out of there. They will need to nail that same feeling so that when/if Pedro does the same thing, it will feel natural for his character which will only happen if they manage to nail their relationship throughout the season.

Retr0gamer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120136831#Comment_120136831

I hope they use my ending where I shoot him in the foot and he went down like he took a sniper rifle to the chest. Then Joel takes off the doctor's mask and it was Ronaldo all along looking for a penalty.

Zero-Cool

I've never seen The Wilds but she definitely looks the part. Just as interesting, I wonder so they recast an older Ellie for season 2 or just try to mature Bella. She's 19 so v even if there were a few years between seasons, she's not gonna change that much but then a change of actor could be very jarring.

https://twitter.com/gamerweasel123/status/1616530849557610519?t=NFOIq3cewwB8g7TDMjwCPQ&s=19

Riesen_Meal

https://youtu.be/z8XN7eoZr0Y

The alternate ending should have been put in as an Easter egg or something...

Exclamation Marc

If there is a season 2, there is no way they'll recast Ellie. The gap between the two timelines is too close should they proceed to screen to warrant a change. Continuity to the TV viewer is way more important than the height of a character in the source material that might annoy weirdly demanding gamers.

Zero-Cool

Yeah, I'm sure Bella has the acting chops to become hardened as needed.

As for the alternate ending, i really hope Mazin/Neil has Merle do the same thing where she breaks into song without telling Pedro to see how he reacts. Probably just WTF instead of Troy starting to sing as well :)

Zero-Cool

Just played through the golf club scene in part 2. Only second time I've done that as in my 2nd playthrough to get the plat, i skipped all cutscenes, couldn't go through them again. It's mad seeing how many times i played through part 1 and never skipped even Sarah's scene. Part 2 just hiys different, it's going to be a grim watch on hbo but should still be mesmerising telly.

Zero-Cool

HBO show renewed for season 2. Roll on Abby! I wouldn't be surprised if they changed it up somewhat to reduce the death threats of whatever poor actress they get to play Abby but i can imagine the shock of that happening to Pedro from people who would have no idea what was going to happen.

Zero-Cool

https://twitter.com/scarymcvies/status/1619096203249209344?t=T4NjBbo9ohRDP8rA5cmadA&s=19

HBO gonna go fully in with that scene.

Sad Professor

Annie Wersching who played Tess in the game has died.

Zero-Cool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120174870#Comment_120174870

Just saw that, shocking! :(

https://twitter.com/Neil_Druckmann/status/1619787693600428032?t=miRhpAp_Qltb9ZaFxUy2ow&s=19

Penn

Damn, that's awful. Was disappointed she didn't get to play Tess in the show because I thought she was great in the game, and I remember her from 24 before that.

RIP

Grumpypants

That was one great episode (3). A deviation from the game but one that was well worth doing and still gets them to the same stage.

The Raging Bile Duct

It was a fantastic episode. Had me and the daughter in bits by the end. The open window was a nice touch that brought the menu screen to mind.

Sephiroth_dude

Wow just wow, very moving fantastic episode, so different from the game which I loved.

McFly85

Phenomenal episode. Completely different from what I was expecting but in a great way.

My only slight disappointment is missing out on Bill and Ellie interacting - but it was a worthy trade-off.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120180762#Comment_120180762

Yeah their scenes together in the game were great, but ultimately don't really serve any narrative purpose as they barely have any time together and are just antagonistic towards each other for it.

A fantastic deviation from the game though, and something that couldn't have been done in the game but suits the show perfectly and adds far more weight to Bill's story and the effect it has on Joel going forward.

Jordan 199

Well well well, I played both The Last of Us Games but had no interesting watching the TV show. That's going to change now.

Zero-Cool

Incredible, just **** incredible. Last episode very similar to the game, nailed it. This episode, nothing like the game, NAILED IT!

The only thing. Ooooonly thing I'm not sure of... I kind of wanted Ellie to find the porno mag and toss it at the end before panning to the window shot but it probably would have sullied the character of Bill. It suited the game Bill but not TV Bill do probably the best choice.

And now I wish we had a Left Behind style dlc where you play Bill where you and Frank repair the town, grow strawberries, fight some raiders and grow old together :D

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120185075#Comment_120185075

The truck was fairly well stocked with stuff from Bill & Franks. Porno mag scene could still be the opening of next week's episode. I'd actually be kind of surprised if they don't do it since it's such a well known scene and does a lot to show Ellie & Joel's relationship evolving, as well as Ellie's playful/joking side.

Though yeah, it might sully the character of Bill a bit.

Zero-Cool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120185623#Comment_120185623

I checked the teaser for Ep 4, something I never do with shows but was mad to see what's coming up. Next episode looks great already. And yeah, actually looks like a good time for her to find the mag as it would have let some time pass from ep 3 to be funny and not ruin any moods but I wouldn't be surprised if left out.

As for Ep 3, I was so happy when Ellie turned from the clock to show her game shirt, truly a "she said the thing" moment and then Joel with his shirt. This is what happens when you let people run an adaption who actually love the source and not try to make it completely their own thing.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120185788#Comment_120185788

Actually, I wonder if maybe they'll change the mag scene that instead of it being Bill's it's something they find in an abandoned camp/hideout while making their way through the next area or something. A way to keep the scene but remove it from being Bill's magazine.

Grumpypants

The game needed that mag scene as a vehicle to confirm that Bill was gay. As up to that point it had only been loosely implied.

Bill only refers to Frank as a "partner", he says something along the lines of "that he once had a partner he cared for. But caring for someone in this world is only good for getting you killed".

I don't think the TV show had that same problem 😃

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120186166#Comment_120186166

Yeah if I remember right I think Druckmann said recently that Bill being gay was actually a late addition to the game/motion capture. So it makes sense that they added that scene to confirm it. But I think it's such a great scene between Ellie & Joel that it'd be a shame if they don't include it in some way.

CastorTroy

No problem with it being Bill's since he was a gay man who hasn't been with another man until he met Frank so pretty believable that he would have some gay magazines. True they may have been dumped over the years since.

Listening to a podcast and they mention making Last of Us part 3 and how it would double as being a backbone for the TV show. Was thinking this isn't a good thing. I know the previous games were made in a format easily adaptable to TV but if they go into the third with the show in mind it might affect things.

I remember reading Order of the Phoenix, which was released after the Harry Potter films started and it felt at times that it was written with the film in mind.

Zero-Cool

Yeah, making a game, as big and established, as TLOU 3 with a tv show in mind would definitely affect development but you never know, it might mean that Mazin would be a writer/director to ensure the quality remains and crossover would be seamless.

I wonder what they are thinking though Abby to find the Firefly island and go about helping people like Lev while Ellie decides to look for Fireflies for the possibility there's another doctor who can finish the job on her. You could even get Ellie and Abby meeting up again but this time on the same side. That would close the circle of the trilogy imo but it could be very forced if handled wrong. Also, it would need some big story to accompany it as it might be predictable if the main story is that Ellie goes looking for a doctor. No way would they finish that on anything other than a happy ending (Ellie sacrificing herself and vaccine starts to roll out).

Retr0gamer

They really should just tell another story in the same universe. For me the original Last of Us ended perfectly and the Last of Us 2 not only added nothing but effectively damages the narrative of the first game when taken into context. Maybe do an Abby centric story. Her story was pretty much wrapped up on Part 2 so could be easy enough to take her character and put her in another situation. Ellie was just a boring terribly written character in part 2 and I'd have no interest in revisiting that Ellie.

Zero-Cool

Id' say the backlash for 2 will make a serious impact on 3. I'd be all for an Abby centric game but ND will probably think about hurt sales because of it. I also see them wanting to do right by Ellie with the backlash she got as well and finish her story in a positive light. I'd say a 3 will definitely happen anyway, as long as they give us some Left Behind / Bill & Frank style chapters or even optional side quests to break up the 'clear room of enemies' scenarios.

As for the show, I wonder will Joel still get impaled? I can't see it being very believable for Bella to hoist Pedro around and onto a horse. I can see her saving him while using Franks Gun and Joel will probably still get injured but not as bad maybe. Saying that, I'd still love to see that scene remade in the show.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120187682#Comment_120187682

Joel will almost definitely still get impaled. Maybe they won't have him fall off the horse (or they might throw in a line after he recovers that he passed out for a minute but then was able to get back onto the horse), but such an integral part of the story that they'd have to keep it in in some form.

As for adapting TLOU2, they better give Joel his tee-off time. Forget about the reaction it got from some gamers, it's the absolute crux of the story that they might reshape it a little bit, but it still has to happen. It's why I thought they might do a season of show based on the 5 years between the games (and so the flashback scenes from the game would be in that season), just to get more out of Pedro Pascal, but if they're doing TLOU2, they just have to do it and get it over with.

Zero-Cool

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120190548#Comment_120190548

I'm playing TLOU 2 again and I had said that maybe the show should introduce Abby at the very end so it's not a complete shock when the golf club scene comes around but I think it would ruin the moment. In the game, You're not supposed to be thinking about anyone except Ellie so I think it would dilute the ending a bit. If they were doing a season between games, then you'd have to tell the parallel story of Abby with the season ending with the golf club scene. That would make season 3 fairly grim watching then but maybe it would work. If they did that, we'd all know Abby is gearing up to look for Joel, would be an interesting build up.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120190882#Comment_120190882

Yeah I think it's more likely that instead of doing a season showing the five years between TLOU1 & 2 (and manufacturing some big conflict in Jackson to justify it), they'll do TLOU2 over two seasons. I doubt they'll do it like the game where one season would be Ellie's POV and the next Abby's plus epilogue, but we'll probably see both Ellie & Abby's story in Detroit running alongside each other.

There'll definitely be complaints about Joel's death in the show, but it might be more palatable to a TV audience because gamers were expecting to play as Ellie but with Joel along side her for most or several parts of the game, and in fairness they were kinda sold that in the trailers. Having Joel die so early, and then having to play half the game as his killer without Ellie even being part of that side of the story until the end.... the TV show is unlikely to face such strong pushback from viewers even though they'll be sad Joel has been killed off.

But I just hope Mazin/Druckmann don't chicken out of it just because of the reception to the game's story. The main issue I had with TLOU2's story was just the pacing of it, and I think that's easily solved by being able to tell the story through a TV show.

CastorTroy

I'd say the only mention of Abby might come near the end with the doctor, similar to the flashback we got in the second game, so it doesn't feel like they retroactively gave him a daughter

Retr0gamer

It won't be the first time that a TV show has killed off a main character or someone hyped as a main character. I mean it's a trope as old as Psycho. It was just gamers being spoiled morons, TLOU2 has lots issues with it's storytelling but Joel definitely isn't one of them.

Honestly, TLOU2 might work better as a TV show. The narrative dissonance created from having to make a videogame won't be an issue with the show so Ellie might actually just come across as a sociopath rather than a ridiculous unrelatable post apocalyptic ninja mary sue. They could maybe have it that she is becoming more like Joel which Joel didn't want for Ellie but his lies and selfishness ended up making her that way.

Grumpypants

The part of TLOU2 where Tommy is sniping at you (as Abby) was well done, by the time I got to Tommy I hated him and took pleasure in smacking him into the water.

I always felt that they could have done that with the Joel death. You start the game as Abby and the whole time you are tracking "someone that killed your dad". There isn't much more explained about who they are. The Abby portion of the game was so much better and by the end of it I was invested in Abby.

They could have built the game in a way that by the time you got to catch "your father's killer" you as the player are on board with killing them. Then when you roll over the dead body you see it's Joel, and Ellie screams. Cut to black :)

It makes you the Joel Killer, not Abby.

The way it worked out you were just annoyed with the cut over and it took a few hours to come around to Abby. It was helped by Ellie being so unlikeable.

But the whole reason for falling out with Joel was daft, he did exactly what every parent would do 100% of the time. Who would leave a bunch of lunatics murder a child on the very unlikely chance it leads to some cure for a bunch of people you hate?

Penn

I just hope if they adapt TLOU2 for the show, they get the most important detail right.

Rope physics, and lots of scenes where Ellie/Abby have to plug in an incredibly long cable.

McFly85

Agree that 2 might suit TV much better. The first one brilliantly combined gameplay and story but the second one felt like they were trying to wrap a narrative around a game they wanted to be 25 hours long, and as a result I found I was just more aware of playing a game than being engrossed in what was going on.

I fully expect any Abby focused episodes to flow better than her saying she’s going to hide out in an aquarium for a few days but constantly leaving to do missions.

I have no problem with the big plot points that happened during the game and expect them to be replicated(although I suspect Joel’s death will be at the end on season 2 to get as much out of Pascal as they can), but I expect a significant departure in how that story is told now that they don’t have to worry about gameplay.

Retr0gamer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120191161#Comment_120191161

No matter if you think he did the right thing. He did the right thing for the wrong reason then lied to Ellie about it. It's that inherent selfishness which is what destroyed that relationship. Hell it's what the whole first game is about. The lie at the end. The minute he lied to her that relationship was doomed. It's why I love that ending so much.