Fitness programs for over 40’s

mickysquint

Hi folks

i apologise if this has been asked a million times but I need help.

I’m a 42 year old male’ 6”2’ and weigh 18.5 stone. I’ve always had a big frame, well built but not hench. Over the last year I haven’t really been a regular at the gym but I still play soccer. In that time I’ve piled on a stone and a half, as a result of this I’m starting develop health issues due to my weight, I also feel that my mental health is taking a pounding and I may be suffering with depression because I feel so low about myself.

I’ve been back at the gym for a month now doing mostly weights but I feel like I’m just treading water.

I promise I’m not looking for a magic quick fix answer because it’s the new year and I’m thinking of the summer, I know there’s a lot of work to do, and I know it won’t be easy, I feel that I’m running out of time to get in to a shape I can be proud of. 

so I just need some recommendations on training programs that people in their 40’s have tried and felt they had positive results from, I would like to lose weight but also build muscle.

any help would be massively appreciated 

cheers

Black Sheep

You can turn this around. You've gained a stone and a half - 6.5kg - and it's completely something that you can pull back if you put in place a structured lifting programme, keep up your soccer, and make some diet changes.

LIFTING

In terms of lifting there is a thread we have on the forum that is titled 'beginner programs' but the truth is these are proven lifting programs that anyone can use. Even if you know your way around a gym then there are worse things to pick up and implement.

Beginner Strength Programmes — boards.ie - Now Ye're Talkin'

If you are not that confident in what you're doing in the gym, or are way off what your previous bests were, you could look at running something like Greyskull LP. It's a three times a week program based around compound lifts, and would leave you a couple of other days to do soccer or some easy cardio on.

If you are more intermediate you could look at 5/3/1 which is very customisable.

You can find PDFs / explanations / books galore pertaining to both of these online.

SOCCER / CARDIO

Keep up your soccer, make no changes.

If there's another day you can do some cardio then do something like 45 minutes of hard walking. Outdoors, fine, or if in a gym then set the treadmill on an incline.

You're walking rather than running because in that 45 minutes, if you go at a good clip, you're going to burn 500+ calories but won't have an impact on your lifting sessions.

If you have an appetite for harder cardio then have at it, but if you're lifting 3-4 days a week and focusing on progressing that, then it don't overdo it.

DIET

The hardest and least fun part.

The reality is your weight gain could be partly a result of a more sedentary lifestyle, fewer steps, less movement etc. but the chances are it's largely to do with your diet.

Cut out liquid calories like juices, soft drinks ... Reduce your alcohol intake ... Reduce your deserts, chocolate, cakes ... Reduce your carbohydrate sources (Rice, potato, bread, pasta) at meals ... Eat protein with every meal ...

Potentially it's worth seeing a dietician or a nutritionist if you have the money to spend and want a third party to look at your diet.

Another route, if you're tech savvy, is to try myfitnesspal and work out what your daily calorie intake should be, and then spend a couple of weeks logging what you're actually taking in.

It's not enjoyable, as I said, but weight loss can be achieved solely through calorie reduction if you have the commitment. It's probably easier to do a mixture of training and modest dietary changes.

swededmonkey

if it fits in your budget, a coach with weekly check ins would be beneficial. They can tailor a diet and training programme for you and its tweaked weekly depending on how you're responding. I'm working with a guy from Manchester who is considerably cheaper than what's been charged in Ireland for online coaching and I haven't seen a difference in terms of quality. Most of all, he's knowledgable, understanding and realistic. PM me if you would like his details.

mickysquint

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120083299#Comment_120083299

Thank you so much for the help. I looked at the programs and I’m going to try the Greyskull LP for a couple of months starting from tomorrow. I’ve also spent a bit of time tailoring my diet plan.

thanks a million Black Sheep

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120089373#Comment_120089373

Yeah maybe that’s not a bad idea, I think I’ll try the Black Skull LP program for a couple of months first and then see how I’m going. I might pm you if this doesn’t work.

thanks for the help

Mr. CooL ICE

Ditto on the beginner programs. There is no need to go looking for a specific program because you're in your 40s. There may be a case for it in your 70s, but the principles would still be the same.

Regarding diet; use something like MFP to track what you eat. Whatever about your calorie count; basing every meal around a protein source is a great way to start. Try to ensure any meal/snack has 20+g of protein in it is a great way to satiate your hunger.

Cill94

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120242798#Comment_120242798

Agreed. In my experienxe the only thing that changes as people get older is that everything needs to be of slightly higher quality in order to make progress without getting hurt. Training, food, and sleep.

The actual nuts and bolts of what to do are the same for a teenager or a 70 year old.

Bellie1

Find this very interesting. Reading conflicting advise online for older lifters( over 40?). Some saying the body can cope with less volume, others saying less intensity. Do you think when you're starting out, there isn't much difference in programming needed due to age ,but as progress to being intermediate and beyond, then need to modify to account for age?

Black Sheep

Non-training related lifestyle elements such as diet, sleep, alcohol intake and so on will have a significant impact on what kind of training anyone (any age) can tolerate and make good progress on.

It's definitely true someone in their 20s can probably get away with paying less attention to these factors, but they still matter. Someone in their 40s or older must take them more seriously. But people can be overly conservative and go overboard with this. Rather than applying blanket advice to older lifters to 'do less volume' or 'use less intensity' it is important to evaluate the individual. If the person has their diet dialled in and is sleeping 8 hours a night then honestly there is nothing written in stone to say they won't respond well to a program a 25 year old is using.

I'm 42 and I train 4 days a week, pretty high volume and intensity at the moment, and another factor is that I've just always trained this way, I'm very acclimatised to it.

But if you have a busy shift worker with diet and sleep issues then yes, they might not want to be doing that programme if it is particularly demanding. But I'd personally say that rather than cutting volume or interfering with intensity, unless you really know what you're doing programming-wise it's probably better to just pick a different programme, or - better yet - something with a degree of auto-regulation built in.

The other thing I'd throw out is that if the trainee is a novice lifter then whether they're 20 or 40 it's worth bearing in mind the fatigue they can create for themselves is limited by the relatively low loads they're moving. It's not until they are starting to get stronger that recovery becomes of great concern. There are people who are worried about CNS fatigue and supposed recovery challenges of doing heavy compound lifts but honestly most casual trainees aren't lifting enough weight that it's something they need to be overly worried about other than making a decent stab at sleep and a good diet.

Cill94

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120247394#Comment_120247394

I've not seen this be the case with the people in their 60-70s that I train. They use similar volume and intensity to everyone else, it just has to be built slowly from their current ability level.

The issue is more that people will not train for their whole lives, while also experiencing some age related loss in strength and muscle mass, and then try some amount of volume or intensity that's far above what they're ready for.

My nearly 70 year old uncle had to start with kettlebell deadlifts and band-assisted push-ups. But now he can do 120kg deadlifts and weighted push-ups, making him in better shape than the average 20 year old.

Bellie1

Thanks for replies . Another question about older lifters for ye. Have been lifting seriously for close to 5 years now, 3 of these with trainers and various programs myself in between. Had injuries thrown in at various times but otherwise have lifted every week, trying to progress. I'm very competitive with myself and always comparing to what lifted at my peak 2 years ago ,and trying to reach that. Am 53 now so should I accept that I will be doing well to maintain my current strength and expect eg 5% drop in the next few years. I've been looking at powerlifting results and there seems to be a drop in lifts over each decade.I'm very dedicated and feel I'm putting the work in, sleeping 9 hours most nights etc, but just can't lift the same as before. Am trying to do one max set in a session that is close to my peak(2 years ago). I guess I'm wondering whether I'm not pushing myself enough ( really don't think this is the case), if I need to change programs( and if so, what might work best) or is it normal to be a little weaker as get over 50 years., especially if a late intermediate lifter ( which I reckon I am).

Cill94

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120316237#Comment_120316237

The the thing that stops older lifters is generally that they start getting hurt too often to be able to string together enough progressive overload. You will hear older guys say that they used to be able to deadlift or bench 'X' but they just kept injuring themselves too much to keep it up. Ageing is in many ways the steady loss of the organism to adapt and regenerate itself.

Tbh you probably know the answer to this better than anyone here. Getting stronger, building more muscle ultimately requires more effort across the board. If you can't confidently say whether you are working harder than you every have on your training, sleep, and diet, then it's probably not age and just that you need to sacrifice more for more gains. Particularly because it sound like you've not already been training for decades.

Bellie1

Thanks Cill. Sleep and diet are consistently good and train upper/lower body so 4 workouts a week. I do rpe 8 most sessions bar deloads, and aim for rpe9 one week a month . But still finding I'm not as strong as I was 2 years ago. Have had alot of injuries/joint pain and tendonitis in various parts of the body that are probably limiting me eg so can't do as much pull ups as I would like as get golfers elbow. So would add up that it's injuries that cause loss of strength. So the secret is finding a program/ way of training that minimizes injuries, overuse etc?

Black Sheep

There's a US based coach I've trained with in the past, Andy Baker, who does a lot of online work with older / masters lfters, and I liked this article he wrote about troubleshooting when you feel like you've hit a wall. You might find something of use in here-

Body Feeling Beat Up, Burnt Out? (What to Adjust) - Andy Baker

walterking

A bit like the OP, but at 17.5st and just gone past the mid-50 mark in age . Finally starting to see it drop after 6 weeks of very regular swimming (5 times a week), but fitness level has improved and whilst weight is only down a touch, I'm being told I look "slimmer" and clothes are fitting better so i put that down to improved body composition

One of the instructors suggested I do "running" in the water and started that 2 weeks ago and finding it is extending my time in the pool (40min v 30min) and that was when the weight finally started its downturn. It might have occurred anyway, but the scale put me at 17.1 yesterday v 17.5 2 weeks ago with target being 15.5-16 by summer.

So if gym work is not your thing, swimming might be another option, but as above, calorie intake and correct food mix is just as important.

Black Sheep

Deleted - posted in error

Cill94

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120319663#Comment_120319663

Yeah finding a way to tax yourself enough to make progress, but without getting hurt, is really the name of the game. You just have to train smarter as you get older.

I'd suggest looking at the times you've gotten hurt and trying to identify patterns. If it's always when you do certain exercises, I'd chuck 'em temporarily. You may also find there's a certain frequency of sessions that aggravates certain parts of your body etc.

Ultimately if you are so hurt that it's affecting your ability to train hard, then sometimes it's worth taking the time to actually address that instead of just training though. For example I thought I had a bench plateau for years. Really I just had a shoulder injury that I hadn't taken the time to fix, and that would flare up anytime I pushed hard.

Bellie1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120320321#Comment_120320321

As a follow on, startedCalgary barbell program over a week ago . Maybe coincidence but have what seems like a back strain today( lifted on Sunday and had slight niggle yesterday but today spasms). So thinking now that the 4 times a week full body isn't the best at my age as need more time for recovery. I was actually finding the sessions really easy compared to my usual workouts and was looking forward to following through and trying something new. Do ye think a program like Calgary isn't suitable for over 40s? And best going back to upper lower split to allow time for recovery?

Cill94

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120382181#Comment_120382181

Sorry to hear about the back. I think all that matters is what you believe will work best for you. If that's an upper-lower split, go for it.

Bellie1

Ill take a chance it's coincidence and go back to it again in a week or so. It was nice spreading out the volume over a week. So annoying as it opens up so many types of programs to me so want it to work.

Have had on and off lower back/SI joint flares for a few years so maybe not related at all.

I guess I was just checking that there's no strict rule that need x days for recovery when older before hitting a body part again. Seems like not so I'll just consider it bad luck and try the program again

Black Sheep

It's so individual.

I'm 43 and I've trained 4-5 days a week consistently for years, I'm acclimatised to it. I eat to support it and of late I've gotten better at making sure I give myself a decent 'sleep opportunity' so that I hopefully get a minimum of 7 hours sleep. By that I mean, I'll spend 8+ hours in bed, recognising that I won't be asleep for all of that anyway.

I sometimes find that if I only trained 3 days a week I feel worse, not better, because movement can be therapeutic.

But at the end of the day also it depends on the programming. I think at the moment I just have too much stress in my life to attempt something like the Texas Method or something else considered a very challenging programme.

I personally feel like I'm probably more or less done with programmes that really centre putting a heavy barbell on my back, or pulling very heavy deadlifts. Age and injury history is part of it, but goals are relevant too.

Bellie1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120383324#Comment_120383324

I've trained 5 days a week upto a year ago when got sciatica ( still have, albeit not so bad). I just never did squats and bench 2 consecutive days in a row so the Calgary was a new style of programming for me .I'd lift 7 days a week if I thought it was possible. I was hoping to keep going until I was 60 before dropping back to more single leg exercises etc to maintain .

I've noticed alot of times I've gotten injured has been during a deload week where maybe didn't warm up sufficiently. But maybe it was because deloads were straight after a very heavy week and my back was tired so the deload session just tipped over the edge. Its so frustrating, it's like snakes and ladders, working my way up ,getting injured every few months and having to build back up again for a few weeks.

Have a friend in his early 40s and he's backed off alot and focusing more on mobility,no deadlifts etc . I've been lifting since I was 46 but only started barbell lifting when I was 47. Maybe 6 years of heavy lifting at my age means I'm as beat up as someone who started in their 20s and has lifted for 20 years!

Black Sheep

I haven't come across Calgary Barbell before. It's a little more expensive than the group programming options I've done in the past, but looks slick.

It looks very barbell-centric, reminds me a little of the programming I followed for several years with Andy Baker.

I don't think age is automatically a bar to following this kind of programming, and I know Andy has clients in their 60s and 70s who are pulling US state record weights.

But if you've got low back or SI joint issues then I do think it has to be a bit of a labour of love to still prioritise training this way. If you take the deadlift I don't think it's something people should necessarily have to drop once they get to a certain age, but maybe it's worth interrogating what it's in the program for, and whether there are variants that might be better choices. I quite like the Joe DeFranco mentality of cycling the straight bar in and out of programming. It's not gone, but it's intermittent, and the rest of the time you're working with more joint friendly options.

Barbell training was practically part of my identity a few years ago, but when I said it was goal dependent, what I meant was now I'm a little more relaxed about letting unilateral DB training and lower body machine training become a bigger part of what I do. In my last program I still had a compound lower body lift as a main movement, but for hypertrophy and general fitness I don't think there's a reason to train like a hobbyist powerlifter unless you really really want to. My top end strength on deadlift and squat has dropped, yes, but I think what I'm doing now is probably more sustainable for the long term.

Bellie1

Was doing the Calgary 16 week free intermediate program , excel template was free on liftvault. I have low bone density so unfortunately have to keep doing deadlifts and squats for as long as can hold out to try and reverse( I had done goblet squats, dumbbell work previously and still lost bone so the barbell training is what I need)..If didn't have to, then yeah I'd definitely be pulling back and focusing more on maintaining muscle at this stage( from what I've read , then surprisingly little will maintain that).

I googled Andy Baker as had never heard of him- thanks for putting him on my radar. Hes an advocate of lower volume for older lifters it seems. I'm going to download his strength and mass over 40 programs and try it out.

I wish I'd discovered weightlifting in my 20s so could have realised my potential but even with injuries the last year, I'm probably still stronger than 99% of the population so will focus on that

Black Sheep

His Baker Barbell Club is excellent, I was a member for years. You get 3 streams of programming delivered by email every Monday. About 30 a month.

He's got a bodybuilding track that is 4-6 days a week, bodypart split... Then a conjugate track that's 3-4 days a week... And a basic barbell track that's usually 3 days a week and it's usually something like an upper/lower, a version of Heavy Light Medium or similar. All barbell centric.

He has a FB group and a bulletin board you get access to.

Very friendly, good level of knowledge of training in there.

Average age I would guess is probably 40-50.

This is a great thread, thanks to all.

I've been farting around gyms now and again (male btw) and happy with cardio, but having turned 40 i am now keen to focus more on my strength and mobility.

Starting Strength is the one that seems to come up time and time again so that may be a good place to start. Hopefully i can find a decent trainer.

Couple of questions if you have time to answer:

- i know i tend to get bored of things after a couple of months. Is that a typical problem "under the barbell"?

- I've seen things like Athlene-x 12 exercises everyone should be doing. I'm not interested in ego or aesthetics at this point, moreso health on longevity. Any thoughts on whether Starting Strength, with sone supplementary, would still ve the one or is it better to focus on a pt do Athlene-x type stuff and regularly switch things up?

- any thoughts on whether an online coach is any good in comparison to in person? (I fear a lot of the young lads employed by most gyms are the equivalent of barbers who can only give you a fade)

Black Sheep

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120949499#Comment_120949499

Regarding boredom... you can stick with something like starting strength for several months and still be making tangible progress. If you're results driven that might keep you going. People like continuing to add weight to the bar, there's a good challenge element that can be motivating.

There are more varied and customisable programs out there, but it's beneficial to run whatever you do for a decent period of time before changing it up. 8-12 weeks is probably a good ball park figure. Whatever you do, adherence is a huge part of whether it'll work or not.

If you like variety then something like 531 might be good, although to me it's not an ideal beginner program. Or maybe a better way of putting it is that Starting Strength is probably my preference because its a little simpler in programming terms, only has 3 workouts a week and there's a huge community and content base built around it.

Regarding Athlean X, not that familiar but basically there are no "must do" exercises, it's very individual and context dependent. What are your goals, what equipment do you have, what's your injury history etc. These sorts of articles are just designed to grab your attention, really.

Buying online programming or doing online coaching is excellent, but not for a complete novice who needs technical instruction on lifts.

If you want good PT style instruction on lifts perhaps people can offer recommendations but if you're drawn to squatting, benching and deadlifting etc then you could look at powerlifting clubs like ABS if you're in Dublin, or a PT gym with a good reputation like The Edge.

Thanks for writing all that, very kind.

Maybe as you say the results will be a good driver. I have been doing strength training on dumbbells over the last few weeks, as opposed to messing around with high reps like i would have done previously, and i definitely have enjoyed it more (shifting greater weights).

I suppose just get under the bar is the main thing. The barbell can be intimidating for a newbie , but i know that's nonsense.

I may struggle to make 3 gym sessions a week though. I currently do 2 and try and squeeze in a third, do a couple of runs that i want to keep also.

Cill94

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120949499#Comment_120949499

- i know i tend to get bored of things after a couple of months. Is that a typical problem "under the barbell"?

Depends on what you're changing. You can afford to change accessory exercises every few weeks. For example, switching from a barbell curl to a dumbbell curl barely matters. However regularly changing the main lifts, number of days you train etc is what's referred to as 'programme hopping', and a big reason why many people don't make any gains past the beginner stage. The tradeoff between variety and specificity really comes down to how much progress you want.

- I've seen things like Athlene-x 12 exercises everyone should be doing. I'm not interested in ego or aesthetics at this point, moreso health on longevity. Any thoughts on whether Starting Strength, with sone supplementary, would still ve the one or is it better to focus on a pt do Athlene-x type stuff and regularly switch things up?

Athlean X is a charlatan. He would like you to believe that only he knows the secret to results and that everything else will 'kill your gains'. Can assure you essentially all the claims he makes are pure fantasy for the purpose of building a social media following.

- any thoughts on whether an online coach is any good in comparison to in person? (I fear a lot of the young lads employed by most gyms are the equivalent of barbers who can only give you a fade)

You're right to be wary of poor coaches. However the online space is no better than in person for coaching quality. In-person vs online really comes down to preference and what you need from a coach.