€1,350/cow payment to cut suckler numbers

Silverdream

https://www.agriland.ie/farming-news/new-report-suggests-e1350-cow-payment-to-cut-suckler-numbers/

idk is €1350 going to be enough to persuade me to cut numbers as it seems that once you take the money you cannot increase other beef operations. Also I don't think a one off payment would be enough, surly they would have to support the farmer for a few years after.

There really is a big push on to change Farming, between the increased Organics payments, higher forestry payments, AgroForestry and now this is coming down the line. For years there was always a level of penny pinching from the dept and Government towards funding, What is really driving this push, and where are they getting the money from?

blue5000

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058274506/1-350-cow-payment-to-cut-suckler-numbers

I wouldn't be surprised if the money is coming from the organic budget, they have 256m to spend. Might be a good time for sucklers to go organic, cut cow numbers by 30% and collect this as well. AFAIK suckler cow numbers have already dropped by 3-400,000. We'll soon have land being abandoned altogether, I bet the crowd that want to bring back wolves are behind this.

Silverdream

lol bring back the wolves

jezz what next from this people, its like everything plough on until you hit a big rock. I can see the day when this country is no longer a net food exporter.

JohnChadwick

Don't know the length of the contract period is, but if it comes in think I'd probably take 1350 to cut Suckler cows in half and change system slightly to bring weanlings nearer to the 'finished' stage.

Diversifying into agroforestry appeals to me anyway, as does organics which I'm already in.

Obvious that it's brought in to decarbonise agriculture, dunno whether money comes from eu or what.

Silverdream

But will you be allowed to do that, from the reports it seems that they are looking to cut without increasing production elsewhere. Keeping Weanlens longer would be seen as that. They know month to month what animals you've always kept, every move we've made over the last 15 years has been recorded and logged in some database.

weatherbyfoxer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119955462#Comment_119955462

It clearly states the option of developing of none breeding beef enterprises as an alternative to suckler cows,personally I can't see much of a problem with it. It will be a lump of money to change into a different enterprise that could be more profitable

Donald Trump

It doesn't say you can't cut suckler numbers and increase dairy (for the remaining numbers that have both!)

Grueller

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119955562#Comment_119955562

Would dairy not be breeding ruminants?

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119955626#Comment_119955626

Well I'm only going on the language in the article. Which says it can be replaced by other "non-breeding beef or sheep enterprises". Although it is confusing as it gives a separate definition further down

There are beef schemes that dairy farmers cannot apply for at the minute. So dairy =/= beef for some purposes.

Siamsa Sessions

The money available for all these schemes is pennies in this day and age. Govt have money to burn on anything that catches their eye. This is always the case for Govt projects, even during official recessions - they just cut health and education spending to fund whatever else they want to do.

In the agriculture case, Govt and senior civil servants want to move away from what they see as a third-world industry, the type of thing that poor and underdeveloped countries could do - not what modern, developed, sophisticated, educated, etc. countries like Ireland do.

That’s the narrative. And it makes sense if you’re living in that Dublin political/media bubble. All the political parties believe this, not just the Greens.

What they will slowly realise, probably over the next decade is that rural Ireland and farmers are more resilient and adaptable than they imagine. We’ll still be here when Varadkar, Ryan, and Martin are long gone. This is the same the world over, not just in Ireland, where old, established communities outlast brain-farts from city-based do-gooders. We may eventually die out but not at the rate our betters expect.

Sucklers are already changing. So are farmers - moving to part-time, using the likes of Moo-call, etc. to manage. And using off-farm income to keep the farm ticking over in some cases.

I don’t think big changes are coming fast. They’re coming but not as quick as the doomsayers in the media portray.

And just to finish: I’m going in the opposite direction and will probably start a small suckler herd next year. I hope the YouTube videos I’ll do on it give some in that Dublin bubble a heart attack 😀

alps

There is no allocation or offer of funds for this.

This is the report from Professor Thia Hennessy without the backing of the consultation panel that was put together for its "valued input".

We are naturally sceptical that funds could come from the exchequer for such a proposal, but fact that the government appointed academic ran with this proposal from the start, and aligned in its entirety with the so called dairy proposal, one has to suspect a predetermined offer was suggested when the obvious predetermined proposal was "submitted"

The bit that's hanging out here for me, is that I can't see a situtation whereby government pay one farmer to reduce while another can still expand....some form of restriction/quota will be applied.

Siamsa...I wouldn't delay putting those breeding stock in place, although doubt if there was ever a more expensive time to do it..

Brave decision to make.

Base price

There is a good article worth reading from Adam Woods in the Farmers Journal. I think it is free to view, link attached

https://www.farmersjournal.ie/suckler-kite-flying-won-t-wash-with-beef-farmers-738203

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119955755#Comment_119955755

Moocall is a dead loss in my opinion. Easy calving bulls with decent carcass scores and bcs management of cows is the way to go if part time suckling.

Surely there are a rake of ageing dairy farmers that would consider a similar cow reduction scheme as well

Siamsa Sessions

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119956261#Comment_119956261

That farm meeting I was at last week was told the IFA are officially against any dairy retirement scheme. But the VP admitted that plenty older dairy lads have told them they’d be interested in hearing more about it

Grueller

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119955706#Comment_119955706

Non breeding is the key phrase Donald. Cows must breed in order to produce milk.

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119956518#Comment_119956518

"beef" is the key phrase Grueller. The definition of "beef" often excludes dairy farmers when it comes to certain schemes.

Grueller

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119956523#Comment_119956523

That's the agriland link though. I have read elsewhere where non breeding "ruminants" is the terminology used. We'll have to wait and see what happens with the proposals.

Grueller

Top result there Donald. Poor journalism by Agriland strikes again.

Donald Trump

That's fair enough. But I said at the start I was basing what I said off that article.

Birdnuts

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119955562#Comment_119955562

Its utterly illogical IMO since suckler numbers are declining anyway and the pollution pressures etc. are coming from the expansion and intensification of the latter

Donald Trump

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119956712#Comment_119956712

Never let it it be said that the powers that be ever did something illogical! 😉

Grueller

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119956712#Comment_119956712

Look 2 posts above your own Birdnuts

JohnChadwick

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119955462#Comment_119955462

Can't see why not. You should be allowed sell at any time.

manjou

Sheep are ruminants also

youllbemine

Sickle exit scheme is an opportunity to get your money before its forced upon farmers. Look at what has been announced in Netherlands this weekend. They're coming for sucklers, dairy, sheep and your land. Call me a conspiracy theorist but there are serious changes coming and you can talk about people being resilient but when the guards are locking farmers up for contempt of court you'll say that fella was right after all.

alps

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119957635#Comment_119957635

24 Billion euros put aside to compensate dutch farmers.

Thats 24,000,000,000 divided by the 30% of 53,000 farmers.

blue5000

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119957635#Comment_119957635

The Guards will have to catch us first. What has this got to do with the Netherlands? Sure it might be no harm to get paid to get rid of the worst 30% of suckler cows.

SUVs are very common now and a serious contributor to emissions. Any plan on a cull there and replace them with say a corsa or a corrolla?

Mooooo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119957658#Comment_119957658

It's actually not much given land prices in the Netherlands. Average price for arable ground was over 69k/ha. That 24 billion divided by 15900 farmers is 1.5 million at those prices is only a 24 ha farm

youllbemine

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119957748#Comment_119957748

It's a sign of what us coming down the line.

alps

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119957802#Comment_119957802

It's mindblowing the pyramid schemes that they have got themselves into in the Netherlands.

Inreckon the compensation will be administered in such a way that the banks don't loose out.

The farmer will end up with sfa..

farmingquestion

Is there any future in farming? Are you a fool to be investing big money into it now?

kollegeknight

I honestly think, we will get to a point where they will regret the cut backs.

definitely in the past few years, I have been trying to improve my own food security.

i will reduce my cow numbers due to cost and time but I want to try keep a few to tip away breeding.

I haven’t that figured out yet. AI is hard to do with my job.

I might hold onto them to see will there be reduction grants.

_Brian

This will suit allot of older farmers who are already considering downsizing or gettting out of cows anyway. Less efficient lads are loosing their shirt on sucklers and supplementing the farm with the bps.

Two chaps on my books got out of cows last year and I know another few considering same, older bachelor type lads.

Mooooo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119958532#Comment_119958532

Yeah it's the rolling over of debt is the issue, most farmers buyout the parents they retire and so on

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119958588#Comment_119958588

Maybe a good time to be looking at zero till or low carbon farming.

Could be a bad time to go in to cows with the current narrative being pushed on climate change and how life stock reduction is an easy win.

A lot of the lads milking 100 are trying to get to near 200. A lot of the lads milking 200 are trying to get to 300 plus. Loads a sheds going up. Price pressure on consumer and oversupply may drive prices down.

Having said that your soya / oat substitutes are more expensive than milk as well.

Packrat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119955437#Comment_119955437

Not a hope in hell that money will come from the organics budget - 256 million OVER 5 YEARS.

That's 51.2 million a year.

The previous budget was 49 million a year as far as I know.

When I asked in an organics course what happens if its oversubscribed or in the longer term, - the answer was that more than likely the shortfall would come from other areas of CAP.

Bad news for anyone not considering organics but in my opinion very likely to be a general trend, that is - money moving from conventional CAP to organic supports.

(I'm not suggesting that this is fair or right BTW, just that it is likely)

Surely the 1350 would be better put towards retrofit of houses and a scrapage scheme for old bangers of cars if they want to reduce carbon.

Packrat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119961777#Comment_119961777

That would be a big IF.

Read the "Geeen Policies Killing this country" thread in Current Affairs forum if you're still under any illusion that that's their goal.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119961796#Comment_119961796

1350 with a trade professional could do a nice bit of work sealing drafts etc servicing boilers

Packrat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119961894#Comment_119961894

Yes, but that would make sense. That's not what the Greenies want. They want us all to be servile slaves to their mad death cult religion which if followed to its inevitable end point, - results in mass starvation and driving the majority of us back to the stone age.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119962004#Comment_119962004

If they were that malevolent then they’d be wasting their time in politics.

If we are at the precipice like we are being told then dramatic carbon mitigation and sequestration solutions will need to come from business and innovation not from government.

Total waste of money paying fellas to cull cows. Sure they will just rent out the land for 500 an acre tax free to a dairy farmer to up numbers.

148multi

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058274506/1-350-cow-payment-to-cut-suckler-numbers

The powers that be, both here and in Europe have wanted this for a long while, but it wasn't pc to say it straight out. The suckler cow replaced the hormones, to reduce the beef mountain. Now flora and fauna will replace cows and sheep.

New Zealand planning on reducing methane emissions from the dairy herd by 47% by 2050 by using additives to cows diet and selective breeding etc.

Meanwhile in Ireland you have a government proposing a Mickey Mouse suckler cow reduction scheme.

tanko

There is no Suckler reduction scheme, there’s lots of kite flying tho.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119965807#Comment_119965807

Yes. This government airs its ideas as gossip to see which will fly then go with the one they think is most palatable.

alps

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119965785#Comment_119965785

Europe has plans to be at 0% by 2050...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119965833#Comment_119965833

I suppose we will all be on bikes by then so eating salads out of our window boxes

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119965850#Comment_119965850

I'll have a dexter grazing my window box

Hard Knocks

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119965931#Comment_119965931

On farms that once had LM & CH cattle I now see allot of Dexter, highland, Belted Galaway and them maybe a touch of AA & HE. With comments that beef yields on dairy cross cattle is less than good Continentals. Have we an issue coming down the tracks

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119966335#Comment_119966335

My own views on farming could be blinding me to this potential issue, enlighten me?