2020: The Year Ireland Left its Adolescence period

jetsonx

I think in March 2020, when Leo Varadkar stood up on the podium to announce he was closing down the country was a historic moment.

Historic, because there was world wide pandemic starting. But, also historic for another reason.

This was the first time in my living memory where Ireland was totally ignoring what the UK were doing. I don't think Varadkar even references them in his speech. In addition, Ireland was ignoring what Germany and France were doing. It's as if the Republic of Ireland had finally grown a pair and said it was doing it own thing this time regardless of what the neighbours were doing.

That night, in my mind, Ireland had finally left its adolescent phase. Ireland had finally grown up as a country.

Discuss...

(Please, please do not make this conversation about the pros and cons of lockdowns)

ancapailldorcha

I disagree. While Ireland has always remained aligned with the UK for economic and historical reasons, it was never a realistic possibility that the Irish would embark on the same path of abject stupidity that the British begin walking down in 2016. For that reason, I'd say 2016 though before that there's been pressure on Ireland from the US as well as the EU and the Irish have held firm. Ireland was a mature nation long before 2020. Since things were quite harmonious, there wasn't much opportunity to show it until the past decade or so.

Ubbquittious

Ireland is being ruled by the EU now, previously it was the church and before that it was England

jetsonx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119825778#Comment_119825778

Well when it comes to things like economic and social policy. Ireland still has lots of autonomy.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119825778#Comment_119825778

No, it isn't.

quokula

Wasn't Ireland pretty much first in the world when it came to both the plastic bag levy and the smoking ban back in the day? Policies that most major countries have followed since. We were also the world's first country to divest from state investment in fossil fuels (or at least there was a vote on it and I remember it being news, I don't know if that has actually happened since?)

I'm sure there are plenty more examples, we haven't always just copied Britain.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119825778#Comment_119825778

If Ireland was being ruled by the EU our corporation tax rate would not be 12.5%

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119825778#Comment_119825778

Ridiculous comment.

OP we broke with Sterling in 1979 and decided to join the euro without the UK in 1999 so we've been going on a divergent path from the UK for a long time.

Ubbquittious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119825895#Comment_119825895

We don't even have our own currency anymore. We had to beg the EU for some exemptions during the Lisbon treaty (when we were signing away lots more autonomy) if we could keep our abortion ban for another couple of years. Then we quickly got rid of it anyway and fell into line

Ubbquittious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119826372#Comment_119826372

Don't worry it will be gone soon enough. Its only limping along from one stay of it's execution to another

jetsonx

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119826604#Comment_119826604

News stories that we're getting the bulk of our tax revenue from something like 10 companies is extremely concerning.

When the corporation tax rate changes, it could leave Ireland in a very precarious situation. Some of these companies could easily move to Portugal. This could be Fruit of the Loom factory all over again, except this time it will be the tech companies.

Ubbquittious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119826746#Comment_119826746

TBH I wouldn't worry about it too much. If it goes away the rate will only go up a few %, there is a huge cost to moving one of those companies and tons of their staff won't want to go to the new location. The whole notion about the 12.5% being so vital comes from an outdated generation of betrodden self-loathing spud pickers who thought the best Ireland had to offer was a cheap ticket to Europe for American megacorps.

jetsonx

For these companies, there is more to value than just a tax rate - that is true.

But does being reliant on so few companies for tax revenue not concern you?

dxhound2005

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119826746#Comment_119826746

Portugal would be a strange choice seeing that it has the highest corporation tax in all of Europe, not just the EU. Unless they wanted to keep in the same time zone as Ireland? Having to change their clocks would be a big imposition.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119826604#Comment_119826604

Yep. Any day now. Hasn't happened for decades but somehow people still come out with this.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119826767#Comment_119826767

What percentage of the Irish tax take comes from these companies?

Ubbquittious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119826767#Comment_119826767

A bit. The danger is a big tech slump that's already kind of happening that could cause a mass exodus. For years now there is an expectation with certain degrees that you can just march into a tech company and get a few k horsed into your bank account every month for the rest of your days once you keep de head down. There aren't nearly enough indigenous start ups here despite grants being available

dxhound2005

If a start up is defined as a new company, there are plenty of them being formed.

https://www.vision-net.ie/Business-Barometer/Gazette-New-Companies/

Ubbquittious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119826795#Comment_119826795

Not enough people quittin' the almighty Goog/Apple and starting their own tech company. It does happen now and then but that scene in Ireland is much smaller than it needs to be.

maninasia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058270068/2020-the-year-ireland-left-its-adolescence-period

Don't agree.

When Ireland invests in its armed forces that can defend the country and also gas storage not dependent on the UK I will change my mind. Also once in a while say no we dont want to do it like this to the EU.

This is not just about one leader after all but overall attitude of the governing class.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119826599#Comment_119826599

We're far better off with the euro than without, that's just a fact. Oh and we never had our own currency until 1979, anyway.

The Lisbon treaty never had anything to do with abortion, that was just the government here choosing to pander to the religious crazies as usual.

It was the Irish electorate's decision to repeal the 8th amendment and it's quite likely they'd have done it years earlier if politicians had had the balls to give us the chance to vote on it sooner.

The "fall into line" stuff is rubbish. Abortion has got nothing to do with the EU.

Tonesjones

Most of the employees at these tech and finance giants are non nationals but all are paying into the Irish exchequer.

We are merely a facilitator we don't actually do anything.

Left it's adolescence and regressed to an infantile state..

pjohnson

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119827108#Comment_119827108

In what way?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119827119#Comment_119827119

tiktok dances..not being allowed outside for your own safety.."stay safe"..everyone tuning in every evening to be told the numbers and how bad it was..

The complete "Awww...we're in it together, isn't it great to take a break, and bake some cookies" sh1te..

You were infantalised..

lawred2

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119825778#Comment_119825778

Puerile hogwash.

Ubbquittious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119826897#Comment_119826897

Might be handy when you go on holidays but we are stuck with the EU's interest rates and their threats to kick us out if we don't pay up like during the 2008 crash.

It doesn't really matter what would or could have happened to abortion, the point I'm making is the EU does influence us on social issues and our autonomy is reduced

foxsake

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119826152#Comment_119826152

Ireland is controlled by the EU and associated groupings (and has been for years ) a lot is due to a childlike deference to our betters - our politicals have an obsession with being "best in class" instead of doing what is best for Ireland.

currently demonstrated by the rush accept as many refugees / foreigners into the country as there are seats on the plans and boats with no regards for the impact quality of life for the Irish Citizen but all eyes on the exalted in the EU and further afield.

In their world there is no price too much for the Irish Citizen to bear so Ireland looks good.

we are ruled (and in fairness they are voted in ) by servile gombeens , imagine a rabble of characters akin the "bird" in the field (as played by john Hurt)

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119827686#Comment_119827686

Your evidence for this?

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119827442#Comment_119827442

The EU does not influence us on social issues, Irish people have broadened their horizons and are far less insular than 50 or 60 years ago but that's not just because of the ability to live/work in the EU.

If the EU influenced us on social issues how did the 8th amendment pass in the first place? and then last for 35 years?

The EU has nothing to do with abortion. This is just a myth peddled by the catholic far right who can't face up to the fact that the days of the Irish people buying their BS are long over.

The euro is a lot more than "handy when going on holidays", pretty juvenile way of looking at things tbh. Ask anyone who trades internationally.

What do you reckon interest rates would be on an Irish pound right now? We can't know for sure but there'd be no doubt they would be significantly higher than now. Look at what happened to the UK recently, even an economy that large was swatted like a fly by the markets, the bigger the currency bloc we are part of the more stable our economy is.

Do you actually think borrowing money and not paying it back is a viable economic strategy? We're not Venezuela or Argentina and have no desire to be, either.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119827686#Comment_119827686

Yet more puerile rubbish with no basis in fact and no evidence provided.

foxsake

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119827983#Comment_119827983

leaving aside that you are v wrong in your assertion.

did I not give an example of the current rush to house everybody but the irish citizen? are you denying that is happening or do you need it spelt out?

In past I have spent time posting articles , links, the works and tbh nobody reads them, care or does ad hominem attacks on the source (without discussing the facts)

Why waste my time? If I did all you ask , would you bother reading them to critic what i post?

you know how it is.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119828540#Comment_119828540

This is a rather transparent excuse. No evidence means this can be dismissed just as easily.

foxsake

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119828563#Comment_119828563

lame deflection cos you have no counter.

ancapailldorcha

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119828650#Comment_119828650

None needed. Your claim so the onus is on you to back it up.

hynesie08

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058270068/2020-the-year-ireland-left-its-adolescence-period

I had a very similar feeling when SSM got voted through in such a defining way, that we'd finally matured as a country.

(Except Roscommon, they can fcuk right off)

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119828540#Comment_119828540

You've made an assertion with no proof, which you then blame on the EU, again with no evidence provided.

Pub bore level stuff tbh.

foxsake

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119848953#Comment_119848953

read harder next time

BaywatchHQ

I am bewildered by the Irish state, for example I overheard in the news this week some journalist saying to Mary Lou McDonald in an argument about gangland criminals and the IRA that "crime is crime". What a chilling phrase to use, a quote famous from Thatcher during the hunger strike. By his logic then the old IRA were criminals too, after all "crime is crime". If you insist on still demonising the IRA in 2022 then you should have the consistency to also demonise your own IRA. I find the whole thing bewildered and I don't think I could trust those people if there was a unified Ireland.

whisky_galore

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119825778#Comment_119825778

Only when it suits us.

Cute enough to take all the membership perks while at the same time keeping the multis happy with a low rate of tax.