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EX FG voters, why have you stopped supporting them?

  • 16-10-2022 10:07am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 17,792 ✭✭✭✭


    AS an ex FG voter, who possibly wont even bother voting next election, as there is no option politically here, that I feel represents my views. Why wont you vote for FG again? Here are a few key reasons why I wont... Their initial appetite for change platform they ran on in 2011 or whenever that election was, was a lie and a farce. Look after the taxpayer ? Laugh out loud, you thieve FIFTY percent income tax over a pittance, that even hits the working poor's income. Infrastructure is a disgrace. Planning reform desperately needed for housing and infrastructure, still not bothered with it... I read an article yesterday, FG internal one that, that a party member leaked a bit of. Saying they should probably do something about housing if they dont want to lose more seats, this is being said in 2022 ! with a diabolical housing situation, 11 years after being in power... Beyond pathetic. The 2011 election, nearly all my friends and family voted FG, 2017 that halved roughly. The next election, it will be possibly 1 or 2. 1 or 2 from 30+ in 2011! The young here are expected to live at home forever, pay a fortune in rent or emigrate. Meanwhile a large part of the population live a far standard higher or living than they would in other european countries, paid for by these hard working, low paid, workhorses...


    Why is JSA or JSB being increased, when every bloody shop has a "staff wanted" sign in the window? Total overhaul of welfare system needed, pay out, based on pay in. A proper system like other eu countries. Welfare bonus for christmas etc only if you are long term unemployed, in a country with businesses closing, because they cant get staff...



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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 15,802 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    Why is JSA or JSB being increased, when every bloody shop has a "staff wanted" sign in the window?

    To appeal to the floating voters that FG are competing with FF and the soft left for. Few potential FG voters are themselves long-term unemployed or will benefit from the other welfare increases the government has introduced but among the middle-class liberals that FG are targeting, it is the kiss of death to be labeled 'right wing' or 'Thatcherite'...

    The key line in your OP is

    there is no option politically here, that I feel represents my views.

    As long as FG face no serious challenge to their right they will continue to pursue these sorts of policies on the basis that most people minded like you will continue voting for them as 'the best of a bad lot'...



  • Registered Users Posts: 390 ✭✭CarProblem


    "As long as FG face no serious challenge to their right they will continue to pursue these sorts of policies on the basis that most people minded like you will continue voting for them as 'the best of a bad lot'..."

    But the OP says he isn't voting for FG!!! You've said this many times on this board but FG is losing votes. I do agree somewhat with that some voters want right of centre but settle for least left (I socialise and work with a lot of these types) but there are swathes of others (myself included and I'm sure other posters on this thread too) who have abandoned the party - election results and opinion polls categorically show this. So this approach has absolutely cost the party votes and seats.

    Basically I'm putting my money/vote where my mouth is, when any party's candidate (not just FG) knocks on my door Ill ask them not to return until we see a more fiscally (not socially) conservative stance where workers are prioritised and not welfare recipients (and I include pensioners in this cohort).



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  • Registered Users Posts: 28,534 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    i am finding this more and more, that some life long fg supporters are walking away, this is a very interesting phenomenon and understandable so, but increasing welfare makes sense on many fronts, as most is spent back into the economy almost immediately upon receivership, this benefits us all, in particular the businesses that receive this money, this was very well proven with increased covid payments. this increases whats called the velocity of the money supply, if the velocity falls below a certain level, this increases the likelihood of business failure, hence rising unemployment, and rising potential of financial sector instabilities as many households and businesses would have significant debts.

    unemployment rates are actually at an all time low, which is a fantastic achievement, considering everything, including our history, unemployment occurs due to many complex reasons, particularly long term unemployment, many of these individuals would in fact have highly complex needs, which have never been truly fulfilled, and probably wont ever, so we will probably always have a base level, no matter what....

    its clearly obvious the fundamental ideologies parties such as ffg have been following are starting to collapse, in regards providing us with our most critical of needs, i.e. housing, health care, infrastructure etc, but they are deeply unwilling to accept this reality, they are falling with these ideologies, and are also unwilling to accept these facts.....



  • Registered Users Posts: 3,097 ✭✭✭KaneToad


    This threads always attract the extreme views and categorisation of the governing/opposition parties (delete as appropriate).

    The truth is that most Irish politicial parties are centrist. And most Irish voters are centrist.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,078 ✭✭✭Silentcorner


    If most Irish people are centrists, which I agree with by the way, then why are the traditional political parties (FF, Fg and Labour) all suffering. Maybe they have left the centre so to speak.



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,534 ✭✭✭✭Wanderer78


    theyve all scattered, picking bits from the left and the right, and its all falling to pieces for them, but this is also happening in most other countries



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85


    Good analysis. I understand totally the vote for them as best of a bad lot. That wont force change though... it's a waste of time and we would be still condoning the bs by voting for them. A mass spoiling of votes would be a fantastic outcome in my opinion

    ....



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85


    Lpt bring in as pittance. They could scrap it no bother. It is abused and set at a rate that makes no sense to collect. I bet its total is a fraction of the welfare increase this budget.. scrap it and replace it with a proper tax on vacant property and land... big vote winner. Not a vote winner.. increasing handouts to people who never vote for you and despise you. Alienating those who used to vote for you, including the working poor... FG pulled some con job...

    Getting rid of vatadkar, claiming the party has strayed too far from its manifesto, bring in a proper hard line leader to end this welfare before workers, and actually doing it, could win back some support...



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,802 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    Well (a) I would contend that OP is very much an outlier among right-leaning and centrist voters. Many might feel similar but will end up voting FG (or FF) on the least worst principles.

    and (b) he says he is not switching his vote but opting out, which is a draw rather than a defeat in electoral terms. FG strategists would likely say the number of abstainers like him would be outweighed by the losses they would suffer to FF, Greens, Lab etc. if they adopted more overtly right-wing policies.

    election results and opinion polls categorically show this. So this approach has absolutely cost the party votes and seats.

    Well they have been in power for over a decade. The likelihood is they would be losing support no matter what they were doing, as we can see with the Tories across the water. And where are these voters supposedly seeking a fiscally conservative alternative to FG going? Do they think they are going to get it from SF?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,068 ✭✭✭Murph85


    A new party, that promised and delivered what FG said they would in 2011. With a credible leader, would win 15% plus of the vote in my opinion and thus, be hugely influential in potential next government formation. Which as of now, will be a SF/FF coalition in my opinion...



  • Registered Users Posts: 26,800 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Fine Gael got 20.9% in the 2020 general election, the opinion poll today, when the country has been through Covid, Brexit and Ukraine crises is at 21%.

    This thread is a nonsense in that context, FG voters are sticking with their party.

    Looking at that opinion poll, my money is still on the only two possible options, the return of this government or FF/SF, the same choices that we had after the last election. Nothing has changed.



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,802 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    Getting rid of vatadkar, claiming the party has strayed too far from its manifesto, bring in a proper hard line leader to end this welfare before workers, and actually doing it, could win back some support...

    This stuff just seems like shouting into the void to me. FG themselves clearly don't currently share your analysis, and I see little reason to think they will adopt it in the future. I also have no idea who this 'proper hard line leader' might be. None of the current contenders (according to the bookies) have been carving out any sort of right-wing profile in the way Varadkar himself (ambiguously) did when he was a rising star in the party...



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,248 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    Abysmal figures for FG. Those issues were all seen as FG trump cards- the fact they haven’t budged from the dismal 2020 election tells you all you need to know. FG under Varadkar are moribund



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  • Registered Users Posts: 26,800 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    The thread is asking why FG voters have stopped supporting them, I am pointing out that the thread is over two years out of date because FG are holding their vote. You don't address that.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,665 ✭✭✭pgj2015


    I don't like Leo anymore. Will be giving my vote to Fianna Fail next election, Michael Martin is doing a great job in my opinion.



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,947 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    I'm very much still an FG supporter. And, unless and until there is a party further to the right fiscally - while maintaining a social left like FG - I will continue to do so. The polls dont show voters abandoning FG at all. The tax band increase will help middle ireland, the first party to do anything in that area for a long time. Middle Ireland and the motorist are two groups that are looked at as a cash cow to fund the lazy idle bloated welfare class.

    There arent any other credible options. Who else would you prefer, SFFF? A coalition between terrorists and the gombeens that bankrupted us? Don't make me laugh.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,135 ✭✭✭323


    Agree, well summed up.

    For me FG did a great job of confirming, voting is pointless. Finished. Deregistered vote.

    “Follow the trend lines, not the headlines,”



  • Registered Users Posts: 15,802 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    Dessie Ellis was certainly a big noise in the 'armed struggle' back in the day. Although I'd be surpised if he stands at the next GE...



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,947 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    I mean it's not that long ago that they were a party of convicts. Famously even with links to murderers. Even most recent elections showed problematic individuals that were not condemned by the party

    You can't claim this is a great look either.

    Sinn Féin having ‘chilling’ effect on Ireland’s democracy, says taoiseach | Ireland | The Guardian

    This list from 15 years ago is interesting reading.

    Who in Sinn Féin was IRA? | Magill



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