Approaching a neighbour for land

Manorpark man

Hi guys, I have a couple of neighbours but one particular that I would have hopes of possibly renting some land off him at some stage….. quite tight on land and would love to up number a little, whether it’s possible with nitrates etc. but that’s another matter, neighbour is in his 70s…. Keeps a hand full of cattle but is very extensive, possible no bag n out at all, he has circa 40-50ac bounding me, the field that connects us is by far the worst one he has, would need lot of money spent on it to be workable but has prospects, he let me graze this field 3 years ago but no more happend after that, I would like to buy said field as it needs a lot of investment for renting but im open to anything, what way do I put it to him without sounding like a grab as I’ve never been in such a scenario, he has children, all grew up and moved away and very unlikely to return, even if it only started with that field you’re sort of in the door if he decided he had enough farming in future, he does nothing really with said field

minerleague

No other way only direct one, tell him straight out you're worried about direction stocking rates are going and would be interested in renting/buying if he ever decides to scale back and leave it at that

893bet

Don’t mention buying. Start with renting.

kirk.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119461470#Comment_119461470

What's the logic there I know there is something but I don't understand it

893bet

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119461500#Comment_119461500

It’s a lad in his 70’s. Farming all his life. Probably has plenty in the bank. Selling has never entered his mind. And it may get his back up and then won’t rent it either.

kirk.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119461507#Comment_119461507

I see I'm not a farmer you'd make a good poker player I'd say

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119461507#Comment_119461507

When you approach a fellow to buy something off him, you have to come with a strong offer.

Also he'd be stupid to sell it without advertising as you never know who's out that'd have money to burn, selling privately is a bad idea

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119462103#Comment_119462103

Then again, better the divil you know etc.

Siamsa Sessions

As said above, ask about renting some of it for a year at a time first. If he's interested, keep at that and see what's happening next year. He might get used to the idea and the precedent is set then.

If he's not interested, then move on. Life is too short.

Also, it might not suit you at all when you get the first few acres. The world is random and who knows what'll happen in anyone's life, never mind the changes in farming. You might be happy to get out of it after 12 months

893bet

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119462175#Comment_119462175

Exactly. Rent it for a few years so he can make a measure of you etc.

That said I can’t see him wanting to sell a field like that out of the overall farm. It’s not something you see done too often but who knows. If he mentions it to family that you are interested don’t be surprised if you suddenly see them knocking around at weekends looking after their inheritances.

Manorpark man

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119462103#Comment_119462103

The field could be sold to three different bounding farmers, without going into too much detail, no access to road from other side other than through his fields, I’d give him what he thinks it’s worth, probably needs 2-3k/ac spent on it realistically

cosatron

also thread carefully, some farmers are like the Bull McCabe when it comes to land 'No concrete on my land'. A friend of mine approached a neighbour about buying 1 acre so he could extend his sheds and came back with his tail between his legs.

bogman_bass

I would just say “Look if you ever Think about renting some land beat me in mind, I’d be in the market”

Dont push it but let him know you’re interested.

Manorpark man

asked a different neighbour for a right of way across top of field in between some of ours before, he has no land above it so be out of his way, didn’t even entertain the idea for a second or consider it, at least I’m not still wondering

kirk.

Auctioneer approached me one day about a property on behalf of a developer

Said would I be interested in selling it and left it at that seemed to be a tactic

Land is different though u can be sowing the seeds of trouble with families with a question like that

minerleague

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119463891#Comment_119463891

Tried the same as that years ago ( two outside bits long way apart by road but two fields apart as crow flies -- no go either ) At least if you know and some other opportunity arises you be better placed to decide.

K.G.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058258466/approaching-a-neighbour-for-land

My tuppence worth is under no circumstances ask him for land.people can take it very poorly if an approach like that is made.

Dinzee Conlee

Years ago a lad asked my grandfather would he sell some land to him. At the time the grandfather was old and we were all living away. Grandfather said no.

But do you know what, I thought less of the lad for asking. Now some people won’t agree with that, some will say it’s just a question. But I just didn’t like it…

Tonynewholland

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119466081#Comment_119466081

I agree. Just ask to rent it. If he has any reason to sell I'm sure he will ask the man renting his land.

zidac

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058258466/approaching-a-neighbour-for-land

I suspect you missed your opportunity, if he wanted to deal with you it would have happened when you had an arrangement.

paddysdream

There must be a lot of sensitive farmers around going by this thread .

What's the harm in asking if he will rent lease sell a field ?

Its a yes or no answer. If someone approached me in similar circumstances then why would I take umbrage?

J.O. Farmer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119466561#Comment_119466561

It might depend on how the question was put.

If someone approached you and said I'm looking to rent/ lease/ buy a bit of land for X reason and I thought I'd ask you because you're beside me you probably wouldn't be offended.

If someone approached you and said looking to rent/ lease/ buy a bit of land and I thought I'd ask you about that field it doesn't look like you're doing anything with or even if not said directly the implication was you were getting on with no obvious successor you might be offended.

It might also depend on who asked and whether the person approached and how they saw the asker. There's people in every area who would be known to be greedy for land.

mr.stonewall

My approach would be approach to would approach to rent/ lease it and after a few years drop it subtle into a conversation that your happy and if the opportunity to buy it ever came along you would be interested. It's the best you can hope for. These things take time. Best of luck with it

K.G.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119466561#Comment_119466561

How do you decide who are the right candidates to approach. Nobody ever approach s a progressive go ahead farmer for a field.they usually pick some half crooked poor divil they think isn't farming their land. So now you see what your saying when you approach someone.the only thing to do is put the word out you are looking for land.if you are of good standing the land will come to you. Nobody likes fellas coveting land -they didn't bother putting it in the 10 commandment because they thought everyone should bloody know it allready

Pinsnbushings

I've both approached neighbours and been approached by a man to rent an outfarm of ours. I can't see why it should be a touchy subject but it seems it can be.

Having said that I was a little annoyed because the man looking to lease our outfarm asked a second time having been given an answer the first time he asked. But not annoyed enough to have a major grievance.

I got nowhere with any of the the neighbours I approached. I can't see how you would get to lease any land otherwise because no land gets advertised for lease around home anyway.

893bet

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119467207#Comment_119467207

Agree. Biggest problem with that is if you improve the land in any way (and that might just have been topping it and spraying the weeds the price almost goes up I would say.

Furze99

Isn't the best and traditional way to acquire land to simply marry into it. Simply being a very complicated business these days!

Siamsa Sessions

Anyone ever lease land out, say on a 7-year lease, only to have the tenant start taking the Mick despite being politely asked not to?

The lease agreement doesn’t say anything about a review. In fact, it says very little at all.

So, does the landowner have much chance of ending the lease after, say, 4 years?

Asking for a friend. Obviously.

arctictree

What could easily happen is that if the man is semi-interested, he'll be advised to put it on the open market. Then you may easily be outbid on it.

Or even worse (happened to us), we were the highest bidder but the auctioneer advised the seller to go with an underbidder, ie someone they 'found'.

My advice would be to chat to him, let him know that you are bidding on another plot of land locally, let him know the price and then let him come to you, if he is interested.

farawaygrass

With the new acres scheme coming in too will it make land harder rent? Any lad with only a smudge of interest in farming, or an older person with no successor, well they barely have to do a thing and will get a payment for it. Keeps them involved and happy, but also makes the option of renting require a very strong price.

im in the same situation as you op and and waiting to run into one man. He’s got a good job and hardly grazing the field, it’s gone wild with thistles. But I kinda do feel like if I do approach him he might think I was looking down on him. Still, nothing ventured nothing gained I suppose

older by the day

" he let me graze this field 3 years ago but no more happend after that"

Let's go back to that point in the story of yours. He would probably have left you have it the year after if he was happy with the deal. My father in law is 88 and still have a few suckers, a non profit organization. But he's happy. It's no harm if you are talking to your neighbor to ask, "did he hear of any local letting a piece of land as you would do with the extra few acres". It may make him think

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119467770#Comment_119467770

Unless they break the conditions of the lease you can't put them out

Siamsa Sessions

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119468933#Comment_119468933

Thanks for that. There was one condition broken in the first year (he sub-let 10 acres to another farmer for maize) but I didn’t really mind that. A phone call or even a text to say he was doing that would have been nice thou.

There’s just been a series of small things in the last 12 months and it’s kinda coming to a head now over water. I don’t want him out (not yet anyway) but there’s no good faith left and I don’t trust him anymore.

I was just wondering (hoping) it might be a standard thing that leases would be informally reviewed every year or two, even when the lease says it’s for 7 years.

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119469074#Comment_119469074

No, you have to state a review date in the lease.

Btw the tenant would be responsible for maintenance andbills, ie water and esb

Siamsa Sessions

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119469409#Comment_119469409

Thanks again.

I’d be a lot wiser after this episode in the unlikely event that we ever lease out land again.

My advice, in case anyone’s interested, is to thread very carefully when leasing land. And build a review in after 18-24 months! It’s safer for both the tenant and the landowner

Manorpark man

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119468525#Comment_119468525

It was two grazings, I was to mow it and the contractor pulled out after 3 rounds due to stones, your man that owned the field knew this and said it was ok, I offered him money but he wouldn’t take it at the time, he’s a very easy man to get on with and doesn’t panic tbf

zidac

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119472919#Comment_119472919

Why would you need to mow a field if it was rented for grazing?

893bet

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119473231#Comment_119473231

looks like he was buying bales straight off the field. Contractor said no. Then the farmer said to graze it instead.

mahoney_j

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119463522#Comment_119463522

Exactly how I’d play it …not too pushy and letting him know your interested ….renting/buying land especially on your main block is usually a once in a generation occurance if even ….you are neighbours now and have been for generations past if u piss him off you’ll piss his kids off who will most likely inherit farm and then that’s that chance gone too

Manorpark man

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119473284#Comment_119473284

Has rushes etc in it so wanted to get them cut

mahoney_j

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119466561#Comment_119466561

Think your underestimating land ownership …fellas and ladies here have land that can go back generations of families and has a huge emotional tie …not so common in other countries …personally would have no issue if someone approached me but everyone is different as some could take it to heart and treat it as nearly an insult

wrangler

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119473932#Comment_119473932

Well , look at it another way, If I wanted to sell land I'd advertise it, otherwise I don't want to hear from anyone unless they're offering many times its value.

Why would you sell land if you didn't want the money, land is returning 2 - 3% to rent, money is returning feck all unless you go high risk and risk losing it like in 2007

whelan2

I'd just approach him and say you're overstocked and could you rent the field please. Then when paying rent next year ,after showing you can look after it, ask would there be any chance of buying it

kirk.

Suppose realistically asking to buy a piece of land is cheeky

You're asking to most likely to sell at below market rate