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Germany needs a bailout

  • 26-07-2022 1:42am
    Registered Users Posts: 6,538 ✭✭✭MrMusician18

    So it looks like nordstream 1 is going to operate at 20% for a while before it's anticipated that the taps are turned off completely. In response to this, the European Commission have come up with a plan to (potentially mandatory) reduce has consumption across the bloc by 15% in an effort to bolster reserves before the winter. This has caused division across the EU with gas network isolated countries like Spain and Portugal resisting.

    Spain's deputy PM even has come out with this line, which has strong echos of the German Finance minister during the eurozone crisis: “Unlike other countries, we Spaniards have not lived beyond our means from an energy point of view,”. Other countries that were at the blunt end of German ire during the Eurozone crisis aren't being particularly kind to the plan, stating that it's simply a rescue for Germany and bailing them out for their poor energy policy.

    Ireland is also isolated physically from European network, so a 15% cut here wouldn't do anything but relieve supply pressure in the UK. The Irish governments position on this mandatory cut isn't clear however. Would such a sacrifice be palatable here to save the economy that charged us 6% on the bailout loans? - I have my doubts.



  • Registered Users Posts: 230 ✭✭head82

    For Ireland to reduce its gas consumption by 15% would in no way benefit the availabity of gas to our European neighbors considering our supplies are from the UK/Norway North sea region due to our location geographically.

    However, I do believe we're tied into some EU agreement that provides for the sharing of available supplys to be distributed equally amongst all EU territories in the event of a shortage.

    How the logistics of that would work, I have no idea.

  • Registered Users Posts: 5,273 ✭✭✭xxxxxxl

    Ha, Will a bomb be going off in Germany 🤣

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,338 ✭✭✭Bit cynical

    If reducing consumption by 15% will not help then we will be told to pay some other way.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,320 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande

    This video of Putin is several years old.

    Germany to close all 84 of its coal-fired power plants, will rely primarily on renewable energy, Jan. 26, 2019

    Germany shuts down half of its 6 remaining nuclear plants, Jan 03, 2022

    Germany Reopens Coal Plants Because Of Reduced Russian Energy, Jul 8, 2022

    Why Germany won’t give up on giving up nuclear, April 28, 2022

    Three nuclear power plants remain active — down from 17 in 2011 — and they’re scheduled for decommissioning at the end of this year.

    Three other plants closed at the end of 2021 and are in the early stages of shutdown. All other plants are being dismantled, and can’t just be switched back on: The containment building of the Isar 1 site in Bavaria, for example, is already being taken apart. Any realistic discussion about delaying the phaseout centers around the final six.

    The six nuclear power plants generated 12 percent of German electricity last year; the final three produce about 5 percent.

    Germans could switch to wood this winter to heat their homes as Russia withholds natural gas, Deutsche Bank says, Jul 13, 2022

    The panic is palpable.

    European Commissioner for Energy Kadri Simson told reporters that gas storage capacities in the EU are now filled to about 65% but that further reduction of Russian gas deliveries will make reaching the 80% target "very challenging."

    Failing to adequately fill in storage capacities means "we risk ending this winter with empty storage which will be impossible to refill in time for the next heating season," she stressed.


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,320 ✭✭✭Pa ElGrande

    Portugal refuses Brussels’ call to cut gas consumption

    Portugal needs gas to power its renewables energy sector. Without gas, and in the situation of drought that has already deeply compromised hydro power, systems in place would simply be incapable of supplying the country, environment minister Duarte Cordeiro told reporters yesterday.

    Portugal isn’t the only country digging in heels against Von der Leyen’s European Gas Demand Reduction Plan. Other dissenters include Spain, Greece, Ireland, Malta and Cyprus. Elsewhere, Poland, Hungary and Slovakia are also opposed, for slightly different reasons: they want the plan ‘softened’; the percentage cut to be lower.

    To be fair, Brussels has already accepted that countries (like Portugal) which have very limited ‘interconnections’ (very little ability to share power) can cut by 5% not 15% – but even that, says Expresso, is not acceptable to either Portugal’s or Spain’s political leaders, both of them in charge of countries with very limited ‘interconnections’.

    Let's see how friendly EU states really are when it comes to sharing an essential resource in limited supply.

  • Registered Users Posts: 8,188 ✭✭✭Markcheese

    Not much good if you live in an apartment ,and your gas central heating goes off ...

    As for support from here ,we'll just send what-ever excess electricity we have through interconnectors to the UK , and from there to Europe ,which we normally do anyway ... I assume though ,that moneypoint and the tarbert power stations will be flat out over winter,(there is a gas inter-connector between the UK and Europe ,so that'll prob be pumping flat out all winter too .. )

    Slava ukraini 🇺🇦

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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,242 ✭✭✭brokenangel

    Wind and solar are just one type of renewable

    We already have hydro but options like wave and methane are available but not invested in

    The national herd could supply plenty of gas instead of been so reliant on UK etc.

    We are not Germany. People seem to be obsessed with Germany and then use it as a reference to say we shouldn't invest in Ireland.

    We could potentially reduce our reliance on gas to a minimal instead of been total reliant.

    If the best option you can come up with in the middle of a crisis is to stick your fingers in your ears shouting "gas gas gas" then thats your choice

  • Registered Users Posts: 8,239 ✭✭✭Pussyhands

    Ursula and co. thought they had all the power with these sanctions yet Putin is 4 steps ahead of them all the time.

  • Registered Users Posts: 111 ✭✭Ouch Chinese Byrne

    If Germany need a bailout then we should bail them out.

  • Registered Users Posts: 4,188 ✭✭✭brickster69

    All roads lead to Rome.

  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]

    You have a point about your description of the bailout but it involved Irish scam artists / developers too.

    I have to disagree about letting Germany freeze. The only beneficiary of that is the deranged imperialist Putin and that endangers all of Eastern Europe and Germany too.

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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,242 ✭✭✭brokenangel

    Back in the early 2000's companies like Mainstream had conversations with Europe about a supergrid connecting everyone and using Solar/Wind/other renewable

    This would move Europe off the total reliance on gas etc. This of course was all discussed and never introduced, so you have Spain now with too much solar power and cutting off people who have invested million in solar etc, yet Germany and France are struggling for power.

  • Registered Users Posts: 1,274 ✭✭✭EOQRTL

    Oh, what a shame.

    And now here's Bob with the sports.....

  • Registered Users Posts: 4,188 ✭✭✭brickster69

    It is not so much about Germans freezing it is about stopping German industry totally collapsing.

    One example - On it's own the automobile industry uses 37% of Germany's Russian gas imports at full flow. Now add in steel, ceramics, chemicals, glass and everything else on top. What happens if Russian gas is turned off for a month, they have to use the storage or close.

    When they announced the cancellation of Nordstream 2 it might turn out to be the biggest own goal in history. Why the **** did they agree to do that ?

    All roads lead to Rome.

  • Registered Users Posts: 12,761 ✭✭✭✭Thelonious Monk

    To be fair, to paraphrase Basil Faulty, Russia started it, they invaded Ukraine! Industry is reliant on it too and signs are we could be facing another recession down the tracks so probably wont be a good few years for Europe in general.

  • Registered Users Posts: 12,063 ✭✭✭✭Danzy

    Germany ran down its energy sources in favour of Russian gas, against all logic.

    It placed a hostile dictatorship in near complete control of its energy policy.

    No doubt Merkel and others were well rewarded for it but Germany must resolve this itself.

    It is self inflicted, unfortunately it will effect us all to some degree and while Germany deserve a very cold winter, it will cost us all.

  • Registered Users Posts: 12,063 ✭✭✭✭Danzy

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