City Council moving to Mervue

what_traffic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123513493#Comment_123513493

"

was worth €36m in early 2022

"

Ya right - Commercial operators at the time were saying they didn't need as much space after two years of the "Working from home". Pandemic learnings!

It really really stinks considering it will be close to 5 years after buying that they will be moving into the building.

rustyfrog

"Galway City Council says it's confident Crown Square remains the most cost-effective solution for its new offices."

How? After being told their unused asset has depreciated by €8m…

Other people's money is easily spent.

what_traffic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123513648#Comment_123513648

Depreciation. Seems like they jumped into the Commercial market to prop up prices in 2022.

Developer did well, allowed them to move to building the HOTEL next door - which is now open before the summer of 2025 has kicked off.

zell12

Easy fix. Just get another more favourable valuation done 😉

Mr_A

The valuation dropping doesn't really matter that much at this stage unless they are looking to sell, or am I missing something?

rustyfrog

If the purchase wasn't RUSHED through by the outgoing chief exec and a proper evaluation of requirements, options and value for money was completed, we might have saved €8m if we still came the same conclusion of buying here.

what_traffic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123517356#Comment_123517356

100%

If this kind of thing happened in Private Sector - heads would have rolled.

Buying a property and then NOT been in a position to use it for years is just daft.

Mr_A

I dunno I've worked in the private sector for decades and seen plenty of deeply stupid stuff and money wasted.

Which is not to say this whole thing has not been a fiasco because it absolutely has.

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123501769#Comment_123501769

Fair enough - but not enough coverage to lead to an appearance in front of the PAC or the ability of local representatives to get clear answers around what CBA was done at the time of making the decision to buy the property and move.
We are seeing some CBA's coming out in the news now saying a refit of existing offices would have been tens of millions - convenient - but what kind of CBA was done prior to recently………

The whole thing is a complete scandal.

what_traffic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123520032#Comment_123520032

True - usually have consequences of such actions though. Lets wait and see in Galway City Councils case

Mr_A

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123520072#Comment_123520072

Sometimes. But more often that not everyone just gets on with it.

CowboyTed

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123520032#Comment_123520032

I had a chat a few months ago from property guys(out of Dublin) who know the sites…

Since they knew both this development and other office spaces were getting built, why didn't they just rent those offices for three years and redevelop the site they were in…

They asked why? I pointed out that the new site isn't in town, so workers can't have easy access to Bus and Train station… This is 1/2 a mile away and is clogged with traffic. It is not good Social Housing site as there is no parks, it has the hallmark of a mini Sheriff Street set up, packing in a people with low income and very high unemployment into a city centre landscape(show where that worked in Ireland before)…

They said, that would be a good idea and because they could bury car parks, build higher, it could have so much space they could make it multi use development initially, (have a apartment hotel, commercial retail units).. Then if needed they can take back this space as demand changes..

I would love to see the argument made for the move, Pros and Cons… I have very little trust in the Galway City Council Executive, in the past I have found there approach lacking… They seem swap between arrogance and incompetence on so many occasions..

Mrs OBumble

Re

packing in a people with low income and very high unemployment into a city centre landscape(show where that worked in Ireland before)…

Well in Galway, social housing in both Whitehall and Bowling Green work pretty well. They put low income people within easy walking distance of shops, doctors and leisure amenities, so they don't need carparks.

ben.schlomo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123603729#Comment_123603729

Very hard to follow that rambling. The site is being built as offices, hotel, retail and apartments.

No parks nearby? Sullivan Park is no more than ten minutes away on foot. Not to mention the pitches and walking/running path at St James.

Mrs OBumble

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123604037#Comment_123604037

I think he referring to the idea of using the current city hall site for social housing.

If so then re parks, Eyre Square, the playground in Lough Attalia Rd, and the green area by Forster Court are all within 10 mins walk.

Homelander

Some updates.

https://www.galwaybayfm.ie/galway-bay-fm-news-desk/city-councillors-approve-fresh-loan-to-got-towards-fit-out-of-new-hq-at-crown-square-198280

https://www.galwaybayfm.ie/galway-bay-fm-news-desk/councillors-set-to-vote-this-afternoon-on-fresh-loan-for-new-council-hq-at-crown-square-198263

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2025/0714/1523420-galway-city-infrastructure/

Homelander

John Morley dedicated the entire first hour of his morning show to Crown and the €60,000,000 loan. I would think it's about as in-depth as you would get on the saga anywhere at this stage.

There is a total overview of the situation, bits with the city CEO, councillors, etc and most of the allegations/claims are talked about.

https://www.galwaybayfm.ie/podcasts/galway-talks/galway-talks-with-john-morley-163-198312

sgthighway

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123638051#Comment_123638051

I only listened to the first 36 minutes of his show. Thought it finished there. Is there more on later in the show?

Homelander

I heard it live, so I guess they cut out ad breaks and stuff for the web, so really the 36 minutes is the full 9 to 10 hour.

sgthighway

I get you. I don't think there was ads on podcast thing I listened to.

zell12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123638051#Comment_123638051

and verdict? Is it a bottomless pit? Will our grandkids taxes be paying off the loan? Will there be a PAC inquiry?

Geuze

If your grandchildren pay LPT or pay fees and charges to GY City Council during 2025-2055, then yes, a small slice of their LPT/Fees will be used to repay the debt.

what_traffic

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123639655#Comment_123639655

Will the Grandkids be hard pressed motorists?

I hear that Galway City Council going to introduce ONE NEW PTD(PayTheDept) parking spot on every street.

It shall be marked out in RED and will be in the "best spots" 😉

Homelander

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/123639655#Comment_123639655

The more I hear about it the less I think there's any real scandal about the place apart from maybe a botched handling of communications.

If separate independent valuations all concluded it was good value in 2022 and the alternatives to Crown Square would have been way more expensive, I would kinda be inclined to believe them because they are the experts.

All the talk of conspiracies, brown envelopes and the rest don't really make any sense if the above is true. And according to Galway Bay there was a huge public meeting where everyone was allowed to ask questions including of the companies who did the valuations.

Even the councillors who were previously shouting about the place voted yes for the newest loan so they obviously must agree that it was all above board and done correctly.

xckjoo

Nah there was definitely something shady with the original deal. Why was it so rushed and done in such mysterious circumstances? The property is worth less now so if they'd moved at the usual speed it could have saved us millions. I've never heard of anything moving through the council with such speed. It was also extremely fortunate timing for the developers from the sounds of it. Less fortunate for the people of Galway that will be paying off a building now worth considerably less than what was paid for it…

My own take:

• A decision was made to buy the site that was for some reason was very very urgent (yet the building is currently still empty)
• Councillors were convinced to vote for it using shady tactics (behind closed doors, one-on-one meetings with no transparency)
• Public backlash made the Councillors panic and start asking the questions they should have asked before the vote
• Change of Guard in City Council brings in new people to all the major staff roles involved
• New people are tasked with the job of getting the council move to Crown Square
• Reports, valuations, etc. compiled. No illegal actions identified. Move to Crown Square presented as the cheapest of the options on the table
• Councillors asked to vote on loan for kitting out building AND for the money for numerous other pet projects they all have
• Councillors pass vote as they feel it is the best value option (and they want the other money for their own projects….)

I'm not going to say anything illegal occurred because I just don't know and the people involved in the first step were far too seasoned to be caught with hands in the cookie jar. It might just be an ethical and moral failing. But something seriously stinks about the selection of the site and the speed it was rushed through at and we'll all be paying for it for the foreseeable future