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Welger RP235 problem

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  • 12-07-2022 10:02am
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 165 ✭✭


    Hi. I’m after buying a welger 235. Took it out yesterday for the first Time and had a lot of issues.

    firstly I cut grass with a 10ft mower, then give it a shake with the hay Bob, it got a good days wilting and then I raked it up in 20ft row with twin rotor rake. after about 20 bales I noticed the net wasn’t tightening enough on the sides so I then tightenEd up the roll, which did help. 

    I still wasn’t getting a flat bale,( small hollow in centres)

    also it’s was clogging like mad, I had to travel very slow, ( not sure if this is because of the haybob?)

    im also not happy with the bales. I’m balling al 8 density but they seem soft in the middle.

    Sometimes when the bale was nearly made u would hear a clogging sound but it wasn’t clogging if you know what I mean so you would have to drive extra slow in case it would stall, I learned the hard way because I had to let 2 x not netted bales out of the chamber. 

    Any help appreciated. 



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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 2,174 ✭✭✭DBK1


    Silage should never be touched with a haybob, as I always say to lads, it’s called a haybob, not a silage bob. The haybob didn’t cause all of your problems there but it would certainly contribute to them.

    How did you tighten the net roll? Did you lock up the brake bar and then adjust the brass nut on the brake disc? If so how did you determine when it was tight enough?

    The hollow in the centre of the bale is nothing to do with the baler, that’s the row in front of the baler that’s the problem. The rake must be set slightly too wide or is not spinning fast enough and is leaving more grass at both sides of the row than it is in the centre, there’s nothing you can do with the baler to solve that, that comes down to your rake settings

    The haybob was certainly a major factor in the clogging. What type of grass were you baling and how many bales per acre? The haybob will make lumps out of the grass and when these lumps try to get through the knives they cause the clogging. If you think it’s clogging even with no lumps then your slip clutch may need tightening too. It’s not unusual to be down to 35 bales an hour after a haybob where you could comfortably be making 60 an hour if the haybob was left in the corner of the yard buried in nettles where it belongs!

    The density of the welger is determined by the hooks on the back door these have sensors on them to measure the pressure on the door and therefore tell the computer when the bale is full. These may need calibration and that would solve your density issues then.

    What do you mean when you say stall? As in the tractor die away or the baler get jammed?



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,243 ✭✭✭Gillespy


    Here is an excellent video showing how to set the net. You will need to play around with it to fine tune it. The smallest movement in the brake adjustment make a big different.

    https://youtu.be/qrG_ZwelkF0

    Had you the knives up? Are they sharp? Try without and it should eat lumps no bother.



  • Registered Users Posts: 165 ✭✭Matty6270


    Thanks DBK1. No tractor wouldn’t die but it would stall d baler. Knives were up and just sharpened. How could I check the calibration



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,243 ✭✭✭Gillespy


    By stalling do you mean the pto clutch going off? Only ever seen that with blocking the pick up. Dropping the revs and floor should feed it through and then net the bale. Press the net button to manually net at any time, you shouldn't have to let bales off without net.

    As for pressure settings, varies from baler to baler I've found. Listen to the tractor and pay attention to the clunk the baler makes as the bale drops off. It might be 8 or it might be 11. Even though it only goes to 10.



  • Registered Users Posts: 8,344 ✭✭✭FintanMcluskey


    The hollow in the centre of the bale is nothing to do with the baler, that’s the row in front of the baler that’s the problem. 

    I'd guess OP means the middle of the bale isn't packed as seen from the side of the bale. Ie where you would drive in spikes to lift it.

    The problem with the haybob is usually the chap driving is tipping about trying to save diesel and not actually running it properly.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,174 ✭✭✭DBK1


    I’d guess he’s talking about the bale not being packed in the middle where he says he’s baling at 8 density and the centre is soft.

    Where he mentions he’s not happy that he’s not getting a flat bale that would be flat across the top which is a row problem.



  • Registered Users Posts: 906 ✭✭✭The Nutty M


    I read it the same as yourself, middle of the bale as opposed to centre density. You're bang on the mark about a badly set up or operated rake for that problem. You can't do anything other than rerake / wuffle the rows or just bale M-shaped bales .

    The slip clutch definitely sounds under pressure as well moreso than encountering lumps from the haybob.



  • Registered Users Posts: 165 ✭✭Matty6270


    Yes the centre of the bale is soft and I’ve no idea why. I’m travelling slow also



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,601 ✭✭✭White Clover


    Do you have a manual for the Baler?

    Might be an idea to get it serviced and set up by a dealer if you're not familiar with it yourself. At least it'd be right then and work correctly when you need it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 165 ✭✭Matty6270


    Not sure off any dealer close by. I’m blaming the haybob for clogging but can’t understand why the soft centres. Like the higher you set the density + the more you think you should pack it



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  • Registered Users Posts: 4,601 ✭✭✭White Clover


    You shouldn't clog one of them. They're an animal to take in stuff, ahead of McHale and John Deere.

    The sensors on the back door most likely need to be calibrated to set them correctly. There should be a good crack from the latches releasing as you open the door to leave out the bale.

    Your local Massey Ferguson dealer would be handling Lely/Welger parts and servicing now. They were a very popular Baler back in the day so there are plenty dealers who sold them when new. If you can say what part of the country you are in, someone on here might be able to point you in the direction of a dealer familiar with them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,243 ✭✭✭Gillespy


    Wouldnt have to be a dealer, anyone familiar running Welgers would quickly set you on the right path.

    Ignore the density setting if they're so soft, keep going until it drags the tractor a bit. Now that will vary on your tractor of course. The best guide with Welgers is the feel you get when the bale falls out. The locked door means a properly made bale will rock you a bit.



  • Registered Users Posts: 165 ✭✭Matty6270


    I’m guessing it had to be the haybob clogging it as it seems to run fine



  • Registered Users Posts: 165 ✭✭Matty6270


    so Do you think it might need calibration. Is there anyway to test this



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,243 ✭✭✭Gillespy


    Best if you did, its a dealer job. If 8 is so soft, chances are 10 isn't good enough either. Can't run the net on auto if it needs to go beyond 10. Calibrated right 9 would be bringing 130hp to its knees. It will lead to more consistent bales too.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,105 ✭✭✭davidk1394


    Is your baler a master or a Profi machine? Can you set the density off the control box or do you do it at the back door ?


    The spongy middle is to do with the rake not the baler. Narrow the rake width in lighter grass and keep a haybob Well away unless you plan on making hay.



  • Registered Users Posts: 674 ✭✭✭farmertipp


    haybob a disaster. baled after once only once with a 235 xtracut 17 which was new at the time and made hopeless bales.



  • Registered Users Posts: 19,289 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump


    When you say "soft in the middle", what are you comparing to? Are you more used to a belt baler? If you are used to the belt baler, the centres might seem a little soft in comparison but the fixed chamber bales will still have packed a lot more in overall. Not sure if people are still silly enough to bale silage with belt balers but 10-15 years ago there were still lads using them for that.



  • Registered Users Posts: 165 ✭✭Matty6270


    Hi all . Just a up date. I mowed 12 acres with a 10ft conditioner mower. Left the swade as wide as I cud I was baling at density 10, still no good. Bales very soft. I checked the back door voltages and they are different from start to finish. I'm waiting on word back from the lely dealer this week. Also I noticed the Allan key bolt at the back of the door bock was very loose.




  • Registered Users Posts: 2,243 ✭✭✭Gillespy


    Did baling the row direct at least sort the other issues you had with bale shape and clogging noise? Did you ignore the display and try making a proper bale by taking the baler and tractor somewhere close to their limit?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 674 ✭✭✭farmertipp


    drive from side to side and keep going till auto net wrap kicks in



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,243 ✭✭✭Gillespy


    Net on auto is no use if it's maxed out at 10 and the bales are still soft. Until it's calibrated correctly keep going as far as you dare and net manually. You'll know then if you have bigger problems than bad calibration. Still not 100% what the clogging thing is about.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,174 ✭✭✭DBK1


    What hp tractor have you pulling it? Set it to manual and ignore all the beeping for the bale being full and keep driving. A 120 or 130 hp should be well under pressure before you start tying. When the bale is tied and you pull the spool for the door there should be a crack out of the door when it opens due to the pressure the bale was putting on the hooks and the baler should bounce when the bale comes out. You should feel that bounce without even looking back. That’s when you know you’re making a good bale. The last welger I had with the e link box like yours would have done that at anywhere above 6 or 7 on the density settings.



  • Registered Users Posts: 165 ✭✭Matty6270


    Hi all. Just a up date on the baler. I got the main dealer out the other day, firstly both rubber blocks on the back door hooks where completely wore, like 15mm of a difference between the new and old. Also the calibration was off. Before it was 130bar at the back door on density 10, now it is 185bar at density 10. I have yet to use the baler so hopefully this solves my problem.

    thanks for all the help



  • Registered Users Posts: 165 ✭✭Matty6270


    Hi, so I’m a year on and still have issues.

    so last year I got the lely dearer out to replace door bushings and calibrate sensors at the end off the year, he was having problems trying to set 1 sensors voltage, so with no pressure on the door 1 sensor was 1.84v and the other 1.16, and when 190bar pressure was put 1 was 2.56v and 2.44v so I only had 40 so bales left to do at that time. I cud drive in density 10 no problem and bales still weren’t that tight,

    so he came back again 2 weeks ago and replaced 1 sensor, and we got 1.34v empty and 2.59v at 190bar. He couldn’t get any better, so yesterday was the first day out with her, again no problem driving at density 10, bales are better but tractor not dying out or anything, now I did only bale a light 10ft swides.

    also when the bale was netting I checked the door voltage and the good sensor was 2.53v and the other 2.20v

    anybody any thoughts of my problem, I want to pack the bales as tight as I can but a guy told me density 8 would die out any decent tractor.

    I have a 140 hp tractor.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,174 ✭✭✭DBK1


    If you see my post from last year just above, set the baler on manual, ignore all the beeping, keep driving until the tractor starts dying, press the button to tie the bale and let it off. See what sort of a bale you have then. I’ve the newest version of your baler, being pulled with 185hp and at 9 or 10 density the tractor will be dying.

    I’ve one customer that splits his baling between me and a contractor with a fusion, he feeds all his bales through a diet feeder, he says the closest a fusion bale has ever got to my bales is 70kgs lighter and normally more than 100kgs lighter. He also bought silage from 2 people this winter, both baled with fusions, and didn’t come anywhere near the weight of my bales either.

    I know you can’t really compare bale weights from bought in bales as you don’t know the conditions they were baled in but on his own grass he knows exactly what grass he has and can make an accurate comparison. You should be able to make the same type of bale with your welger.



  • Registered Users Posts: 165 ✭✭Matty6270


    Thanks for the reply. I just didn’t like driving on in case I done any harm or put wild pressure on the baler. Twice the lely dealer was out with me and still cant get it set right



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,174 ✭✭✭DBK1


    You won’t burst it for a few bales anyway, definitely try it for a few bales and see how it goes. Now you don’t want to be killing the tractor, but just as you feel the pressure coming on the tractor and it starts to die a small bit tie the bale and let it out. See what your bale is like then.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,243 ✭✭✭Gillespy


    Gauge it by the sound the door makes when you open it. Need to hear a solid clunk. Combined with watching the rpms and listening to the engine note, you’ll be flying making consistent solid bales. I find myself clutching just as the beeper is about to start anyways so it does work. I’m sure most baler operators will say the same.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,174 ✭✭✭DBK1


    Yep, if there was never a buzzer on the baler when you’re used to it you’ll know exactly when it’ll tie just by the sound of the tractor.



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