Sympathy for those with addiction

newgrangepets

Do you judge those with addiction? I have a cousin who has created a rift within the family. They went on a J1 a few years and then came home just before the lockdown. Turns out they got addicted to opioid painkillers. they spent most of their wages on codeine, tramadol, and even bought stronger pills from a friend. Long story, short, they lost their job and started stealing from my uncles/aunties who barred her from the house and told my parents not to give her money.

They went to Cluain Mhuire and are doing better but the damage to their reputation is still there. Half of my family either doesn't speak to them. My brother has an upcoming wedding and refuses to invite her.

I personally think it's a bit harsh. While I can understand the anger with stealing, it's quite obvious she was given strong opioids in America without really knowing the addiction potential. It' one of the numerous tragic tales with the painkillers they hand out there.

Would you sympathize will her or understand why people have cut her out?

FortuneChip

In this particular case you've described, I feel they deserve some sympathy.

What are you, 22/23 on a J1? Young, impressionable, and dealing with a lot of new experiences that even with a decent education/upbringing, you can make bad decisions.

Then, things escalate. Personally think we're capable of being very fragile sometimes, and once an addiciton takes hold, it can be very tough to break. It's an illness, and people don't even realise they have it. It can change destroy a person's rational thinking, which leads to internally justifying what's obviously horrific behaviour like lying, stealing, and can have some immediate consequences like losing your job - which breeds desperation and just brings about more need to lie and steal, and deceive people around you.

So, you hope the addict comes to a realisation that they need help, and enters some form of treatment programme like Cluain Mhuire.

This person seems to have made a bad choice, didn't understand the potential consequences and lost control of it. They need help and support and I feel they deserve the chance to try make things right, and make amends. They're still young, it seems very unfortunate if they already have to forfeit some of those relationships at such a young age.

It's possible your brother either has a personal problem with the cousin, or could feel that inviting the cousin would incite a bad atmosphere with half of the family resenting the cousin. And he doesn't want that on his day - which I'd understand.

Potential-Monke

It's all gonna be situation specific. I'd have sympathy if they can't get out of the situation, but overall no. I could have been an alcoholic, even a stage where the class A's were appealing, but I was able to stop myself. Addictions are horrible, but the only person who can beat it is the addict themselves. We can help, but you will only allow your outreached hand to be slapped away a few times before you rightly stop offering.

Bridges can and do be burned, but I don't agree with this Christian enforced "forgive everyone" bollocks. Some people don't deserve to be forgiven. Up to them to learn to live with it imo.

Fallout2022

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=COU-Nly3SAA

drug

PTH2009

Sorry for going off topic I always wonder what relapse is actually like for an addict

Say someone is off drink for years, would 1, bottle/pint drive them over the edge or is it all about self will

chicorytip

An addiction to anything - not just drugs or alcohol - can be broken with discipline and willpower. It's the chronic addicts and recidivists that I have little sympathy for. They are just weak and selfish.

Badly Drunk Boy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119264517#Comment_119264517

I'm sure it depends on the person but I don't think that one drink alone would drive somebody over the edge. I think it might cause them to be a bit complacent, thinking "See, I'm able to have a drink without it being an issue" but the next time, it's three or four, and suddenly there's a downward spiral and they are back in their old situation.

Or another person might have that one drink and think "That's my record of 5 or 10 ten years sober gone so what's the point? I might as well be hanged for a sheep as a lamb!" and then go on a mad one.

rob316

I'd definitely have sympathy in this situation, whats happened in America with opiod addiction is widespread and happened to people who never took anything recreational.

I have a family member who is an alcoholic and I've so much time for him for the simple reason when he relapses he tries and comes back so strong. I mean he goes off the rails when he relapses I'm talking has to be restrained and admitted but such a nice fella sober he'd give you his last euro and does so much charity work.

Wanderer78

very difficult situation for a family, theres very likely underlining psychological issues occurring with this person, requiring long term professional guidance, that ultimately dont exist in ireland, so.....

the person doesnt need ridiculing but compassion and supports from loved ones, but its understandable why this occurs, family's also need professional guidance and supports, in order to appropriately deal with such situations, which again, effectively also dont exist in ireland, so.....

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119264667#Comment_119264667

That's a very simplistic way of looking at it. It's not just a case of 'jaysus, that crack is very moreish, I'll have a bit more of that!'

Some people have genuine traumas and horrific experiences they are trying to escape from via their addictions.

At an extreme end of the scale, would you say the rape victim who uses painkillers to numb the pain is just weak and selfish? Obviously not.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119264517#Comment_119264517

For a few years I doubt there were more than a couple of hundred (if even) people in the country drinking more than I was. Haven't had a drop in a few years, went cold turkey after a fantastic blowout. 😂 It's ****. Do I think I could have a drink or 3 and stop there? I'd be 95% sure it'd be fine. But I just couldn't be bothered taking that little chance. It's been **** enough but at least I can say it's been X years since I had a drink. Even without going off the rails I don't fancy being hungover every weekend again and with the extra years I dread to imagine what the hangover would be like. 🤣

I tend to overdo things though. Drink, obviously, food too. Started a bit of smoking a couple years after I stopped drinking, was fine for a bit but this year I went down the same hole I did with drink so had to knock that on the head. Found it way worse than stopping drinking. Though I love seeing Facebook updates from "sober" friends who smoke morning, noon and night. Would love to see them try to go a week without smoking. 😅

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119266533#Comment_119266533

theres nothing simplistic about such an opinion, its clearly just ignorance!

chicorytip

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119266533#Comment_119266533

Well, you need to separate the addiction from the trauma that may have triggered it. Not all addicts have suffered major trauma or suffered an abusive or dysfunctional upbringing. Most young people begin experimenting with drink and drugs in their teens because of peer pressure and not entirely because of family dysfunction or social deprivation.

Some victims of rape may use drugs or alcohol to numb their pain. That's a conscious decision they make and they know the consequences that will arise from that behaviour.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119266781#Comment_119266781

fcuking hell, please dont ever become a health care professional that provides such 'advice', you clearly havent a fcuking clue!

FlubberJones

For this specific situation I would say if they are stable and honest then people bringing them back into the family and going to family events would be a positive for both parties, this is my experienced opinion.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119266829#Comment_119266829

unfortunately theres no guarantees with such issues, and relapses are generally part and parcel, with such events being very triggering

HazeDoll

In theory of course we see addicts as deserving of sympathy and support, whether there is underlying trauma or not.

In reality though, it's harder to be endlessly patient. A friend of mine tried to 'be there' for a friend who is an addict. He acted as a go-between when her relationship with her family broke down. For a while she straightened herself out but she was in dire financial straits so he got a few quid together to get some of her bills up to date so she would be able to cope. He answered incoherent midnight phonecalls and tried to get her help. Over and over again she threw it back in his face, at one point stealing a communion card from his car that was for his niece because she reckoned there'd be cash in it. Her other friends cut contact but because he was the last person left who was 'on her side' he felt he couldn't abandon her.

His relationship suffered, he was in an awful state. He decided he had had enough. She asked him for a favour, a lift or something, and he said no. That evening she attempted suicide and gave his name as her next of kin. He's still tangled up in her misery, terrified he'll get a visit from a guard some evening asking him to identify a body.

I'm afraid the lesson I learned from the whole thing is as follows: By all means help someone out. Do anything you can to try to get them appropriate help, listen to them, try to be supportive. But make sure you're not the last person left for them to turn to. You do not want to be the last one to try to cut ties.

FlubberJones

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119266904#Comment_119266904

I have to disagree, I did not see such events as triggering, rather the opposite. And stability is a very easy one to gauge, but this is individual experience and I would doubt all experiences are the same

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119266983#Comment_119266983

...this is where professional help is required, the average citizen can only offer so much, most of us are not truly prepared for what help is actually required, but these professionals services dont actually truly exist....

Patsy167

We should follow the Portugese model of treating addiction as an illness rather than a crime - https://time.com/longform/portugal-drug-use-decriminalization/

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119266990#Comment_119266990

again, no situation is identical, yes such situations can indeed be truly beneficial, but sometimes they can do the opposite, its very situational dependent, and sometimes requires professional guidance, its a tricky one....

NIMAN

Drink and drugs seem to be the addictions of discussion on here, but smartphones are seriously going to be a major problem in the future (if it isn't already).

We have already seen the damage social media has done to many young people's mental state of health. It's only going to get a LOT worse.

boardsie12

Not really!

People should be aware of the damage that drugs do, not just to their bodies, but also to the people around them, I strongly feel that there should be a stronger awareness in society and regular guest speakers coming around to schools, especially amount the 16-18 age group, to warn people of the damage associated with drugs!

I had a really good mate, I wouldn't even call him a mate anymore, who got heavy into coke, he was young at the time when he started snorting, didn't know or realize that he would get addicted, or how easy it was to get addicted, but the addiction got hold of him and cost him a lot of close friendships, a relationship, and also a lot of respect.

He went from being a guy that everyone wanted and liked being around, to an absolute junkie with mood swings and ended up losing a lot, including his communication skills, and more money than anyone would want to lose.

He lost it all, even his job, nowadays, he's missing a piece of his nostril from all the snorting and it's so incredibly sad to see his decline, someone who was once capable of keeping a job and friends, now a worthless junkie.

I don't blame anyone else, only him, he doesn't deserve and ounce of respect, nor do the guys from their extreme J1 adventure

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119267009#Comment_119267009

i do actually agree with this, but you can be damn sure, its not all roses!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119267050#Comment_119267050

yup, think its already in dsm 5, or maybe going into dsm 6

NIMAN

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119267074#Comment_119267074

I'll be honest @Wanderer78 I had to look up DSM! But interesting to see.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119267072#Comment_119267072

...the reality is, we ve actually been doing the whole education thing for decades, and our addiction issues are worsening, now of course you could argue without such, the situation would be worse, and theres merit to that but theres clearly something going dramatically wrong!

boardsie12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119267127#Comment_119267127

Anyone who decides to start using drugs clearly doesn't have the level of awareness that's necessary!

I feel like there isn't enough awareness in Ireland, I never remember anyone ever coming to guest speak about the dangers of drugs when I was a student, that could easily have changed a lot of things, saved a lot of lives, and encouraged people never to go down that road.

I feel like there's a lot of peer pressure nowadays, people wanting to be cool, fit in, and impress the ladies, and latching onto drugs is not the thing to do

o1s1n

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119266781#Comment_119266781

I am talking about the addicts that have suffered from major trauma though. There are a plethora of reasons people end up addicted to all manner of substances. Simply stating that all chronic addicts and recidivists are weak and selfish completely ignores the countless nuances in each individual case and assumes that millions of people have the exact same experience.

That kind of attitude just wreaks of a superiority complex and extreme lack of empathy tbh.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119267253#Comment_119267253

yup, there were visits to my school in the 90's, a lot of drug addiction is due to 'acts of disperse', its humans trying to fulfil their unmet needs by escaping their reality, as reality is simply just too much, as theyre simply unable to meet their own needs, in particular their own critical needs, such as property and health care needs etc

chicorytip

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119267273#Comment_119267273

I accept that argument - up to a point. I am referring more to long term addicts who have availed of medical treatment, psychotherapy or counselling are who are now educated about the dangers of drug taking, yet continually relapse. There needs to be a genuine willingness on the part of the addict to reform completely.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119267050#Comment_119267050

It's not just mental health that can suffer as a result of prolonged smartphone or computer usage. Physical issues such as postural problems and eyesight difficulties ,even among teenagers, will become common.

Riddle101

I would have sympathy for someone who is an addict, especially if they are trying to get clean, but patience and sympathy are two different things I think. There is only so much you can do for an addict before it becomes a case where the only thing you can hope for is that they make the decision to get clean themselves, otherwise there's not much you can do for them if they're not willing to get clean. If they're stealing from people then it makes it harder to trust them, and if you give them money then you are enabling them as well. People just have their limits.

Kermit.de.frog

Depends on the situation. Anyone can give up alcohol/smoking but the stresses of their own lives may get in the way of the control and confidence they need to build. This is not always the case though. Some with a bad hand give up these things all the time. I'd say it just takes a lot more short term pain/effort.

I'd be far less sympathetic to smokers/drinkers/whatever with a good job, education, and less to worry about in life etc etc.

con___manx1

I have a gambling addiction and had problems with drugs in my younger days

I would sympathise with the girl.

I never stole from anyone but I hated myself. It was self destruction that drove me. Psychological problems.

I have the addiction under control a few years now. Life is good.

This girl has problems. She has that self destruction in her to.

She needs support from the people that love her.

They need to educate themselves and understand more about addiction.

Liberty_Bear

Per Con above its all like a vicious cycle that perpetuates itself. On one hand you have this need that stops you feeling the pain you have, you come out of the state of excitement/Drunkeness/high etc and then feel shame. To stem the shame you take whatever it is you are on to numb that pain. Wash rinse repeat. Addiciton aint easy I can imagine for people. Ive had issues with drug addicts in town and had to firmly tell them not to bother me again but its an illness. No one asked for it, just happens to people.

Strumms

Sympathy for people addicted to legal substances, things… alcohol etc.

no sympathy for anyone with an addiction to cocaine, heroin, amphetamines, etc… supporting criminals, serious criminals, enabling murder and destruction.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119266801#Comment_119266801

i think you need to back off berating anyone with a different perspective from you here

we as a country have huge issues with addiction historically and it's highly likely any one person with a strong opinion on these issues has a personal reason for holding it.

i have a specific perspective on the idea that any addict becomes a full time job to prop up for the people around them regardless of how much time, energy, attention and resources have already gone into them or that there's always an onus to keep trying to understand and persevere.

and if there's one thing my experience has made me hate it's the do-gooder who wags an easy finger at the people who decide that they won't become a support function for a person that wont help themselves.

you should step back and apologise or you should set out your personal expertise or experience that allows you to tell others how to feel about issues like this- more google expertise no doubt

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119267127#Comment_119267127

Could it be the criminal justice system providing an ineffective deterrent ? Sentencing if an ineffective deterrent would be increased by 15-20%… ?

bad2thebone

It's hard to have sympathy for an addict who's violent, aggressive and brings trouble to their families. Robbing all around them and drawing dodgy people to your house looking for payback, looking for drugs etc

What some good mother's father's, siblings, friends, work colleagues etc had to put up with is absolute hell on earth, life savings gone over a drug debt not paid off. The lies, deception and promise's... walking on eggshells because of their moods and motives, paronia. Christmases ruined, birthdays railroaded, kid's confused etc

I have sympathy for the hopeless passive addict who's a loner and zero responsibility only themselves to look after, incapable of having a partner or family just an absolute wreck, they usually are law abiding citizens and spend all they have on their habit and will wait until next dole day or whenever to start the drinking or drugs again. Begging for a few quid, falling around off their heads, harmless in general but unable to get their lives together. Loner's and just cannot face the world without being off their heads. They're a minority for sure but I have more empathy for them because they're harmless divels. And would be afraid of confrontation or getting into trouble. By nature they're not violent or would harm anyone only themselves.

As for the aggressive types I just cannot be empathetic towards them, they're nothing but trouble, even when they're trying to get better,sober or clean it's hard to forgive them and their mood swings and chopping and changing is quite irritating. They get sober and clean, and they go from being demons to being on a spiritual crusade and everyone has to dance to their tune. I don't know which is worse, them being the former or the latter. As they can be quiet manipulative when they take on this new age spiritual boloxilogy, they'll talk their way out of anything, or excuse their bad behavior. Ask them about something and they'll be all philosophical about it, never a yes or no. And still inside they're quite crafty and have a lot of agendas. Everyone gets the old sob story and how well they're doing.

When the quite passive addict or alcoholic gets well they tend to get better much quicker and are more honest and caring. They get out there and they are givers rather than takers.

fatherted1969

Currently fostering a child who was born from an addict, as open minded as I'd like to think I am I find it incredibly difficult to forgive the damage she caused to the child we now have. I'm absolutely heartbroken about it. The supports are there but she needs to have the willpower to take the first step and walk away from her previous life.

I don't think I'll ever be able to forgive her for the damage she caused to her little boy 😣

kirk.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119269516#Comment_119269516

The addiction isolates you and the drug numbs the pain and isolation

They don't go away

Bit of a vicious circle

PTH2009

The 'bump' way of a night out is rampant

Tomaldo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119269560#Comment_119269560

If you're so against serious criminals committing murder, destruction blah blah, then why don't you support legalisation of said substances instead of judging people who take them. Anyway the vast vast majority of illegal drug users are not addicts, they're recreational. Also alcohol kills far more people than any banned substance that I know about.

Bobblehats

Thing about junkies, randy bastards whose prick becomes a spike even more potent and capable of a litany of devastation in their wake. Sure you’d have to neuter them

A lot of sweeping generalisations when it comes to addictions, but that tends to be normal with people who haven't experienced such addictions first hand.

I've "had" a few addictions, and each was different from the other, as were the cases as to why I started or restarted, along with the experiences each time. Physical addictions vs mental addictions (or the combination of both). My addictions have never impacted on other people, so, posters really should rein in the impulse to assume that addicts affect others around them. Some do.. many others manage their addictions, and are more private with their own habits.

I'd have sympathy for anyone suffering through an addiction, or who has "gotten over" their addiction. TBH I probably have more sympathy for those who have gotten over their addictions, because it's a near regular battle not to return to that substance when times are bad (or good, depending on the substance). God knows, I itch something bad whenever I pass a casino, or someone offers me something psychedelic. Never felt any addiction for cannabis being able to stop easily whenever I wanted, although I do miss the "feeling" of being stoned, but it's easily ignored.. whereas other substances invade my awareness more often. TBH I've found tobacco to be the hardest drug to stop for extended periods (years), although I know other people have found it relatively easy to do.

Addiction, and the substance (or whatever) involved is very personal. It's individual to that person. Yes, the substance is available commonly, but our reasons for starting/continuing/stopping are all unique to that particular person.

Bobblehats

An interesting to do is to leave some cash lying around. If they take it; they’re weak if they don’t then a truer friend than most I’ll give it to them…

kirk.

Yes it's normal for those not familiar with addiction to not understand

As evidenced here on this thread