"Sinking" American Fridge Freezer flush into partition wall - Mini Project

17-06-2022 6:11pm #1

So I bought this ^^^ large American fridge freezer. As can be seen the kitchen area is too small for this to fit. I can then get rid of the integrated (& very small) under counter fridge and freezer units. These can be converted to additional storage space within the kitchen.

So the plan is to cut a fridge shaped hole out of the partition wall on the left. This will mean that the rear of the fridge will protrude into the utility room.

This require demolishing the cupboards in the utility room including a sink, relocating the washing machine & tumble dryer, a fair bit of replumbing and rewiring, building new cupboards in the utility room. This provides the oppertunity to build better cupboards with even more storage which better suit our needs. I will also need to get a potable water feed to the fridge for the filtered water and ice dispenser (as I don't like the ones that have reservoirs). I will also need to house the water filter and an isolation valve in the utility room.

The plan is that the fridge will sit flush into this wall where the notice board is. I will also need some sort of a door frame around the fridge.

It will not suprise many that this did not go down well with the "management"!

Thoughts??

Cian59 · 17-06-2022 6:18pm

I know the fridge is bought at this stage, any reason you didn't go for something with less hassle? Is it mostly the water/ice feature?

17-06-2022 6:22pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119217119#Comment_119217119

The goals are:

1) Far lager fridge, the current one is too small. Dito for the freezer. We simply can't store enough. What we have does not work at all.

2) More storage space required in the kitchen.

3) Better storage in the utility room. What we have does not work.

4) The filtered water and ice despenser is not as inportant as the above, these are really a "nice to have". But they also cut down on the need to purchase bottled water.

5) Sure it will be a bit of fun! I love DIY.

awec · 17-06-2022 6:27pm

Not a bad idea.

I would maybe look at putting the fridge at the very edge of the wall, so that you are losing the area where the washing machine and first cupboard is today in the utility, rather than trying to cut a hole in the middle of the wall. Left hand side of the fridge as you are looking at it would be flush with the edge of the corner that's there today?

This way, you wouldn't need to frame it, but you'd also have a more usable space in the utility room.

Top below rather than bottom?

banie01 · 17-06-2022 6:31pm

1st thought is, you should have got management buy in before you ran with this 😉

Looking at the utility room, and the plumbing for the sink and laundry gubbins probably ties you into keeping those machines against that wall. You will also need to leave clearance at the back of the fridge for airflow, so likely at least an extra 150mm depth.

If I was doing it, I'd clear the wall on utility side and ensure any plumbing and power can be moved easily. Then I'd aim to have the fridge inset as close to the corner in the kitchen photo as poss. Move the lights witch an as close to the end there as practible. On the kitchen side, it means you can open the presses and oven without fridge door interfering and vice versa.

On the utility side, id look at stacking the dryer on top of the washing machine and placing them on furthest left. Where the space next to filing cabinet is. Then you can see what space you have left between laundry setup and fridge inset to fit in a sink. It also makes it an easier job to plumb water supply to the fridge.

17-06-2022 6:32pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119217153#Comment_119217153

That was the first plan but I think I will move it more central just for asthetics. This will also allow the utility room door to open more as the fridge is quite deep (and the back of it needs space to release heat). The door opens into the utility room, see photo above.

17-06-2022 6:38pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119217165#Comment_119217165

Yes, the plan is tumble dryer on top of washing machine. I agree with 6" behind the fridge to allow heat out, I will also install a few vents. I can position the fridge more centrally on the wall without clashing with any doors. I want to ensure that utility room door can open past 90 degrees.

17-06-2022 6:55pm

@awec Regarding your first diagram in post 4 above this would mean that I would see the side of the fridge which would not look very nice. It is not designed to be seen. Only the front of the fridge is stainless steel. I also do that think this would provide as solid a solution. Although this is a partition wall there is a hot water tank above so the ceiling then have some bounce which could cause some cracking.

Lumen · 18-06-2022 12:00am

Pros: it'll be amazing.

Cons: you won't be living there to use it 😂

18-06-2022 7:33am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119218311#Comment_119218311

Well it is too late now!

The plan is to start off by exposing 4 x 2" uprights within the stud wall. This will also expose piping and cabling that will need to be moved. I will also have to redo the waste pipe for the washing machine.

This photo also illustrates the lack of space between the edge of the utility room door and the corner. The fridge will not fit here.

Jim_Hodge · 18-06-2022 7:36am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119218615#Comment_119218615

For a fridge? The mind boggles!

18-06-2022 7:40am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119218627#Comment_119218627

Sure why not? It's a bit of fun. It is only a partition wall. Look how easy it is to cut:

Besides I simply can't fit the fridge anywhere else and the additional cupboard storage is needed in both the kitchen and utility room.

Where is your DIY spirit? 😀 😄 😀

18-06-2022 11:53am

This shows more of the wall removed. What needs to be done with the plumbing and wiring is clearer.

What a mess! I removed many of these 1/2" connections, they are just potential points of failure:

18-06-2022 12:00pm

New waste piping for the washing machine and waste for boiler condensate drain. The start of building a base for the washing machine:

Washing machine base completed. Due to tiles missing behind what was the built in cupboards in the utility room I have to use 12 mm plywood to level up the floor either side of where with wall was:

^^^ This allows me to build a base for the fridge.

18-06-2022 1:57pm

A potable water supply will have to come from the mains. The easiest way to get a mains water supply to the fridge is to T off the supply to the tank in the attic. From here I can pass through the hot press with ½" pipe and from there drop straight into the utility room. I have one isoaltion valve at the attic T and one in teh utility room for the water filter. I checked, these will work with a washing machine type valve. Not too pretty, but this is now installed.

18-06-2022 4:25pm

Fridge in position! Need to make progress with the cupboards in the utility room next....

Gant21 · 18-06-2022 4:48pm

I noted earlier that you have air gap at the back, was there any specifications that the fridge needs free space out the sides and top?

18-06-2022 5:47pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119220443#Comment_119220443

Yes there are specifications that state what space is required around the fridge. It is designed to fit snugly into a cupboard and only needs space to the rear. I will provide it with more than the minimum required just because I can.

18-06-2022 10:03pm

Plumbing completed, washing machine and tumble dryer wiring completed. Boiler wiring completed. Washing machine and tumble dryer abck working.

Tomorrow is another day.

19-06-2022 5:33pm

It’s shaping up nicely now. Lots of useful storage. I was taking no chances by installing four number 4” vents on the back of the fridge. Also see cut out for the door handle and a door stop above it to allow the door to open to the maximum.

Plenty more storage in the new fridge:

19-06-2022 5:41pm

All of the electrical work has now been completed. The water filter is installed and both the water and ice dispenser are working.

A bit of finishing to be done everywhere. Painting in particular.

Edit: corrected confusing typo.

Lumen · 19-06-2022 6:03pm

If there were DIY forum Oscars this would have to be nominated.

The sheer speed and audacity is breathtaking.

RainInSummer · 19-06-2022 11:15pm

Good stuff. Fair play on even attempting it.

When I saw the first post I was wondering could you do what I did. Just stick the main fridge in the utility room and be done.

It works for us as we just leave the door open and it's as close from the cooker or sink to the big fridge in the utility room as it is to the small integrated fridge in the kitchen.

Lumen · 20-06-2022 5:02am

I knew I'd seen this design somewhere before.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NT3Dd0fH9es

20-06-2022 6:10am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119225231#Comment_119225231

I did consider this, but the utility room is very narrow. The walking space is essentially the width of the door, somtimes this space gets very conjested. Apart from this it is much more convenient to have the fridge in the kitchen area. Each to their own I guess.

Regardless of the fridge part I was always going to make new cupboards in the utility room and get rid of the sink that was in there as we never used it. The original cupboards were poorly designed and built. We wanted space for things like the ironing board and vacuum cleaner.

Apart from the reasons above for taking this project on I really enjoy it, simple as 😀

Having all of the right tools helps a lot. I have a shed full of professional hand tools and power tools. During the lock down I also bought one of these track saws:

https://toolforce.ie/makita-plunge-saw-110v-maksp6000k1l/

An amazing piece of kit! This makes cutting plywood very accurately and very quickly a simple task.

CJhaughey · 20-06-2022 6:36am

I think the venting for the fridge may still be inadequate. A small camping absorption fridge has larger vents than what you have installed, getting heat out of a wall isn’t as efficient as getting heat out of a roof, you might have been better to vent the area above the fridge than the panel facing into the room.

Jim_Hodge · 20-06-2022 6:57am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119225463#Comment_119225463

My first thoughts as well.

Gant21 · 20-06-2022 7:21am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119225463#Comment_119225463

Charlie you are bang on, the vents that are there should be higher. Hot air rises as you well know from the dail.

20-06-2022 3:03pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119225463#Comment_119225463

I am an engineer, so I am familiar with following manufacturer’s specifications and design constraints. I went above and beyond what was required. Not only do I have additional space behind the unit, and the 4 vents (which weee not a requirement) I also have it designed so that the heat can escape from above. Furthermore I have checked how hot the released air is and there is no discernible increase in temperature.

Girl Geraldine · 20-06-2022 3:22pm

Your apartment now doesn't comply with Part B of the building regulations because you have broken down the partition and only replaced the actual division between rooms with plywood which obviosuly won't have the required fire rating for compartments.

Your house might now be extremely difficult to sell, except to a cash buyer, because of that and because of the fudged up layout that would need to be reversed if the fridge is removed which it inevitably will be at some point. Also, your home insurance will be invalidated in the event of a fire as the house no longer meets the Part B regulations. And a fire is now more likely since you have an electric appliance, surrounded in wood with inadequate ventilation.

I think this was a ridiculous amount of work just to facilitate a fad appliance.

20-06-2022 3:49pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119227567#Comment_119227567

There is so much wrong with this post I don’t know where to start but here goes.

The fridge is designed to be installed in a wooden cupboard.

The fridge has more ventilation than required.

This has no impact on my insurance.

The plasterboard was not fire rated.

This is easily reversed.

The fridge will not be removed, except to replace.

It’s not an apartment, it’s a detached house. Besides, I’m not selling so I’m not concerned.

It’s not your home so you need not worry.

CJhaughey · 20-06-2022 4:36pm

I was only offering advice based on some experience with refrigeration. I cannot see the vents above the fridge so based my comment on the photographs provided.

I would make one observation and that is if there is no discernible temperature differential in the air passing over the cooling coils at the back of the fridge and ambient air temp then something is not right. There will always be a temp differential if you are moving heat with a pump. You may want to investigate this at some point.

20-06-2022 4:57pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119227851#Comment_119227851

Understood. Your concern is valid, this is why I looked carefully into this. Remember these fridges are designed to be installed into a far tighter fitting cupboard.

I just Installed a fridge in a larger cupboard. The fact that I removed some plasterboard is neither here nor there.

on your other point I think the reason that there is no discernible temperature difference is due to the fact that it is so well ventilated. The heat is simply “diluted”. It is performing really well.

pm1977x · 20-06-2022 7:41pm

Fair play on tackling all that! Also, that handle cutout is a thing of beauty!

mickdw · 20-06-2022 8:00pm

Looks great from kitchen side. Very clean look.

I wouldn't be doing any framing around it if it was mine. I'd just do a a plastic stop bead/corner bead depending on how you want to finish the sides of the hidden recess and just feather out the finish and paint.

20-06-2022 8:27pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119228512#Comment_119228512

Actually I plan to finish it off with some architrave on the kitchen side. It looks a tad rough at the moment.

geotrig · 21-06-2022 9:33am

Fair play dude great stuff ,love these type of threads and good use of the utility space overall if you ask me !

Gant21 · 21-06-2022 9:38am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119228594#Comment_119228594

Architrave is 1970’s not even baz ashmashy would do that.

monseiur · 21-06-2022 10:16am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119227567#Comment_119227567

Well done 2011, I admire some one who not only has the imagination to dream something up but has the ability to DIY it. You proved that it was not only theoreticially possible but practically possible. Girl Geraldine nearly made me throw up what I never ate or drank ! It's miserable, uneducated people like her that gives engineers & related folk a bad name. To say that she hasn't clue is an understatement.

21-06-2022 10:22am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119229822#Comment_119229822

Architrave done and wall repaired and repainted I think it is a much cleaner look.

12 mm plywood painted black installed under the front legs to finish.

banie01 · 21-06-2022 10:24am

Really enjoyed watching your progress on this. Good job, well executed.

21-06-2022 10:28am

A far larger fridge which was the primary goal:

The fridge doors have a built in mechanical stop that prevents them opening any further than this and hitting the walls. Careful positioning ensure that cupboard doors and oven door all swing clear of fridge doors.

Mission status: Management back on board!!

The Mulk · 21-06-2022 10:33am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119224081#Comment_119224081

Agree 100% with this.

Amazing job, well done

hello2020 · 22-06-2022 6:15pm

OMG ..just amazing ! you did a better finish than most of the builder in the business will do in the same time !

astrofool · 22-06-2022 6:18pm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119218627#Comment_119218627

I had to move a wall (well rebuild) 15cm to fit in a new hot water tank, was well worth it (helped that we did work on the other room at the same time).