VRT on a classic car

b4bmm

If I'm correct the VRT to import a classic car is 200 Euro.

My question is, If the car was imported well before 30, over 10 years ago but it never got put on the road due to the owner moving abroad but now with the possibility of returning to Ireland will the owner only be charged 200 euro VRT?

Or will there be a full VRT charge as from the date the car was brought into the country. Certificate of export.

Registering vehicles imported from GB before 1 January 2021

These vehicles can be registered as normal. You must provide documentary proof that the vehicle was imported before 1 January 2021. An example of proof would be a sales invoice or a ferry ticket which identifies the specific vehicle.

kdevitt

It'll still be 200 more than likely, the maximum penalty for late registration is also 200 - but no one ever seems to be charged, and half the staff at the VRT centre seem to think there is no penalty at all. (thats all assuming it was never presented for VRT prior to it being 30 y/o)

Edit - you will probably need to supply some form of evidence that it arrived in Ireland prior to Brexit btw

b4bmm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119174374#Comment_119174374

More than likely? :)

Was never presented before.

I have a certificate of export showing the date it was exported from UK.

Can car be cleared remotely in this way or does it need to be roadworthy and driven into a VRT office to be witnessed and presented with the proof of export date? Im unclear of the actual process, I find their website poor.

kdevitt

Your VRT charge will be €200 - you can be potentially charged €200 in late payment penalties, but its unlikely. So best case scenario is €200, worst case is €400.

You need to drive the car to the VRT office, or at least have it transported and be able to start it up.

b4bmm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119174521#Comment_119174521

So it won't be a case of them going, hey you brought this car to Ireland 10 years ago so you need to pay the VRT as if you importer the car on that date? Is there a VAT charge?

kdevitt

No, because you never presented it for VRT - so the VRT is calculated at this point in time.

No VAT or duty once you can prove it arrived prior to Brexit, they generally like a ferry ticket or proof of transport into Ireland. If you phone them and explain they'll be tell you whether or not the cert of permanent export suffices for this - they've always been helpful anytime I've phoned them.

b4bmm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119174563#Comment_119174563

Great, thank you.

w124man

May I suggest that you contact the VRT office and ask them. They are the people who know the answers.

I brought a car in yesterday and they were very keen to see the transport documents and the date of entry to the state.

b4bmm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119176305#Comment_119176305

Yes thats the plan. I tried to yesterday but couldn’t get through. I’m sure some places are less stringent than others but maybe you have to bring it to your local office only?

b4bmm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119176305#Comment_119176305

I rang my local office but the voice recording told me to get in touch with a Dublin number. Rang the Dublin number and the lady couldn't say one way or the other how the case would be looked at. Whether it would be a 200 euro charge for vintage or whether it would be a charge brought in based on the date of import. She told me to get in touch with my local office and I told her there was a voice recording that directed me to you.

Also think the figure of 200 euro flat fee is likely not to be accurate. This is vintage car fee. If the car was not vintage when imported it would likely be charged at non vintage rates. Its hard to say but im guessing that's the way it would be?

https://www.vrt.ie/faq/late-vrt-penalties/

Vehicles in the State more than 60 days but not more than 6 months

The following penalties apply:

• Category A vehicles: 10% of OMSP, subject to a minimum of € 200
• Category B vehicles: 5% of OMSP, subject to a minimum of € 100
• Category C vehicles: € 100 per vehicle
• Motorcycles: 40% of the VRT due.

Vehicles in the State more than 6 months

The following penalties apply:

• Category A, Category B and Motorcycles: Increase the previous penalty at the rate of 5% of the penalty per month or part of a month of the period that has elapsed since registration was due
• Category C vehicles: € 200 per vehicle

At that rate Id be paying multiples of what the car is worth in late fees? It would be 10% OSMP fee for first two months, then 5% per month on top of that for the best part of 15 years………910% OSMP late fee 😂 😂

What she did say is that I could write to Wexford, why Wexford I dont know, must be head office and say that the car was never on the road, I left the country before putting it on the road and to plead for forgiveness basically.

Why is there so many folk on here that seem to be getting away without all these charges?

kdevitt

You're presenting the car for the first time, so it is vintage.

b4bmm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119183476#Comment_119183476

You make it sound very easy. It was anything but easy talking to the lady on the phone. Do you have experience with a similar situation to the one I am in?

The last thing I want to do is present the car only to pay a huge late fee or have them take the car. Id be better off doing something along the lines of exporting it back to the UK and selling it there or reimporting it.

kdevitt

Yes, my latest resto was three years in the bodyshop on yellows and I cleared it last year.

One of the guys on autostadt I think had the exact same scenario as you just a fortnight or so ago - they wanted him to provide evidence that the car was in storage. So rather than clear it on the day, it took 3 weeks or so to turn it around.

Few things to note -

In the very worst case, there is no requirement to pay any charges if you don't want to pay them - you have 30 days I think to remove a car from the state if needs be.

If your car is a non-runner, you cannot VRT the car - it doesn't classify as a mechanically propelled vehicle. So even if it arrived in Ireland twenty years ago, its only eligible to be VRT'd once its actually running.

b4bmm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119184312#Comment_119184312

Did you have to provide receipts showing it was in a bodyshop and could not be cleared for that reason?

Really getting into the weeds here haha. But was it or was it not a non runner when entering the country, do you have proof it was a non runner during that time sir?

Im curious how deep they go with all this, there seems to be no hard and fast rules?

lomb

Penalty is .1% per day of the vrt, so if its 200e , then it 20 cent a day=70 euros a year thats the max anywayAdditional VRT (revenue.ie)

b4bmm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119369099#Comment_119369099

That's on what it would be now, the fine would be on the rate at the time, I would think. So multiple your estimates by approx 20-30 and multiply that by maybe 18 years.

Im still none the wiser as how to do this. Ive asked a few people and nobody has the same answer. Seems to very location dependent.

w124man

Interesting last seven words there. So if you have had a car in the State for ten years its going to be expensive! Contrary to forum and bar stool talk Revenue calculate the value of the car when it entered the State. So if your VRT was going to be €2000 ten years ago the calculation is quite simple!

VRT x 0.1% x Days x Years =

2000 x 0.1% x 365 x 10 = 7300 + the original VRT of 2000

kdevitt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119408713#Comment_119408713

Yes. But additional VRT is calculated separately to the actual VRT - which is done on the date of presentation, and for a vintage car, additional VRT is capped at €200.

w124man

If a vintage car was brought in at the age of 20 and presented ten years later, the fine is based on the VRT at the time the car entered the state, not the time it was presented.

kdevitt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119412280#Comment_119412280

It’s not. I’ve done it.

JabbaTheHut

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119412381#Comment_119412381

That's interesting. I've always assumed it was like w124man said, that it is calculated from the date it eneterd the country, meaning the penalties are much more. I mean, it's even stated there. Any UK reg(for example) I've seen advertised for sale that have been here a while, I shy away from because of my belief that it could be so much more than a simple €200 VRT.

w124man

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119412381#Comment_119412381

So have I. It is!

kdevitt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119415297#Comment_119415297

It’s not. You’re just talking complete and utter rubbish and you know it. There’s not even any mechanism for calculating an OMSP from a decade ago. Jesus wept.

kdevitt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119413920#Comment_119413920

The penalties are calculated from date of entry to the state. The VRT isn’t. And the maximum penalty on a vintage car is €200 - and even then you’ll be hard pressed to find anyone who has ever had to pay it, because half the revenue staff seem to think there’s no penalties due at all for vintage registrations. Half the nice E30s in the country were stashed away in sheds for years waiting to hit vintage status, I know loads of lads who’ve cleared them for the €200 fee with no penalty. My CRX was here 4 years or so before VRTing it and it was €200.

I’ve also cleared a newer car, which was bought in December but VRTd in January The rate was exactly in line with the car being one year older - not what was quoted in December when I bought it.

Edit - I’d shy away from a UK reg here too, but mainly because of the potential VAT and duty hassle.

w124man

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119416096#Comment_119416096

No mechanism? Did you ever hear of the internet? Christ on a bike

b4bmm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119416096#Comment_119416096

This is my problem. Which seemingly worked out good for you but bad for the other poster. It depends who you get on the day, It depends where you're doing it as to what that place deem is the correct rules? I rang the VRT and even they couldn't give me an answer but said that I might be expected to pay a large late fee for not clearing it within one month from importation or whatever the timeframe was she mentioned.

I had to re-read this thread again. I will ring the VRT office again next week and I'll go in person and ask them also. Your opinion is (based on going through it yourself) there is no VAT payable if the car was imported prior to Brexit. I have a certificate of permanent export when I brought it in prior to Brexit so need to find out if this will suffice, along with a receipt from the seller on letterhead paper from the garage on the same date.

If the car is older than 30 years when presented it will be classified as a vintage car, its not the date of importation but the date of inspection that matters so VRT will be E200. If late fees are applicable because it was not presented when imported the most it will be due is E200 because that's the cap for a vintage vehicle. Have I got all that right?

What paperwork is asked by the inspector on the day you present the car for VRT?

lomb

Trust me, its 20 cent/day max on classic+200e and even that doesnt apply as there is no proof the car was mechanically propelled and suitable to be vrted.

Ive looked at tax appeals cases and anyone can as they are online and the vrt is always even on newer cars charged on the date it was assesed not the day it was in the State and the penalties are based off the new lower vrt at .1% per day.

The citizens advice whilst normally good and accurate are talking absolute shite.

b4bmm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119439662#Comment_119439662

So your agreeing that Mr Devitts' comments are accurate?

lomb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119439935#Comment_119439935

I am, and the tax appeals commision does too. You can look at vrt cases ( on modern cars not vintage-no one is going to appeal a 200e penalty even if one applied) Its .1% per day penalty of the new lower vrt on top of the new lower vrt. Thats 100% unless they have changed the system.

kdevitt

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119438793#Comment_119438793

Correct on the VAT -

Registering vehicles imported from GB before 1 January 2021

These vehicles can be registered as normal. You must provide documentary proof that the vehicle was imported before 1 January 2021. An example of proof would be a sales invoice or a ferry ticket which identifies the specific vehicle.

b4bmm

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119439662#Comment_119439662

Any links to some appeals cases?

It looks like the VRT needs to be paid in full before you can make any appeal. I guess you will get a refund then when an appeal is successful. https://www.revenue.ie/en/importing-vehicles-duty-free-allowances/guide-to-vrt/appeals/the-process-and-making-an-appeal.aspx