Time for a second airport in Dublin?

jmb2022

Seems long over due - perhaps time for a second airport in Dublin. Also some healthy competition in how airports are managed.... discuss!!

1992ChainGang

Where would you build it?

Atlantic Dawn

Airport ran fine in 2019 with more passengers using it than now, issue is with not enough staff, particularly security screening staff, nothing more.

Yup, can't run one airport, better get another one.

Xander10

time to start using the other airports in the country at a par price.

endofrainbow

There were murmurs of this over 20 years ago and it was to use Baldonnel.

mikemac2

Send the flights to Cork, Shannon, Knock. I heard this week Dublin has 86% of the flights in the country

Well that is for the airlines to decide I suppose but DAA control both Dublin and Cork so there is one example where negotiation can take place. The DAA could offer a deal on fees if some flights went to Cork.

ted1

If people wanted to fly from cork there’d be flights. But the majority of the population is within 90 minutes of Dublin airport.

why send flights there instead? If they are wanted send them there aswell.

we had compulsory stop overs in Shannon . Once they dropped the compulsory part they realised they were not wanted

Bulldoze the Phoenix Park and make it a big massive airport. Plus, it'll wind up all sorts of people. Win-win.

AMKC

There was supposed to be a new airport in the Midlands. What ever happened to that? It would make more sense than having two airports in Dublin.

Strumms

Run the one we have properly and there won’t be a need for a second airport.

it wouldn’t be commercially viable… only place it could be built would be truly on the outskirts of the city. South or southwest.

to purchase a land space big enough for terminals, runways etc…

even a moderately sized airport compared to Dublin you’d need about 2000 acres of land… terminals, remote parking for aircraft, hangers, offices, runways and associated navigation aids like approach lights, ILS, fire station, ATC tower… police, Garda, immigration,

an acre of land is around 12,000 euros. You’d need about 2000- 2500 acres of land.

so about 30 million to pay for land before you build a thing.

how do people get there ?

healthy competition ? Not really… airports are extremely expensive to run, staff and maintain… and having to build one from scratch ? You’d be by my estimation a couple of hundred million euros in the hole before you see a plane land or takeoff… take a long time before a profit would be made.

Viscount Aggro

Needs to be southside, where all the money is. I suggest Newcastle, Wicklow.. already has a runway

Dempo1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058248435/time-for-a-second-airport-in-dublin

Heavens above they can't even manage one 😁

phonypony

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119150516#Comment_119150516

The problem there is that you're potentially taking away feeder routes - those that feed from regional airports into international destinations

phonypony

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119150705#Comment_119150705

I think there used to be an area in T1 dedicated to routing pax to these flights, prior to the construction of new piers (if I recall correctly). It makes so much sense.

appledrop

Maybe if they pay their security staff more than 14.14 an hour including shift work for a 2am start, then they might be able to run the one they have properly!

Oh and also you have to be available for 40 hours a week but only guaranteed 20 hours.

The DAA management meanwhile is raking it in.

titan18

Just need to use Cork and Shannon more. Cork in particular is underused considering the industry and companies within the area and the population amount within 90 minutes of Cork.

Del2005

The problems at Dublin, and all the other airports and airlines having the same issues around the world, is staffing not capacity. They fired all their staff at the start of COVID and now with loads of jobs and not enough people prospective employees are deciding that crap contracts aren't for them. The airports and airlines need to start paying their staff or it won't get any better, it'll more likely get worse as more staff leave.

Fatnacho

Let Ryanair build a privatised T3. Will alleviate congestion, increase competition and not cost the taxpayer a penny.

Terrontress

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119150979#Comment_119150979

Michael O’Leary repeatedly offered to do this but was turned down each time.

guyfo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119150979#Comment_119150979

Yes, but let them build it at Baldonnell instead.

MAULBROOK

Hows this for mental.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/proposals-for-airport-near-arklow-welcomed-1.682593

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119146598#Comment_119146598

Not fully true but im sure you are happy that you get to add another post to your tally even if it’s the usual misinformation from you.

The airport failed a security test which is causing a huge amount of delays as a large % of bags need random searching / swabbing which is a manual effort. This was not the case in 2019

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119150979#Comment_119150979

where In Dublin airport would you build T3… ? there is nowhere to build it…look on google maps… no space… last bit of space the new runway is being built on…

touts

You can be in Belfast, Shannon and Cork faster than most airports that Ryanair fly into as the airport for a major city. Try getting a taxi from Frankfurt Haan to Frankfurt. And it can take 3+ hours to get between Gatwick, Stansted and Heathrow.

Dublin doesn't need another Airport. Dublin people need to start to move outside the M50 for more things.

phonypony

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119151087#Comment_119151087

Wasn't the area between the parallel runways on the Western side of the airfield mooted for this eventuality?

Goldengirl

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119151087#Comment_119151087

Should not be building that runway when they can't manage what they have .

Baldonnel has land , access via a motorway and is underused .

Also many people around the country would prefer to fly through Cork or Shannon but the airlines are not giving them that option enough .

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119151186#Comment_119151186

How is Baldonnel under used ? It’s a military airbase, what knowledge or expertise qualifies you to determine that it’s underused ?

airlines as businesses in a free and democratic economy can fly to whatever destination and routes suit… they are private businesses… PSO routes are instigated in several instances where a standalone operation may not be financially viable.. DUB - CFN ( Donegal ) is one.

ted1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119151186#Comment_119151186

The option isn’t there because the business case isn’t. There isn’t the population to support it.

Fr Tod Umptious

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119151032#Comment_119151032

I'll see your Arklow and raise you Dundalk

https://www.rte.ie/archives/2022/0504/1295989-plans-for-dundalk-airport/

Suvarnabhumi

Do what they did in Japan and Hong Kong. Build an artificial island and use that. Sure Dalkey Island would be grand and it's right beside the DART too. We'd finally have a rail link.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119150618#Comment_119150618

Jaysus, where would the demand for that come from? There isn't any population centre in the midlands.

Having two airports in Dublin would be mad. Imagine getting a flight from, say, Manchester or Kerry then having to cross the city to get onto a flight to the US? How does that benefit anyone?

Belfast has two crap airports instead of one decent one. This means less choice, higher fares, and a lot of passengers from NI flying out of Dublin.

Baldonnel is not suitable for use as an airport. The site is too small, the runways too narrow and short to be any use. The Wicklow mountains get in the way of possible flight paths, it's too close to heavily populated areas (noise) and its flight paths conflict with those of Dublin Airport. It only continues to exist because it's so little used the noise and flight paths aren't a real issue.

Ireland has too many airports. None of Cork, Shannon, Knock are really viable. Sligo, Kerry, Donegal are a joke only kept going by the taxpayer. Waterford lost all of its routes and airlines aren't interested in going back, the motorway to Dublin has killed it. Galway airport is gone for good. If they built a motorway between Limerick and Cork - which is needed anyway - then Cork could be closed (that'll go down well 😉)

AMKC

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119157991#Comment_119157991

Jaysus, where would the demand for that come from? There isn't any population centre in the midlands.

From all around.

guyfo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119158823#Comment_119158823

Right, where would the infrastructure come from to get people from "all around" to an airport in the Midlands when "all roads lead to Dublin"?

Given the points about Baldonnell then the best option would be to increase the capacity of Dublin, or just have the government take over T2 and subsidise it so more flights actually go through that White elephant.

CPTM

I'd much rather they spend the money it would cost on proper infrastructure to help us get efficiently to the existing one.

FionnK86

typo!

bad2thebone

Shannon Airport is the best place in the country for flying in and out. It was the gateway to the west of Ireland and the Shannon region. During the 70's 80's until the mid 90's it was buzzing with culture. Sadly no more they stopped all that so people would have to bus their way back west from Dublin to visit the west of Ireland or rent car's in Dublin and drive across the country.

Now there's more hares in the grass lands and swamps than people flying in and out.

Ah yes says nut brown hair to his leveret, in your great great+ grandfather's time it was different and there was one called the Concorde supposedly it was like a huge swan landing in. Their only aul stories, legends they are.

As they nibble away at the weeds.. and tumble weed rolls across the tarmac. ...

Hotblack Desiato

Sure it was a Space Shuttle emergency landing site once upon a time. Foynes was a big deal once upon a time, too. Things change and technology changes and time moves on. The Shannon stopover was a disastrous policy which damaged the economy of the entire country.

sprucemoose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119150584#Comment_119150584

sorry but thats simply not true, most people want to fly from the airport that is closest to them but ridiculous mismanagement and exorbitant fees mean its easier for the average person who is going on holiday to fly from dublin and absorb the time cost for some financial savings.

we cant keep centralising our sevices solely in dublin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119157991#Comment_119157991

at the very least, cork and possibly shannon are most definitely viable they just have been/are being mismanaged completely by the DAA.

and ya close cork airport when the motorway is completed, keep the airport in (near) the city with a population around a third of the other, one that happens to be the second city in the republic, makes sense.......

Hotblack Desiato

DAA has nothing to do with Shannon. The reason Cork is still run by the DAA is that they (Cork) want Dublin passengers to pay for the fancy underused terminal they got in Cork a few years back 😉

The era of thinking government policy can force airlines and passengers to fly specific airports and routes is long gone and not coming back.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119202382#Comment_119202382

Has to be the most corrupt wánkbag decision made in the history of the state… would have cost airlines millions over decades…and in turn the Irish taxpayers….over the years the extra wheel changes, brake units to be replaced, and other assorted maintenance as a result of an extra un required landing and takeoff per leg, extra fuel costs…. Nutsville… all for a few votes down that way… Aer Lingus, Delta, American Airlines, American Transair and a few more besides held up by Dick Turpinesque politicians… that the rest of the taxpayers pay for the privilege … “you’ll land here, 15-20 people might get on, you’ll pay for another xx tonnes of fuel and off ya go, thank you !”

at least the likelihood is a second airport in Dublin will be needed in the next x years.

ted1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119202543#Comment_119202543

We centralise our services where the population is and where they are needed.

sprucemoose

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119203064#Comment_119203064

we go overboard compared to other countries though

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119202905#Comment_119202905

i know theyre gone from shannon for the last 10 years but the damage was done by then apparently. ive less experience of shannon though so i cant speak too much to that.

cork airport is underused because the DAA set the landing fees ridiculously high to encourage more traffic to dublin. if ryanir had been allowed to take over the old terminal the airport would be booming but that would draw business away from dublin and we couldnt be having that could we

Ash.J.Williams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119150618#Comment_119150618

they discovered it would be served by rail and road, and decided that's a silly idea

tinytobe

I think they should rather expand Dublin and other existing Irish airports than considering a completely new airport in Dublin.

There are 3 runways in Dublin, and massive space to expand, if need be, for another big terminal, in the western part of the airport.

Besides Baldonnel there is a small airfield called Weston Airport, near Leixlip.

I think Dublin airport was once an RAF military airport before 1921 or so?

WishUWereHere

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119165344#Comment_119165344

Since when is T2 a white elephant?

Subzero3

Instead of an airport you will Just get more tolls

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119152316#Comment_119152316

When I was about 12 I used to be planning an airport on Bull Island. Just a few minor issues like ornithology, people of Sutton objecting to low approaches, the latter conflicting with air traffic approaching westerly south runway, also low approach over dock lands, but sure use a BAE146 and she’ll dodge the ESB towers in good weather. The golfers won’t object too much, Joe Duffy on Clontarf seafront wouldn’t bat an eyelid, nor would the people enjoying the wired off recreation of Dollymount beach. Otherwise it would be a great landing space for a STOL airport close to city centre, could be known as “Joe Duffy Dublin City Airport”

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119203349#Comment_119203349

The plan went something like this. I think the ESB chimeleys could get knocked to clear a safe approach.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119203158#Comment_119203158

An airport at Weston is an even crazier idea than Baldonnel.

Hotblack Desiato

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119203121#Comment_119203121

DAA wanted to increase Dublin landing fees but CAR forced a reduction on them instead.