Sex Pistols

The Golden Miller

I know this isn't the music forum, but I think this band generates alot of intrigue. A TV series coming out, and in fitting fashion, controversial with Johnny Rotten trying to block it. It should make for a fascinating watch, this band was unlike any other, in terms of insanity, a pure car crash from start to finish, which blew up completely.

We see many American rock bands over the years, try and portray how mad they were, hard partiers, but these guys were actually the real deal, never has so much carnage followed a band. Banned in UK, banned on the airwaves, hated by the establishment, left for America in disgrace, where their tour generally included unfinished gigs, Sid Vicious attacking the crowd, the crowd attacking them, the tour blowing up, Sid subsequently going completely off the rails as everyone knows.

Ironically their album, over time, was very progressive in its topics, and the more time that passes, continues to be relevant. This band was a joy to watch from the outside looking in, they turned a country in protest of the establishment, and went out with a bang

Fallout2022

In terms of progressive topics one of their big songs was anti royalty/monarchy. One song had an anti abortion tilt to it, would be seen by many as regressive. Beyond that they weren't political as bands like The Clash.

Sid's epithet had been given to him almost sarcastically because he was a gentle soul.

Then he started trying to live up to it. Nancy and his mother were two unhealthy individuals in his life.

The Golden Miller

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119042820#Comment_119042820

Bodies was ironic, like God Save The Queen. Ahead of its time. Give it a listen

Anesthetize

They've got nothing on Butthole Surfers.

Sleeper12

Can't sing, can't dance. You'll go a long way.

One of the most overrated bands ever. Jasus John Lydon ended up doing TV ads butter. Talk about selling out

buried

Public Image Ltd were a far better band

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cifo77azntk

Never Mind The Bollocks had a huge effect on UK music, even though The Damned released the first punk single, and the Buzzcocks were more musically adept.

PIL and the Butthole Surfers aren't really relevant as they came so much later.

Yes, Sid was a car crash, and less than relevant musically. Yes, Malcolm was an abhorrent person.

Nevertheless, the pistols were a seismic force in both music and culture at the time and paved the way for an explosion of new bands and a youth culture that refused to kowtow to conservative norms.

Sleeper12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119043140#Comment_119043140

You mean the dammed released the first UK punk single right? Punk was going for a few years in the US before the UK

dxhound2005

Rock'n'Roll. Teddy Boys. Mods and Rockers. The Beatles. Flower Power. Glam Rock. Prog Rock. Bay City Rollers. Punk. Disco. New Romantics. Girl Bands. Boy Bands. Maybe not in that order, but whatever teenagers are into in their own generation. They all turn into their fathers and mothers in the end. Including the Hippies, Punks and Goths.

Their teen idols who did not die before they got old, continue as entertainers decades later, same as Sinatra and Crosby before them.

The Bay City Rollers. Only the band the Sex Pistols could have been.

The Golden Miller

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119043686#Comment_119043686

Fads come and go, but nothing has come close to the mayhem that ensued in the wake of the Pistols. A whirlwind of carnage, never seen before or since

Ray Palmer

Punk was happening and Malcolm McClaren made it seem like they invented it. The Rollings Stones had more influence on the American punk scene than the Pistols. The Clash were art students going with the current style.

Punk originally meant DIY and then became quite ridged by within a few years. American punck was much more fun but UK European punk was violent.

EmmetSpiceland

They should never have forced Glen Matlock out of the band.

LeBash

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119043140#Comment_119043140

https://youtu.be/fnmrAthgi8g

Jeffrey Lewis disagrees

Sardonicat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119042891#Comment_119042891

Woof woof

Strumms

one single studio album and about 10 compilation albums of live gigs, bsides, soundtracks etc…

I bought never mind the bollocks in 1996… the same summer I was buying old records by some of their contemporaries like..

The Clash, Buzzcocks and Magazine…who were all vastly superior bands…in terms of songwriters, songs and musicians and with the likes of Joe Strummer, icons…

Pistols …a handful of good songs on a decent record, a real good guitarist in Steve Jones, Glen could play Rotten had presence and attitude but nothing else…

their currency was controversy because their body of work didn’t stand up and subsequently they didn’t stand the test of time..

The Golden Miller

People are arguing if they were the first punk band, who cares? They transcend that, and entered popular culture on a far bigger scale. They were the rallying voice against the established order which took hold, they were the calling card, reference point, for a disencanted youth, they were the force who created an explosion of bands who followed. They defined a moment in time, in history. They rose and they crashed and burned in spectacular fashion. But they made a mark, which many would argue, changed attitudes in the British psyche forever

trashcan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119043976#Comment_119043976

I would agree. Their importance is much more cultural than musical. As you say, the Clash and Buzzcocks were much better bands, but arguably may not have existed without the Pistols. GSTQ is fun, but ultimately not much of a song. Pretty vacant is ok, but other than that I don’t think they had much to offer. They did give others the impetus to get bands together though.

oh, and John Lyndon seems to have eaten substantial quantities of that butter he was promoting based on his size the last time I saw him.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119044030#Comment_119044030

It’s true, I think I remember Strummer saying that he broke up the 101ers on seeing the Pistols and that was the catalyst to him forming the Clash.

Ray Palmer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119044012#Comment_119044012

Like saying the Beatles were the same as The Monkees who care?

Like Nirvana over rated and history inflated their importance. As you get older you notice the journalists write history as they record it. The new media might change it but that is easily mislead too.

I met many "punks" back in the day and the people who acted like Lydon's image were just a holes. It isn't fun our in anyway meaningful. Lydon has been helping trouble children for years but is still an a hole publicly.

It is the music business and that should never be ignored

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119043211#Comment_119043211

Of course. That's why I specified the UK in my first sentence. US punk was a very different animal.

maestroamado

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058245280/sex-pistols

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4OzI9GYag0

Yes the established hated him... maybe this is why...

When is the prog on i like to see it...

Sugarlumps

Lydon is slowly morphing into a slug. I recall him being on a panel with Marky Ramone, Duff and Rollins. Embarrassing stuff, the rest of the panel were left mortified. Someone should have clocked him.

Rothko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119043976#Comment_119043976

I think Lydon is/was a great lyricist and frontman.

brianc27

they are a poor mans Throbbing Gristle

Trigger Happy

The Sex pistols need to be only looked at over the period from 76 to 78. Anything they did after that as a group or individuals dilutes what they were during that short productive period. They were lucky to be the right people at the exact right time producing a sound that people wanted to hear and surrounded by people clued in enough to make it happen. Their influence on so many bands is massive.

That said – I do find Never Mind the Bollocks a bit hard to listen to these days. It has not aged well to my over aged ears. 

Strumms

I’m not all that familiar with PiL but his work with the pistols was limited as in terms of creative output.

i love the anger and energy of Anarchy In The UK but if you examine the lyrical value. Hmmm.. Pretty vacant the same…

https://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/sexpistols/prettyvacant.html

He couldn’t touch Strummer or Howard Devoto as a lyricist….

Ash.J.Williams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119042877#Comment_119042877

one of the greatest tunes ever, and very real

Ash.J.Williams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119046100#Comment_119046100

i'm going to see him in the stadium in june , cant wait! very underrated musician

Ash.J.Williams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119043976#Comment_119043976

considering pil have been consistantly good for 40 years i think john has something else

goldenmick

Which reminds me of the two punks having sex, with punk music playing in the background.

The girl says: "Is that Johnny Rotten".

The guy replies: "Nah, I've only used it twice".

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119046372#Comment_119046372

look at the roster of musicians and songwriters that pil had.. an example being Jan Wobble, a bass great.

every song practically on their more successful albums was written by committee… credited to three and four songwriters.

AttractiveAndSingle

Fake band. The boyzone of their genre. So many better punk bands from that period.

seamus

A lot of bands were always about the right place and time. Capturing the zeitgeist at exactly the right time. The ones talked about most are never the first of their genre, because they've been inspired by earlier bands and have developed the sound at just the right time to explode onto the scene.

Usually it's a combination of the sound, the attitude and the charisma, at just the right time.

If Nirvana had popped up in the early 80s they would have been called angry post-punk and derided as being late to the anarchy party.

Lydon has really been shown up as a charlatan over the years. A Nigel Farage type who has no real principles or personal convictions, but instead will say and do whatever he thinks it is will get him the most attention and kudos. Being controversial more important than any message. And with the bonus of being able to write off anything as "a stunt" or "holding a mirror up to society".

Punk and the Sex Pistols chaos was guaranteed attention for him, so he rolled with it.

Ash.J.Williams

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119046487#Comment_119046487

part of being a visionary is hiring the right people, still doesn't change what i said

i'm a bass player and highly respect wobble

Rothko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119046327#Comment_119046327

AFAIK, Glen wrote the lyrics to that.

Strumms

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119046829#Comment_119046829

Yeah you are correct on that,

NewbridgeIR

In the real world, a lot of kids thought Friggin' In The Riggin' was the best Sex Pistols song, as it fitted most closely with the version of punk pushed by the tabloids - lots of swearing, guitars, offensive. The Great Rock 'n' Swindle was my introduction to the band and is preferred to Never Mind The Bollocks. Anyway IMHO, the best punk album by anyone is Give 'Em Enough Rope.

maccored

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119043211#Comment_119043211

'punk' was just a term that was being used - most of the bands at the time classed themselves as some form of hard rock. MC5, Stooges, Ramones etc werent really the same as early damned etc

Hoop66

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119042891#Comment_119042891

I was at this gig. They smashed all their instruments in the first song.

Sleeper12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119121227#Comment_119121227

Yes punk was a term that was used. Punk rock is an American term. It was a term to discribe punk rock. This was several years before the sex pistols and the Dammed. So it was punk music. It changed when it hit the UK. It became more about the style and attitude rather than the music / lack of talent.

The beatles were a rock band. The stones were a rock band but didn't sound like the Beatles. Music evolves. It's not correct to say that the original punk music in the states wasn't punk. British Punk evolved from the original US punk music. As I say though it became a totally different animal in the UK. The Style itself became very important in the UK as did the attitude and the violence.

https://www.britannica.com/art/punk

maccored

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119121326#Comment_119121326

thought Caroline Coon invented the term in August 1976? 'punk' was a derogatory term in use in america, but it wasn't related to music. According to a friend of mine who was in the Damned at the time, the term 'punk' in regards music was literally never heard when they released New Rose

Sleeper12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119121366#Comment_119121366

He lied. The term punk music was used in the states in the early 70s. British punk was all about the style, clothes, attitude and violence. This is what the UK added to US punk rock as things evolved.

Its sort of trying to make out that bands like Nirvana invented Grunge when Neil Young was doing it decades earlier

maccored

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119121402#Comment_119121402

OK - I'll tell a person actively involved in the early punk movement that people were calling it 'punk music' in the UK in 1976, though he - as a person who was there - claims otherwise. I'll tell him some lad on the interweb told me 😉.

Sleeper12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119122366#Comment_119122366

No. I said it was called punk Rock in the US years before punk rock hit the UK. Tell your mate that he can't rewrite history.

You should do a little research yourself. There isn't a single documentary that the UK created punk rock. Every rock journalist in the world will tell you that punk rock started in the US several years before the Damned were a band. The term punk rock or punk music originated in the US. Don't take my word for it but don't take your mates word for it. Google it. Its difficult to miss the history of punk music

"The popular use of the word to describe a type of rock music dates from 1971, when US rock journalist Dave Marsh used it to describe - retrospectively - 1960s garage band ? and the Mysterians. Stylistically similar groups would include the Seeds and the Standells.

Less well-known is the use of the term 'Punk Music' to advertise early shows by the New York minimalist electronics-and-vocals duo Suicide. This was slightly earlier, in late 1970"

This is historical fact and easily checked. I suggest that your friend took too much drugs or headbutted too many people in the 70s because he's taking out his backside 😅

NewbridgeIR

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119122434#Comment_119122434

This.

As Rhino Records said in their excellent No Thanks box set (2003), "Before there was punk (the genre), there was punk (the movement)"

Or if you go back 10 years to 1993 and their brilliant DIY series, the New York is anthologised well here - https://www.discogs.com/release/443547-Various-DIY-Blank-Generation-The-New-York-Scene-1975-78

I'm an avid fan of compilations and the 1990s was the golden era for decent anthologies that properly contextualised the past.

Sleeper12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119123172#Comment_119123172

Funny I would have said the opposite. We had punk rock music in the states. this evolved to UK punk. I would suggest the Punk the movement started in the UK & not the US.

There are a few decent tracks there that I have on my playlist

krusty411

This is a great documentary series for anyone whether they know nothing or everything about the genre.

IMDb: : Punk 

 https://www.imdb.com/title/tt9419282/

Sleeper12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119123262#Comment_119123262

I saw it a while ago. Good documentary 👍

fryup

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119046541#Comment_119046541

Boyzone and the S P are worlds apart

At least the S P sang and wrote their own songs and played instruments, Boyzone on the other hand were just a glorified karaoke band

Bobblehats

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119138024#Comment_119138024

Boyzone and Pistols were quite similar climate dictates what sells, it’d be the times that are world apart. Pistols were very marketable for the time but you need a loveable rogue to reel in the less musically inclined and so Malcolm; the Louis Walsh of the era tapped up Sid as the “fat dancer” of the ensemble in that he was good looking, had personality in abundance and dressed smart.

Bobblehats

..as in this interview in which he demonstrated his finer traits:

https://youtu.be/dCVzciBB8j0