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Should we limit the number of TDs to 160

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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 78,231 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    You do realise that if TDs are sufficiently upset over something that they can change party policy and/or the party leader?



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,774 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    So four TDs for Leitrim, four for Cork, four for Dublin... seriously?

    They were curious, curious, curious oranj / Curious, curious, curious oranj



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,759 ✭✭✭timmyntc


    Local authorities such as town councils being abolished, and county councils having their powers reduced was nothing to do with corruption and everything to do with budget cuts.

    The idea that corruption in LA means we should just forego local democracy altogether and deal with everything at the national level is absurd. Throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Corruption necessitates anti-corruption measures, not the abolishment of an entire democratic function.

    -----------------------------

    Dáil Eireann as it stands get very little done, with even more TDs they will get even less done. Adding more TDs also doesnt add any more representation, its just window dressing.

    If the EU parliament announced they were doubling the number of MEPs tomorrow, would that mean better representation for Ireland, having 2x the MEPs? No. Because every other nation gets 2x MEPs aswell, the numbers required for majority decisions has just increased 2x, so any increase in MEPs has been cancelled out. The exact same thing applies to more TDs in the national level here in Ireland. More TDs per person changes almost nothing, because the increase in number of TDs means each TDs Dail vote is worth less.

    Regional democracy/local authorities is the only way to improve representation as it restricts the local issues to the local population, meaning your vote is worth more as its only you and others in your locality who have a say. We need to get local issues out of the national parliament entirely, and TDs can be fixed at whatever number is cost effective.



  • Registered Users Posts: 33,774 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    Well if we don't want to increase the number of TDs then we will have to have a referendum - fixing it at or close to the current number regardless of future population growth is probably best.

    They were curious, curious, curious oranj / Curious, curious, curious oranj



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,115 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl



    It may not yet be the most pressing topic, but it is going to be needed sooner or later.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 78,231 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    There has been the suggestion that the cube root of the population of a country is the ideal parliament size.

    For Ireland, that would be 172. Based on today's numbers, we could adopt that rule with no major change.

    Post edited by Victor on


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,316 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Dublin is four counties: Dublin City, Dublin South County, Fingall, DL Rathdown.



  • Registered Users Posts: 78,231 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    If we are being pedantic, Dublin City is a city, not a county.



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,316 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    So is Galway City, and Cork, Limerick, Waterford.

    Be as pedantic as you like.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,027 ✭✭✭✭Geuze


    We have already reduced the number of LA from 114 to 31.

    And you want to cut the 31 to 7!!!!


    We have few LA compared to other countries.

    France has 35,000!!!


    DK has 103.

    The NL have 392.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 3,324 ✭✭✭StevenToast


    Number of TDs should be 100.

    "Don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining." - Fletcher



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,316 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    The seven LA are actually to be Regional Assemblies - that is akin to the Scottish Parliament. I would envisage them having significant powers devolved from the Dail that would make them responsible for education, health, police, housing, planning, and the like. The current LA structure would implement the policies laid down by the regional assembly.

    Current LA structure in Ireland can hardly be considered as a serious attempt at democracy when unelected executives wield all the power.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 25,115 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl



    Dublin is 1 county, it is 4 county councils which is arguably counter-productive in a lot of ways. It would still be insanely unrepresentative to have 16 Dublin TDs and 4 Longford TDs.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,027 ✭✭✭✭Geuze


    Ok, so you are suggesting a third tier of Govt.

    With their own parliaments/councils, with elected members?

    You suggest transferring substantial responsibilities from Central Govt to these Regional Govts.

    I don't disagree with you.


    However, I make a few points:

    (1) many people seem to want fewer TDs/politicians / Govts, so I'm not sure there is widespread public support for another tier of Govt?

    (2) If expenditures are assigned to these Regional Councils, then taxing powers must follow

    (3) the Central Govt would be very slow to give up powers



  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,316 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    We have Dublin City Council and then we have Galway City Council. Hardly equal, especially when Galway County Council is included.

    Galway City Council are responsible for parking, but not in the docks. There is local Gov in action.

    With a regional structure, TDs wold have no part in those powers that have been devolved. You can see the MEPs have little part in local Gov, or even the Dail.

    So we would have MEPs, TD and regional assembly members, and local councils.



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