Should I just leave

amiwrongorishe

Iv been married a few years and we have a toddler and a newborn. I hate arguing, and have never once been the instigator of an argument we have but very regularly, probably at least once a week usually more he starts an argument with me and shouts or picks at me until I cry.

I'm obviously at home on maternity leave looking after both children while he works from home upstairs. Yesterday in the afternoon I took the kids out into the garden for a while and hadnt gotten the kitchen tidied by the time he got off work and we had a huge argument about it. Today I tidied the kitchen and the house and the argument was I hadn't brought them out. I am breast feeding and the only one who gets up with the baby and if I nap during the day it gets thrown in my face a lot, I get told I'm lazy, not doing enough around the house etc. It feels like I can do nothing right and I've lost a lot of confidence. I do as much as I can but with a toddler and a baby I'm breastfeeding it's hard.

@[Deleted User]

Lifes too short for that....run like fcuk

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Warned for Breach of Charter

@[Deleted User] you're posting in the Personal Issues Forum. Replies are meant to be civil, and well phrased. Remember you are speaking to someone who is going through something very personal to them. There is a standard of posting expected in the Personal Issues/Relationship Issues Forum. Please phrase your replies appropriately.

Thanks.

...Ghost...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118980408#Comment_118980408

Very thoughtful advice. Not.

OP, talk to partner and suggest counselling. What you describe is very unpleasant. Have a plan for the likely resistance you will get, but give him time to allow what you've said to be absorbed. Pushing hard will only be another fight.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118980470#Comment_118980470

As opposed to telling someone who admits they are tired and lacking confidence to engage in more circular arguements to further erode their self-worth and make leaving in future even harder?

OP theres womans shelters in most counties,who are expert at dealing with your situation,

Womans aid can put yous in touch 1800 341 900

...Ghost...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118980485#Comment_118980485

Right. The woman needs a women's refuge center now because her husband starts an argument once a week. We don't know her frame of mind. 2 young kids. On maternity leave. Potential PND and outside of normal routine. Get it together and don't encourage an unnecessary escalation with such a small bit of info from the op. It begins with a conversation, ideally outside of the home. Counselling and support would be better than the op running away. If the partner refuses to engage, then there is a need to consider her options.

walshb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058243352/should-i-just-leave

Sounds like a horror.

you’re married. Obviously dated, engaged, married and children..

were there red flags here?

and what he like as a father?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118980523#Comment_118980523

Lifes too short to be constantly argueing etc with a partner.....what they do,argue over something else pointless next week, who wants to live like that?

Pull the plug and walk away is quickest and long term,the best solution imo....get their life back and rebuild self confidence,not have anyone in your life sucking happiness outta it

amiwrongorishe

No, I don't remember it being like this until after we had our first child. Things obviously improved enough that I decided to have a second child with him. But I remember a lot during the start not being able to tell if I had pnd or if it was just because of how my home life was. I remember once we were about to go for a walk and a huge argument happened over me not being able to find something and him saying it was in the box of baby bits he refreshed each evening and how I was ungrateful and I remember going for a walk by myself with the baby and crying the entire walk. He then acts like nothing has happened after these arguments, or like I'm overreacting by crying, occasionally I will get an apology

...Ghost...

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118980547#Comment_118980547

A reasonable person might say that ones marriage is worth talking to your partner with the aim of seeking professional help before calling an organisation and speaking to an untrained, biased stranger. The op deserves better for herself than what she describes, but we know very little of the situation and to give flippant advice such as you have is reckless and will not help the op.

OP, do you have someone with a level, unbiased attitude you could talk to? If yes, you might find it easier to start there. Unless there is violence, running off to a shelter should be way down the list. Staying with family (parents) for a few day's might help.

jolivmmx

OP, I am really sorry to hear that you are having such a rough time! Things will get better.

When you are going through a tough time, then it can be very hard to see the woods-from-the-trees.

When my best-friend had a baby, they were very emotionally labile. They felt very worthless and guilty. Everything that was said to them, was viewed through those lenses, and a reinforcement. Innocent comments were misconstrued.

When you are exhausted, and going through a rough-time, it is not the right time to make major life-decisions. How about talking to your GP? In the meantime, sleep 7-9 hours, eat 3 meals per day, exercise 40 mins x5 times per week. Build yourself up. Let yourself mull the decision over: there is no immediacy. Ask your GP whether they would recommend counselling for you.

When you have built yourself up and spoken with your GP, then you could speak with your partner. Maybe couple’s counselling?

When you are in a bad frame of mind, is is easy to transfer the horrible feelings that you are experiencing onto a particular situation, e.g. job, living-situation, marriage, etc. It is easy to become fixated on that one issue. You think that if you eliminate it, things will magically feel better. They won’t. It is a product of how you feel, and not the things around you.

Nobody on Boards knows you, knows your partner, knows your conjugal set-up. Nobody can tell you what is right for you. Talk to somebody trusted. Step back, take a deep breath and don’t rush any decisions

Best of luck!!

screamer

You’ve built a little family together, you need to tell him how you feel. If you’re not able to talk, write a letter for him to read. It really sounds like he is under pressure in work and feels like you’re not pulling your weight, as he is providing for the family. That tells me he has no clue what it takes to rear children. You’re doing equally as much for the family in a non monetary way, he just doesn’t realise nor appreciate that. A day minding the kids on his own would open his eyes to the reality you live every day. That’s just what I’d do, but I’m not you. And BTW, don’t cry, you’re a great mum, you’re tired, so conserve your energy for you, write that letter tell him how you’re feeling, tell him how he makes you feel, tell him what you need him to do and also remember that he might need something to change on your side, so open that conversation line, and tell him to read it. Finally, I’ll say to you as a mum of 4 with a set of twins, kids are tough work but they grow up so fast. Treasure every little moment, so what if the dishes aren’t done, tomorrow is another day. Mind yourself.

Hannibal_Smith

Does he help around the house at all, or is everything left to you? Has he always worked from home, or is it since the pandemic?

Your routine is your routine. You do what you need to do to keep things ticking over. So if it suits you and the kids to go outside and play rather than doing housework, that's exactly what I'd do.

With a newborn and a toddler, throwing demands at each other when you have two other people demanding all there is from you, is not healthy. You need to support each other. It's an exhausting time and if you're breastfeeding, my goodness you must be shattered. He can make all the 'box of baby bits' he wants, quite frankly I think you're remarkable if you've managed to leave the house with matching shoes!

Have a talk about it with him, tell him you don't want an argument, you just need to have your say. You're not lazy, it's a full on day and night for you and throwing accusations about what you haven't done isnt making things any easier. It's great that he's put things in one place, but given how tired you are it's difficult to remember everything - no one's fault but exhaustion.

topofthewind

Being parents to two young children can make it difficult to find the time and space to communicate effectively. It can be difficult to sort through problems when tired and under pressure.

Parenting children who are under 3 is exhausting and stressful at times.

In my experience, calm communication can achieve a lot provided that both parties are acting in good faith.

Maybe if you could get someone (grandparent?) to mind for a two hour break and ye went for a walk or drive it might give ye a chance to identify the problem areas and come up with solutions.

A good starting point would be to both agree that name calling (lazy), shouting and bad language (if these are problems for ye) are not ok.

You both need support at the moment and arguing is only adding to an already heavy load.

I hope ye can improve things for yourselves.

Furze99

I wonder is he under a bit of pressure workwise and stuck in a home office where he doesn't want to be? Regardless at face value, that doesn't remotely excuse him for having a go at you. Remember at the end of the day, that having and rearing children is the most important job in any family and society in general. And that's what you are doing at the moment.

You mention you are breastfeeding which is great and the best possible thing for your children. There are some good breastfeeding support groups out there run by mothers who've seen it all. Sometimes they run family events, picnics etc. where your partner can come along and chat with other fathers. Get a more rounded view etc.

Having children needs changes though in both parents lifestyles and expectations. Some adjust better than others and this may be a passing phase.

marilynrr

He sounds absolutely awful. He can't even let you nap without calling you lazy 😲 even though you have a newborn AND toddler and are waking with the newborn all the time.

I feel like some of the responses are extremely dismissive.

Yes people can be snappy if they are tired or stressed with work etc. but calling a mother of a toddler and a newborn 'lazy' and criticising her for not doing enough around the house or not taking the kids out is abusive territory, he's coming across as a horrible bully to me, criticising a mother like that when she has a newborn would cut to the core...and isn't the normal or usual snappy or irritableness that comes with having young kids.

The box of baby bits argument could possibly have been normal irritability, but the other stuff is not ok or remotely normal.

Have you tried to discuss this with him at all and tell him that it has to stop and that you will not tolerate it anymore?

NSAman

when he blows up about the kitchen, throw his dinner on the floor.

if he wakes you from a nap, let the kids run in and out of his work space.

if he says you are lazy do nothing for him. Clothes don’t wash themselves. Let him wash his own.

kids take a HUGE amount of time and effort.

he seems to have all the good stuff done for him (I know it’s your side only we are hearing). Shock at loosing all the stuff you do might bring this Neanderthal back to realise it takes more that you bringing up the kids while he works comfortably.

it ain’t easy, instead of criticising he should be helping.

take some time to look after you. Most important!

Why loose confidence? You are a woman looking after two small kids. That in itself is a full time job. Does he help in any aspect with the home?

i know it’s difficult to do, but don’t let him get to you. It’s hard to be in a relationship with someone who treats you poorly (I know from experience sadly), respect and a joint approach is what works. Shock tactics and self respect sometimes work to bring a partner to the realisation that you are a valued member of a family and partner….I don’t mean hitting him over the head with the frying pan when cooking…but standing tall, getting your confidence back and not being subservient should be shock enough.

Big Bag of Chips

when he blows up about the kitchen, throw his dinner on the floor.

if he wakes you from a nap, let the kids run in and out of his work space.

I don't agree with this. It's escalating the situation, and also putting your children in the middle and using them in your fight. I have a feeling this is not the type of advice you're looking for.

Look, OP, small children put a strain on a relationship. No question. You have 2 very small children. The past 2 years have been tough for everyone. People who had an outlet of going out to work are now isolated in their home offices. In general people are under more pressure and stress. Modern life doesn't make it easy.

There is no question that your husband should not be blowing up at you for trivial things. But people act out of character when under stress. I also know if you're not the one doing the bulk of the child-rearing and housework it's difficult to understand just how constant it is. He can log off and walk out of work. Your job is 24/7. There's no logging off!

I was a stay at home parent for a few years. I had 3 under 3. I remember one morning on the school run my youngest, who was 3 at the time saying "Mammy, when I'm older I'm going to get a job, so that I don't have to get children ready for school in the morning". He was 3 - and he recognised that his dad had the "easier" option of getting up, getting himself ready and leaving. Whilst I was dressing 3 children, finding uniforms, socks, underwear, shoes, school bags, making sure all the bits and bobs were in the school bag, making lunches, making breakfasts, checking teeth were brushed, faces and hands washed, doing hair, finding coats, hats, gloves and then trying to get them out the door on time and down to school. A 3 year old saw that and thought that life was tougher than the alternative!

Please try speak to your husband. He has fallen in to a pattern now of giving out about everything. It doesn't automatically mean you are in an abusive relationship and need to walk away. But it does mean that you both need to acknowledge that life has changed, quite dramatically for you both recently and you both need to adjust to that. He shouldn't be shouting over minor things. That's not how to address an issue, and not how he should be speaking to his wife, his partner, his equal. So that needs to change.

Try get a night out, just the 2 of you. It can be very difficult when children are very small. But, this is a phase. And if you can communicate with your husband then you should be able to come out the other side... And then your children will turn into teenagers and they'll be the ones sulking around the house, grunting at you (that's the phase I'm in now!)

Please try get a chance to talk, or as someone else said write it down and let him read it. Carrying on as you are is not an option. So change needs to happen, and he needs to acknowledge that him blowing up over nothing isn't the way forward.

Snugbugrug28

If I did this to my wife it'd be the hangman's noose for me. In fact, I'm often berated for not helping enough with the baby lol

CreadanLady

If you do decide to split from him then you must put the children first. That means giving them consistency and continuity which means you should not take them from the family home which is protected in law. Staying in the familiar environment of the family home is going to be the best for them. That means that it is your husband who should have to leave. You should talk to a family law solicitor to see what your options are for you and your children to remain in the home. Maybe consider his behaviour and if there is anything about it that would give credence to the idea that he should be the one leave the home. Does he exhibit anger or drunkenness in from of you or the children? Has he ever been abusive to you or the children? Or at any time has his behaviour ever caused you or the children to be in fear of him? You could talk to the likes of womens aid or any shelter and they would give you good advice on how to build a case for you and the children to stay in the home and him leave. Ideally he would leave voluntarily and sort out his own living situation, but if he refuses to leave voluntarily then it would ultimately take a barring order from the court to have him compulsorily removed from the home, forcibly, by the Gardai if it the situation calls for it. But the facts and circumstances must all line up right for that to happen. So it is better to have all of these ducks lined up with a good solicitor who is on your side if the situation calls for it.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058243352/should-i-just-leave

at least once a week usually more he starts an argument with me and shouts or picks at me until I cry.

The person who claims to love you, pushes you until you cry?

Yesterday in the afternoon I took the kids out into the garden for a while and hadnt gotten the kitchen tidied by the time he got off work and we had a huge argument about it.

So your husband prioritises a tidy kitchen, over you and the children getting out for some fresh air in garden?

Today I tidied the kitchen and the house and the argument was I hadn't brought them out.

So today he changes the rules that he argued with you about yesterday, making sure to leave you feeling unbalanced and not knowing which way is up? Let me guess, you never know what kind of mood is going to take him, and you're constantly walking on eggshells?

I am breast feeding and the only one who gets up with the baby and if I nap during the day it gets thrown in my face a lot, I get told I'm lazy, not doing enough around the house eThtc.

It feels like I can do nothing right and I've lost a lot of confidence. I do as much as I can but with a toddler and a baby I'm breastfeeding it's hard.

There is no easy way of saying this. Your husband is emotionally abusing you. Forget the "oh maybe he is stressed out too." Because frankly, I don't care how stressed out he is, it doesn't justify him turning it around and using you as his emotional punching bag. Does his employer shout at him and make him cry if he doesn't achieve a task? I'm sure they don't.

The way your husband is treating you is not an acceptable way to treat anyone, let alone the person you claim to love, and who is supposed to be your partner and equal. The person who claims to love you should be the person supporting you, trying to help you, not the one making you miserable. If you're tired and need a nap while looking after two young children, the appropriate reaction is your husband tidy the kitchen when he is finished work. Tell us, does he take responsibility for any of the child related or household chores?

So my advice? Talk to your family and/or GP and some support. If it's an option for you, I would go to your parents or a friend for the weekend / a few days to get some breathing room, while you figure out what you want to say to him. You should not have to live dancing around your husband's expectations of a tidy house or perfect parenting, being called lazy for taking a nap, or shouted at until you cry for any reason.

You need to have a very serious conversation with your husband, and it needs to happen soon before your confidence is worn any thinner. If his immediate reaction is not shock and remorse, or he attempts to turn it around and blame you, you have a much bigger problem. Then you will have to make a decision if this is what you want your life to be, and an example for your children to grow up by.

So, while my advice is not an automatic "leave him immediately" - it is definiately a "start planning your exit strategy" if he does not change his attitude and behaviour towards you, drastically.

Best of luck, OP.

marilynrr

Please try speak to your husband. He has fallen in to a pattern now of giving out about everything. It doesn't automatically mean you are in an abusive relationship and need to walk away. But it does mean that you both need to acknowledge that life has changed, quite dramatically for you both recently and you both need to adjust to that. He shouldn't be shouting over minor things. That's not how to address an issue, and not how he should be speaking to his wife, his partner, his equal. So that needs to change.

Whether people think it's an abusive relationship doesn't change the fact that the actual behaviour itself is emotional abusive (a pattern of being put down and constantly criticised) It is also having an impact on the OP that abusive behaviour naturally has. She's lost a lot of confidence. as would anyone if they are being berated and called lazy and their parenting was criticised.

He's not just giving out about everything, anyone can fall into that habit, he's going on the attack calling her lazy and criticising her. This is more than 'shouting'. What is shouted often has more impact than the actual shouting, and the things he is shouting are putting pressure on the OP to change what she does so that she doesn't get called those things. She feels pressure to do more to live up to his expectations, but then that's not good enough because she didn't bring the babies out that day. If she needs a nap as most new mothers often do she should be able to put her head down but now she'll be nervous to do that because he'll be criticising her.

I agree she should speak to her husband and I also understand that habits can take time to break....so if he is short tempered and prone to snapping he probably won't be able to completely change that straight away, but the attacks of calling her lazy and criticizing what she does or doesn't do especially with the kids has to stop immediately and if he can't commit to stopping that @amiwrongorishe then I'd be looking for a way out. As I said in the last post that kind of thing cuts to the core...especially to a new mother who is breastfeeding, it would be like the equivalent of screaming at a man who is trying his best that he's not a real man and that he's a terrible provider. People don't forget those kind of attacking words even after the argument is long over. They are incredibly damaging and ruin your self esteem.

The DayDream

While 'leave him' is always the advice easiest to give when you're not in the situation, and the hardest to follow when you are, it is usually the only real solution for a relationship that has become toxic.

I'm quite surprised to hear some of the advice given, suggesting that a night out will help this situation, or exercise and sleep will help it, or that he is just under stress.

Once arguments become frequent like this, the relationship is a sinking ship. They dont go back to being non contentious. It always just gets progressively worse. If you have ever been in a relationship like this or seen it in your family you know this.

I would be willing to be even the suggestion of a night out would be met with scorn, and if it actually transpired, arguments would start over minor things during the night. And trying to get your partner to go to counseling rarely works either, a person who arrogantly blames their partner for being lazy while trying to raise children and sees them as ungrateful is generally not going to turn around and say 'Good idea!' because they think they are the ones who are right about everything. And likewise, they won't leave the house either.

My mother had to take me and my sisters and leave when things went like this. Best thing she ever did for us. Men who act like b@stards usually dont change, and if they do, it's usually only after they have been separated from their partner that they see the error of their ways. While you're still in the house together it just continues on the same.

marilynrr

Completely agree @The DayDream and here we have a woman who is actually asking if she should leave, a lot of women in this situation don't ask that, they often say "don't just tell me to leave the bastard because I can't" but she's at the point where it's an option and people are minimising saying ah he's probably just tired and stressed from work.

This is a woman breastfeeding a newborn baby for gods sake! While it wouldn't be ok in lots of circumstances this is one time where it really is horrific, this is a vulnerable time for her, a woman who is sleep deprived, hormones not back to normal after birth (and after a possible previous PND which may have actually just been her home life) physically exhausted AND looking after a toddler and this b@stard is picking fault with whatever she does or doesn't do, nothing is good enough and he picks at her until she cries. A decent man could be snappy on occasion but decent men DO NOT treat their wives like this.

I suggested she talk to him and tell him she won't tolerate it, mainly because I can't see anything changing, and at least she will know then for sure that she should leave and get out sooner rather than later.

cj maxx

OP , HE is not only wrong, but the only one in the wrong. God , if you're feeding and looking after the children the least he could do is help you in whatever way he can help you and give you a rest. Fcuk if you were out playing with the children on good day , I and any decent person would tidy up the kitchen. Are their local creches , groups you could bring the kids to for a few hour. Even if you're there, meet other mothers and children and let them play etc.

airy fairy

Your post is hard reading. You are post natal, breastfeeding, a toddler and your husband wants a tidy house and calls you lazy when you nap. If you heard a friend describing her life as this to you, would you tell her to stick it out? I'm sure you'd tell her to leave.

Have a discussion with your husband, straight forward, no beating around the bush. Ask him is he prepared to accept the status quo of the house, your naps etc or not. It's simple really, yes or no.

No person should argue with someone else until they cry. That is emotional abuse whether you believe it or not. This is grown man and father that currently calls you lazy. Like wtf?

Have the chats. Don't be drawn into a shouting match. If you feel unsafe, make a phonecall to a family member.