Boating licence

TheAnalyst_

Hey, really can't find a straight answer for this online. Say if I wanted to own/rent a sea going motor yacht in Ireland or in the Mediterranean. What sort of training/licences should I get and where?

Is it possible to do some kind of week long residential course in southern Europe?

Cheers.

Max H

To charter a yacht abroad, you need at least RYA Day Skipper or above, or the Irish Sailing Association equivalent. You normally do competent crew first, both Competent crew and Day skipper courses can be booked at RYA ( Royal Yachting Association) approved schools. Day skipper also has shore based theory course.

drunkmonkey

You'd probably need a radio licence as well.

AndyBoBandy

In Ireland, there is no requirement to hold a licence to take a boat to sea, but if the boat has a VHF radio and you intend to use it, you’d need an SRC (Short Range Certificate).

if you intend to operate a boat abroad, you’d need the relevant licence, and in Ireland you can obtain an ICC (International Competency Certificate). This is a mainly EU issued accreditation, though it is widely accepted throughout the world for the purposes of charters etc…

https://www.sailing.ie/Portals/0/documents/2022/Training/2022%20International%20Certificate%20of%20Competency%20-%20Guide.pdf

Van Doozy

Is it possible to do some kind of week long residential course in southern Europe?

If it's the day skipper you won't get that done in a week, there's a theory / navigation element to it as well which also takes about a week and really should be done before the practical. You can do this self-taught with 'Nav at Home' and you should allow a couple of weeks for this part time.

I think some of the sailing holiday companies do a 'zero to hero' two week course as well so that might be of interest. It's more sailing orientated than motor though maybe some schools do a motor version.

I wouldn't fancy chartering a yacht if I had a day skipper course and nothing else done though, unless the conditions were really benign and you had good support from the base - really you would need a bit of experience on the water as well (maybe you already have this??).

C0N0R

Currently doing the day skipper theory through nav at home and booked to do the day skipper practical through a school in Naples in July so should be certified after that hopefully.

traco

Digging this up as looking at doing some charter stuff in the coming years and some advice would be appreciated.

History:

Haven't sailed now in maybe 8 years but did own a share in a 28ft sloop and would have done a fair bit of racing. Always crewed when racing around the bouys but would have helmed on longer races like Howth to Carlingford stuff. Would have a very good mechanical understanding of boats as that was the reason I sold out my share. I seemed to spend more time fixing stuff than actually sailing. Also got fed up with racing as it was always manic and either calm or blowing a gale. I was confident enough on the water in all conditions but in port skills would be rubbish IMO.

Prior to that I fell into sailing in the US when I was 19/20 cos (apparently I can fix stuff) so got to crew some deliveries from Long Island to Conneticut / Rhode Island etc. I then was asked for a big one. Hamptons to BVI's which I jumped on. That was on a Beneteau Oceanis 430. Think I have a copy of my log book somewhere from that. Again I was crew with a professional skipper but did night watches etc. Then spent time racing around there. Thats my kind of sailing, warm waters, shorts and t-shirt. I'm no fan of the Musto Gore tex gear but needs must.

So I am thinking about booking a flotilla course thing next summer for a week to get some sort of paperwork but want to get a jump over the winter. I will contact the guys from my old boat and offer to crew to get back into the swing of things.

So looking at the nav at home site should I go back and start from day skipper or ICC? The Coastal Skipper / Yachtmaster offshore is probably a step too far but I did do the Yachtmaster theory course years ago. Sadly I fear I may have killed all those brain cells with too much red wine and beer!

What say ye!

HeidiHeidi

The ICC is probably the most recognised "paper" for chartering, certainly around Europe.

There are places that will get you through it in a week or so (or maybe even less) but if you're planning on bareboat chartering, I presume you want to have confidence in yourself as well as a bit of paper.

Day Skipper would be well below your level IMO, from what you've said.

Look into doing the YM shore-based nav over the winter - I think it's probably possible to do remotely these days, although not sure, and I'd much prefer to do it in a class setting myself. You should do the offshore - the difference between coastal and offshore is minimal, just some extra tidal stuff, if memory serves.

Then a YM coastal preparation course followed by assessment is the way I did it, you'll need so many miles and night hours (can't remember off the top of my head, but Irish Sailing are very helpful, if you email them or check their website they'll have the exact requirements) so you can look to fill up gaps in your log book before that.

If you can find some other like-minded people to do it with, it reduces the cost a lot - often the prep courses will have others who want to do the assessment, so you can share the cost of chartering the boat to do it.

I did all that about 10 or 15 years ago, so things may have changed in the meantime, but I doubt by very much.

Again, Irish Sailing are the governing body here, and are really helpful if you give them a shout. Their website is a bit of a nightmare to navigate (pardon the pun) but the people in there are great.

traco

Thanks Heidi, I have downloaded the info from sail Ireland and may give them a shout.

You are correct in noting that I'd much prefer to have confidence in myself than a piece of paper. However when it comes a bareboat charter said piece of paper is trump's.

I definitely don't want to waste the long winter nights watching Netflix rubbish, at least not every night of the week. I'll look into the offshore course in more detail based on what you suggest.

C0N0R

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/119037388#Comment_119037388

To update, I’ve done this and have the day skipper licence now. Sounds like your technical skills are far superior to mine and experience too, but as you say I have the piece of paper! The main parts of the course were preparing to sail and preparing to Moore, tacking, bringing a boat in and out of stern moorings, man over board procedure, and turning in a limited space as regards boat handling. I had very limited knowledge realistically but am a quick learner and had no issues getting through the course. I think for the offshore you might need 1000 miles? Some tidal some non tidal and some at night.

My advice is get the cert as you say it’s the piece of paper that counts, not sure if you can go more advanced without it? And at that point you could join a flotilla and give it a go, from what I have been told the flotilla is a good way to gain experience in a semi assisted manor. The best way to improve port skills is practice at the end of the day.

HeidiHeidi

Just to be clear (because I don't think I was) - I meant to go straight to the offshore nav theory - those courses don't differ very much from each other.

The coastal and offshore practicals are miles apart, and there's no way you'd qualify for the offshore on what you've said you've done. But in order to do the coastal practical you need to have the nav theory done, so you might as well do the offshore while you're at it.

An ICC assessment involves less than the YM coastal, but for practical and self-confidence reasons, I'd recommend doing the YM coastal prep course and assessment.

Some people I know have done it in different locations - Majorca, Canaries, Gibraltar to name a few - mostly because it was windier and more challenging conditions (although I did mine in Carlingford with it blowing a stink and mad tides!) so you could combine a holiday with getting your experience and bits of paper.

WildWater

@traco Go for it. As others have said, with your experience you are well above day skipper. I concur with @HeidiHeidi, and think you should go straight for the Coastal Skipper practical. Technically, a Day Skipper cert is not a prerequisite. What you are requrired to have is, 15 Days at sea, 300 miles, at least 8 night hours and 2 days as skipper. Sounds like you are well sorted on those requirements. You also need the Navigation Theory which you are looking into/started. Just go the whole hog on that and get yourself covered up to YM.

As for killing the brain cells, the nav stuff is very enjoyable. I did mine years ago and aside from my day skipper course, I had no need of it for years. Family, career and life in general got in the way of the sailing dream. However, I returned to sailing last year and all the nav stuff came back to me quite handily and I’m pretty sure I’ve killed off at least as many brain cells as you. These days, YouTube is a brilliant resource.

I’m planning on doing coastal early next year myself. Not sure where I will do it yet. I did my day skipper in the Algarve but I might do the coastal here or possibly out of the Solent.

We finally got round to the flotilla this summer (that was the plan all those years ago when I started the nav course). On the sailing front, I wasn’t really sure of what to expect. I thought it might be a fairly regimented, stick together and follow us type thing, but ours was very casual. Each morning the lead crew would let us know the weather, where we had to be by the evening, any hazards and suggested bay/harbour stops. After that, away we went. Basically it was bareboating for the day with the backup of a lead crew on call and the option to tag along with others. Overall, it was a brilliant family holiday.

traco

Thanks all.

At this stage the significant miles are so far in the past they would be irrelevant but I would have logged 1500 mils plus on the big trip and we were two weeks or so sailing. It would have ticked a lot of the boxes. I'm taking the approach that I am a beginner again but things will come back quickly once I start.

Crossed the Gulf Stream in a nasty swell maybe the tail end of a storm / hurricane somewhere. One boat if not two were lost on the Virginia to Tortola race but all crew were safe. Standing in the cockpit on the helm with waves breaking over the bow and swamping it was something to focus the mind. She had a large transom so you needed to be alert with the following seas. Then we spent two or three days drifing in the Bermuda triangle when we were becalmed. We were so bored one day we took out the sextant and started figuring it out which was fascinating. I think it may have been around Thanksgiving as we cooked some turkey.

I'll never forget swimming out there, water so clear it felt like you were floating. We threw out lines with cushions for floatation and when the boat was in the trough an I was in the trough I could only see the top half of the mast. Really kicked home that if you go overboard under sail you're not getting found. I must try and find a copy of the log book to refresh my memory. I'm sure I kept it, I know I have pics so should scan them and save for posterity.

I just had a look on Gooogle and it was still running but not sure about this year. Details if any one is interested:

https://www.worldcruising.com/carib1500/carib1500itinerary.aspx

@HeidiHeidi yes, Carlingford can be a challenge, the way the wind funnels in and swirls make for interesting racing. Getting in and out of the lough can be very intersting as strong tides and narrow. Great fun is wind against tide.

@WildWater Thats great info about the flotilla. I'd be inetersted to hear more about it. Its a long away off at the moment so a lot more research needed. Did you do another post on it here by any chance?

HeidiHeidi

I did a transatlantic (ARC+) a couple of years ago, and we stopped midway for a dip - swimming over 1000 miles from land, in water 4 miles deep ,was quite the experience!! It was only a swim, in buoyant seawater, but it was kinda mind-blowing!!

Flotilla holidays are definitely a great way of building up experience - like a cruise in company - there's help there if you need it, but you get advice/guidance/tips each day, and then get to head off on your own and make your own way and your own decisions. I've never done one, but have been on shore-based holidays years ago where people had done one week on a flotilla and then a week on shore. Always seemed like a great win-win, safe way of doing a sailing holiday.

That Caribbean leg sounds fantastic, the one thing you're usually sure of in the Caribbean is wind, and lots of it!!

traco

Went searching, no log book found yet but did find this. 2003!! Reckon whatever brain cells got me through that have long departed. Found it with my folder of notes, charts and workbooks.

Going to start the nav at home course next week. Will try and allocate 3-4hrs per week over two nights. All going well should complete it by Christmas.

WildWater

Each to their own, but why pay for the same thing twice? You already have the qualification, all you really need to do is brush up on material. I did mine in 07 (I checked) and like you, I had pretty much forgotten everything. I had kept my notes and charts. I read up on some stuff, watched some stuff on YT and did some of the examples etc. I certainly won’t be paying to do it again. In my case, I’ll be putting the time, effort and cash into getting my coastal cert.