The worst employees never leave jobs: is this true?

Nolurking2022

Had a big meet up with some old mates from my hometown last week and we got talking about all the jobs we have had over the years and the best/worst characters in each job. I was surprised to hear that in practically all cases, the useless/lazy/bullying/incompetent and downright bad employees all remain in their job, be it 18yrs in a supermarket, 20yrs in a lab etc, and the general consensus was that these employees never leave their job, unless forced to by redundancy or being fired.

Im not sure is this down to poor management who cant or dont want to root out troublemakers, or that these employees know they wouldnt get work anywhere else so they cling to the job for dear life. When I look back at my own jobs, it holds true. The same people who have the worst name in the office/factory/shop are still there decades later, whereas you often get good workers who move on because life happens: family relocations, more money in another job, bored and want to change career etc. These people I miss when they move on but I understand why.

Have you found this? That the troublemakers never leave their jobs?

Nolurking2022

Proved my own point today, went down to the local shop to get some rolls and the same sourpuss that was there 20yrs ago served me, and she hasnt changed a bit in all that time. Id hate to be that miserable in life!

BingCrosbee

I worked for a semi state and started life ambitious but it was knocked out of me by the useless hoors above me. I therefore started a part time business and threw a saddle on the company and joined the lads above me. Retired now and have no regrets because almost everyone in the company is on the make.

whisky_galore

Semi state and state outfits seem to be a care in the community service for the long-term useless. Finding a comfy niche and vegging there until retirement.

dubrov

I've found the opposite to be honest. Anyone who has moved jobs a lot on their CV would be a red flag for me. They tend tp be bluffers who get found out after a couple of years and move on.

The lifers could be good or bad employees. They tend to be risk averse rather than incompetent/lazy.

Cushtie

I'm about 15 years in current job. Private sector. Fairly senior position albeit in a small organisation. I wonder am I one of those.... The imposter syndrome feeling is high😁😁😁😁

touts

I know of one woman who has been in her place since the factory opened. Not only is she utterly useless she is an absolutely toxic bitch. She is pushing 50 and has a young sidekick in her 20s. The whole place hate the pair of them and refer to them as the Sith behind their back. Master and Apprentice 🤣. Some of the best people have literally walked out the door because of them. Those people knew they could get a better job elsewhere and left rather than put up with them. But the Sith are basically unemployable because of their attitude so won't leave. HR have offered pretty decent redundancy packages and they never take it.

Beatty69

Absolutely totally agree with you OP, while I don't think that all people who are a long time in a job are useless I truly believe that anyone who is absolutely useless/lazy in their job will stay their forever once they've gotten past their probation because it's too difficult for employers to get rid of them. The longer they stay the harder it is to get rid of them.

One example I have is a a guy I worked with 32 years ago, at the time I was a union rep and he got me into terrible strife claiming he was being discriminated against when in fact that truly wasn't the case, he was just absolutely incompetent. He is still in that job 32 years later!!! Admittedly he hasn't moved up the ranks but he's still employed when he's actually a hinderance rather than a help to anyone else.

Another example is a friend of mine in the public sector who openly admits to me that they completely take the piss out of the job, as in taking all of their sick days every year whether sick or not, consider them as extra holidays, doing only the bare minimum to survive etc. etc. and has no shame in that. Will not move a piece of paper from one tray to another if it's not in their job description. I've had arguments with them about how they can collect a good salary for this but they don't give a shite. Think it's a great way to live.

I don't get it, I have to feel I'm working for my living.

gladvimpaker

I observed similar characters brought in to manage a department and have all the buzz words, create silos and they're charming sound professional. They go above and beyond budget's without any thing to show for it, a few months before they know they're about to get fired or their review is coming soon they apply for a similar role somewhere else and rinse and repeat....

sonic85

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118943727#Comment_118943727

Yep - very unfair to tar everyone with the waster tag because they're in a job for a long time. Personally I'm in my current job for the last 17 years or so since I left school. I'd love to leave but it's fear of the unknown holding me back. The place I'm in right now is pretty much all I've ever known.

leahyl

I was in the same job for 14 years up until March and got promoted to a new job within the same company. I’m certainly not a waster, I just wouldn’t he be very confident in terms of putting myself forward for promotions. Sure there are some people that are just plain lazy but not everyone.

Cal4567

I find myself agreeing with a lot of this. I'm sure there are good people in government departments, the HSE and local authorities but they'd be the examples where 20 and sometimes 30 years later, some I know are still there.

Listening to them, do I think they work hard? No. Due to their longevity, they get to middle management positions, sometimes even higher.

Professionally, I came into contact with many. As a consultant called in to provide support and advice, I was initially amused by some of my interactions but then quite angry. They've had a bit of a comfortable working life.

Even as I'm writing this, I'm thinking that I've been too polite about them as well

Gregor Samsa

The Dalai Lama’s been in the job for 82 years. And that’s just in his current physical incarnation. Lazy, incompetent sod.

A lot of what I'm reading on this thread I'd have to agree with , although , I have encountered some genuine hard working employees over the years who have deserved their promotions and years of longevity .

Great thread subject by the way , and reminds me of a saying I was told ( by a wise " auld fella " ) when I was young , and starting out in employment ; " Work your hardest , and try your best . You'll go up the road , like all the rest !! " .

cuttingtimber22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118943944#Comment_118943944

A certain Secretary General is only in his job a few months.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118943905#Comment_118943905

I worked my entire working life, 40 years in local authority. Have the pension, which is the reason I stayed. Some superb hard workers there, but people who got into management were a bit too often bullies, some of them very serious bullies with personality disorders. A small number did some very serious things but nobody in HR would do a thing about it, but rather arranged pointless “mediation” when in fact law enforcement should have been called in at least one case.

ForestFire

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118943746#Comment_118943746

I know these get old.....but

Username and Profile picture check out!!

ancapailldorcha

I don't know. I'm 5 years into my current role. Prospects for advancement are non-existent but it's a very nice job. I don't see the point in stepping sideways and I've no idea what I'd swap my current role for anyway.

Smee_Again

Not everyone who stays long term wit an employer is a bad employee, where I work it seems everyone has worked there for 20+ years, but if management is weak and allows non-performing or toxic employees free reign then the good people will leave and the wasters will stay because they know they've no where else to go.

As the saying goes; People don't leave bad jobs, they leave bad bosses.

Cluedo Monopoly

I would agree with a lot of above and I would tend to move jobs after around the the 4-7 year mark.

It is extremely difficult to fire someone in Ireland without ending up in the WRC so useless people happily survive in many employments.

kippy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118943727#Comment_118943727

Depending on the game you are in, you'll find that in tech (my area) people tend to move around a lot early in their career. This, to me, is generally a good thing. You are learning all the time and after 6-12 months in a role you'll probably find what you are doing becomes repetitive and you'll want to move on to learn more, or increase your salary. That's how I treated my first 5 or 6 years in support anyway. You get used to seeing how different organisations (and people) do things. This is generally a good thing in my opinion. The money angle cannot be underestimated either - you'll generally find your best way of getting significant pay rises is by moving jobs. The last number of years I have been in the Civil and Public service but have technicilly had 4 differnt jobs in those sectors.

As for people spending long stints in the same job - it depends. I have found many exceptional people doing the same job for decades - why? They like it, they are getting renumerated enough to cover their expenses, they may be a bit risk averse.

Perhaps the bad employees people come across, that have been in jobs for years, know they wouldn't get a job anywhere else - or a reference to go with it. It's pretty poor management that they are still there, but in fairness sometimes a manager wants a peaceful life as well and has to pick their battles!

Cal4567

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118944473#Comment_118944473

I was grateful to get some consultancy work but I really believed local authority management brought in external support to hide their own failings. I was initially amazed at the amount of people who only worked in councils, some even the single one, for their entire working career. I believe the practice of bringing in your mate/cousin/brother/daughter has finally been seen to. I hope that nepotism has now gone.

That said, there can be much benefit for having someone in any organisation who has the history of the entity, but sadly I have seen enough examples of people in high level roles that I'd struggle to see in the private sector.

BrianD3

I'd echo some of the comments about public sector jobs. Turnover of staff in the public sector is generally low, I'd say this is particularly true in some bodies like rural local authorities. For various reasons - local jobs for local people and scarcity of other good local jobs, risk averse attitudes, the "almighty" pension. People stay even if they are miserable, have no realistic promotion opportunities or are being bullied by another lifer.

It takes a certain type of mindset, not necessarily negative, to start thinking about your pension in your early twenties.

There is definitely a mindset out there of wanting to get a public sector job in the local area (teacher or the local hospital or county council) and then settle down as soon as possible with someone (ideally another local public servant) by building a one off house on Daddy's land. Then have at least 3 children and live vicariously through them playing GAA.

Risk averse local people can still make great employees though. For those that are poor performers, were they always like that or did they become that way. Are they in the job for decades because they are useless (recruited based on nepotism?) or are they useless because they are in the job decades and have been demotivated by the nonsense they've experienced. Chicken and egg scenario.

To my surprise I've also experienced some very low staff turnover in private sector multinationals. I was employed as a scientist and there were older technicians who had been there for decades and did much the same work as me but had a far more rigid attitude to work. A job, not a career. They were in a union wheras scientists were not. Both were paid much the same afair but whenever there was unpaid overtime t be done (i.e every day), no surprise who ended up doing it.

_Kaiser_

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118943727#Comment_118943727

I don't know.. it probably depends on the industry and level that the person is at, but IT (for example) is a very competitive industry where certain skillsets and roles are very much in demand. Others only have a limited "shelf life" (eg: call centre roles) that most staff only stay a year or two in anyway before moving up/on. Also to get a decent salary bump, the only option is often to move on.

I've changed jobs twice within the last 5 years. The first time was because I was approached with a better offer, but then the management/org structure in that new role changed so much that I was no longer doing the job I accepted/was hired for and so I moved on again. My current company is about to go through a reorg as well, so I guess we'll see how that pans out.

Personally I hate the hassle (and timewasting generally) of interviewing and changing jobs, but I have to feel like I'm actually able to DO and have an impact in the roles I take. If the structure is such that I'm not able to do the job/make changes needed etc, or if I'm not moving up over time and getting compensated appropriately for it, I'll start looking - but I won't accept just any role either. It has to be the right fit, for me and them.

Dodge

So we’re all agreed then. Some people stay in certain jobs or certain organisations when it suits them, and others move job and organisations when it suits them. And people have differing priorities when it comes to employments

super_furry

I'm in a situation where I'm in a semi-state job for the last 15 years. It's a fairly specialised field and my job is realistically the peak of where you can be in this role in Ireland. There's no upward movement ahead of me unless I was to leave the country and with a young family I'm not going to do that so I could, potentially, see myself spending another 15 years here no bother.

I suppose I'm lucky enough that I really do enjoy my job and that spending 30 years in what is basically the same role, wouldn't bother me. The money is decent too, but not amazing.

I had to work alongside a fairly unpleasant fellow for the last 17 years and due to the nature of the job unavoidable interaction where as most staff avoided him. He was allowed apply for a position in a new subsidiary company. He gets a 10 percent payrise and a redundancy payout while the rest of us wouldnät be considered for move. The rest of us look on in disbelief but he's gone now. problem solved.

_Brian

Only true of the ones that realise and understand their own failures. They hunker down once they are comfortable.

There are the ones though that are oblivious to their own shortcomings. When they are properly managed they feel unjustly targeted and leave bringing their “skills” with them, but they find they are targeted in their next job too.

Great topic to be fair !

You can see both sides, some places love the job they are in, my own Father worked in the same company for 42 years, went from general staff to MD in this time but loved the company, the job, the growth etc. I know some people who still work there and have not advanced as much but still love the place etc. There are one or two who are useless and know it, but as long as the whole works they can coast, they will just do the same job over and over.

I have seen places where good staff will leave after 3-5 years as the skill set becomes stagnant and they wish to expand, but others wont move as they know its hard to. I don't agree that a bad manager or weak manager will drive people away, sometimes it the organisation, Policy, micro economy they operate in etc. Also, for anyone who works in a semi-state or similar, you have sick leave, pension, health insurance, unions, lots of policy etc, which means that cutting the dead wood out is HARD ( believe me) and in many cases its not worth the end result.

I also think, in general, a lot of staff should have mandatory annual self awareness training.

boardsie12

I've seen this a couple of times over the years.

Most companies want their staff to stay for a long time because it looks good for them.

It also encourages the younger and newer staff to join the company if such and such is working for 10+ or 20+ years then it gives the impression that the company is good.

I used to have a manager, had spent 20 years at the same place, barely lifted a finger, would often go to the back office and just rest there for the day, unwilling to do anything.

The bosses loved him because he was an older man in a lowly paid position, but everyone looked up to him for guidance because he was much older than everyone else, so we assumed because of his age difference, he knew the ropes better than the younger lads.

Mister Vain

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118943834#Comment_118943834

I was in the same situation until the place I was in eventually closed at the start of the pandemic. I wanted to leave sooner, but like yourself, the fear of the unknown was holding me back. I think the longer you're in a place the harder it is to leave. I was glad the placed closed though as it was becoming a very toxic work environment and I was very unhappy there.

Wanderer78

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058242031/the-worst-employees-never-leave-jobs-is-this-true

you ll actually find in most of these cases, most would have had a dreadful time in our educational system, leaving them with fairly serious emotional and psychological damage from it, their needs were never met by our critical social systems, including our educational system, many suffering from undiagnosed psychological issues such as learning disabilities, behavioral problems, complex disorders etc etc. many of our work environments effectually become an extension of our educational environments, with a continuation of their dysfunctional behaviors, most would actually need psychological care such as therapists etc, in order to deal with their issues, but instead we continue to ostracise them, and attempt to further ridicule them, including on online forums such as boards!