Civil Servants Demanding Private Sector Workers Be Fleeced (Again)

MyLove4Satan

So, even though everyone is being hit hard by rising costs. The obvious answer is to extra tax the private sector so the Civil Servant is immune to the economic hardships. Seems fair.

https://www.rte.ie/news/2022/0402/1290005-pay-agreement-talks/

Jim_Hodge

Put in a pay claim for yourself, so.

StevenToast

Do what i did.....get into the civil service!

SouthWesterly

I object to private sector employees getting pay rises as they have to be paid for and that comes by increased costs of goods and services which I then have to pay for to fund that pay increase.

Private sector workers fleecing us again. Its shocking 😱

SouthWesterly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118871202#Comment_118871202

I'm not paid enough to pay taxes.

redlad12

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118871541#Comment_118871541

Hahah, not yet!

SouthWesterly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118871554#Comment_118871554

I'm on point 6. 😁

wench

I'm not aware of the Civil Service secret handshake to get cheaper groceries or electricity.

You'd think someone would have mentioned it during one of the interminable tea breaks.

Kermit.de.frog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118871849#Comment_118871849

No, I don't discount the services.

I was replying on the financial point the other poster raised regarding tax.

Jim_Hodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118872122#Comment_118872122

And they supply a service which must be paid for. They do pay tax. Private sector also pay tax and we pay for their wages through the purchase of their goods and services. It's petty to insinuate anything else.

Kermit.de.frog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118872258#Comment_118872258

You can try spin it whatever way you like. Simple fact is, by definition, civil servants are not net contributors to the exchequer.

I'm not saying that to annoy people, it's just a statement of fact.

SouthWesterly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118872294#Comment_118872294

Of course we are. We pay paye,prsi and usc.

We also provide the services which you use. The teachers, nurses, Gardai, fire service, planners, road engineers, driving licence, passport.. I could go on.

We're all working and some of us are paying out exchequer money to the wasters, sitting on their backsides who refuse to contribute to that society and are happy with their €208 plus every week. Now they're the ones who aren't a net contributor.

El_Duderino 09

Classic. Set the private and public sector against reach other to oppose each others pay rises. Who wins?

Well, the private sector oppose public sector pay rises. Not sure the public sector ever oppose private sector pay rises. Do they?

quokula

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118871527#Comment_118871527

That’s an extremely disingenuous comparison.

On the one hand we’re talking about a proposed blanket pay increase for public sector employees that would definitely have to be paid for by the tax payer with absolutely no increase in productivity or services in return - a direct transfer of funds from some people’s pockets to other people’s and nothing more.

On the other hand you’re talking about individual pay rises for individual private sector employees - there is obviously no such thing as any kind of blanket rise in the private sector. Individual pay rises are generally performance based and are often a result from increased output or increased experience and productivity.

And more to the point you as a consumer are not forced to pay for these rises. Maybe a company will put up prices to cover increased staff costs, in which case you have the option not to buy their product, unlike taxes. But given that price increases reduce sales, it is just as likely that they will swallow the cost of any given employee’s pay rise by paying another employee less (replacing an experienced retiree with a low paid graduate), or compensate for increased costs per head with an expectation of increased output, increased efficiency, or resort to lay offs and other cost cutting.

It’s not in any way remotely comparable. Current inflation is caused primarily by the cost of raw materials, not some crazy imaginary private sector cartel that’s increasing everybody’s wages for no reason.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058239959/civil-servants-demanding-private-sector-workers-be-fleeced-again

Let's sack all those pesky public sector workers.

We dont need Roads, security or hospitals etc

Give us a break with this populist ****.

elperello

Knock yourselves out.

The Romans knew a thing or two.

Divide and conquer.

Charles Babbage

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118872367#Comment_118872367

This is complete nonsense, although about what you expect. The value of output is increasing in devalued money and plenty of private sector workers will get pay rises on that basis. In the same way the "value" of public service output is increasing, Revenue handle amounts that are larger, education produces workers who receive higher wages etc. Those provide the means to fund the maintenence of the real value pay in the public service.

SouthWesterly

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118872341#Comment_118872341

So we will assume private sector employees won't want to access the services public servants provide and want to be paid for.

Of course those cost or living increases dont effect public servants as much as private sector it seems by the whataboutery of some. Equally we should do away with any concept of the living wage which we hear about so much.

El_Duderino 09

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118872480#Comment_118872480

Or should the public sector create a campaign to oppose private sector pay rises? I mean, if the private sector don't increase pay, then everyone's costs will go down (or rise more slowly), right? Or does it only work the other way around where private sector oppose public sector pay rises?

pcardin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118871163#Comment_118871163

And look what that approach did to Greece. Bankrupted country twice.

griffin100

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118872367#Comment_118872367

One quarter of all spend in this state goes on social welfare payments. Roughly the same as the total public service pay bill. Where’s the productively and pay back from those payments?

AyeGer

Did somebody say Pay Rise?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dg_OIipJuds

Geuze

2021 PS pay rise = 1%

2022 PS pay rise = 1%

Meanwhile, the CPI is at 5.6% and rising.

Real wages in the PS are falling.

I checked the most recent data on weekly earnings, here are the growth rates:

Private sector = 2.7%

PS = 1.1%

https://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/er/elcq/earningsandlabourcostsq32021finalq42021preliminaryestimates/

AndrewJRenko

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118872367#Comment_118872367

No such thing as a blanket pay rise in the private sector eh?

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2022/0329/1289108-permanent-tsb-staff-to-receive-pay-rise-of-up-to-6-5/

https://www.rte.ie/news/2022/0307/1284799-contract-cleaner-pay-rise/

Nice to see that some people are naive enough to believe all that nonsense about shopping around and competition. Are you expecting many eggs from the Easter Bunny?

There is competition in the public sector too. If you don’t like how things work around here, feel free to find a country that keeps their teachers and police and nurses at poverty level wages. Don’t let the door hit your arse on the way out.

GSBellew

To my dear friends in the public sector, love the work you do, really do, it is appreciated.

Pay rises, its always a thorny issue & is always going to be, especially when they are guaranteed only based on service rather than performance, that is a whole other debate though!

In relation to the who contributes what argument, that's simple really, only companies / entities that export actually generate wealth, anything else is only moving the same money from one place / one person to another within the economy.

Of course there are sections within the public sector that support the private sector in the export process, we thank you for that.

The flip side that many don't realise is that for a lot of public sector employees the pay is lower than people in private sector, there are outliers who are on huge money, but that exists in both sectors.

MakersMark

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118872549#Comment_118872549

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118872549#Comment_118872549

There already is such a campaign.

A private worker, irrespective of skills and experience must start at the bottom of the pay scale when entering the Civil Service.

Blatant job ring fencing that encourages corruption and stagnation.

Jim_Hodge

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118872294#Comment_118872294

It's a totally irrelevant statement so. It's as useful to the topic as your failed prediction of bitterly cold weather this week.

AyeGer

There will be a negotiation between the unions and representatives of the government. There it will be decided if Public Servants deserve a pay rise or not and if there are to be any productivity initiatives or changes in work practices. Each side will put their case and each side will be able to look at all the data.

The odd person getting annoyed about that online for whatever reason won’t make any difference. Most people are genuinely working hard in their jobs, the private sector to raise taxes to help run the country and the public servants to provide services to the country.

ParkRunner

Many parts of the civil service are self funding and generate wealth through charging fees for providing a service, same as happens in the private sector. Many private sector firms also get state support - Covid wage subsidy a prime example!

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118871381#Comment_118871381

moronic post tbh.

all regulated remunerated activity in an economy is contribution.

your ringfencing of work and earnings paid for out of exchequer funds in this way as any different makes as little sense as stating that any earnings in an economy are somehow some form of wastage instead of transaction fundamental to the enterprise.

a business owner might feel that way about the wages of their staff but theyd also be an idiot, and the staff certainly should tell any such owner to **** off.

anyone other than a business owner who had an opinion on that business's staff wages is merely demonstrating an inflated sense of self importance- and while every private sector taxpayer might consider themselves a form of owner here, in effect they are more like a customer, with exactly the same recourse and place at the table in pay talks- none whatsoever

so, again- we're all taxpayers, no we aren't any different, all private sector staff are looking for payrises in this inflation, and if a one percent pay review in a 6% inflation economy makes you mad mad mad you maybe haven't as much to contribute to this conversation as you think

Kermit.de.frog

I didn't say I was mad. Good luck with the pay claims. I'm simply stating the fact that public servants are not net contributors to the exchequer.

They are paid from the exchequer.

The tax they return is not a net contribution.

Shouting "we pay tax!" as some sort of response to private sector providing the exchequer with the money for the wages is a disingenuous and dishonest argument.

That's all. I'm not casting judgements on services or work provided or other societal benefits.

That's a separate issue.