The Ivy loses court case

gmisk

And rightly so...absolute scumbags.

I went once before stories about how they treat staff came out....shocking food.

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/news/ivy-restaurant-ordered-to-pay-almost-10000-in-compensation-to-two-former-waitresses-41365811.html

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058234137/the-ivy-loses-court-case

It was said that the Ivy on Dawson Street had all its food shipped over from London via Holyhead in the early days.

Maybe they still do that.

I can't afford to eat there, and nor can their staff.

Potential-Monke

There is genuinely nothing more scummy than management taking the tips of the staff. Even a percentage, it shouldn't be allowed. One place I know of keeps them for a work party at the end of the year. Imagine that, your tips paying for the work night out! Another place I worked wanted to give some share of the tips to the kitchen staff. It was quickly shot down when I asked how much the kitchen staff get paid per hour. The tips are given to the wait staff for giving a service that went above your typical service. The wait staff earned it, no one else. I've had customers specifically tip the chef if they thought the food was good, but tips are for the wait staff otherwise.

Bold Abdu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118671070#Comment_118671070

I can't see a problem with the kitchen staff sharing the tips.

How much do the kitchen staff get - on average less than €15PH. Waiting staff receive €10+PH. Give all the tips to the waiting staff and the chef is left in the comparative poor house.

Potential-Monke

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118671074#Comment_118671074

€15/hr is a guaranteed €585 per week (39 hours). €10.20/hr is €398. Most waiters in most restaurants are lucky to get €20 a night once shared. So on average about €100 extra a week. Some weeks, they may make more. The most I made in one week was €185, but I had 3 massive tables to myself and they left €50 each one night, only made €35 over the other 4 nights. Some weeks, I made less than €20 in tips. I know which I'd prefer overall.

Part of the allure of waiting is the tips, take that away and you just have a min wage job that's not worth it. But we definitely don't want the US way where tipping is mandatory.

Bold Abdu

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118671079#Comment_118671079

Let's take your figures.

€585 for the skilled chef v €533 (I've grossed up the €100 tax free tips) for the relatively unskilled waiting staff. I've worked as a KP and waited for a short while. Waiting was by far the easiest.

Potential-Monke

We're not on about how easy a job is. We're on about how much they get paid. Chefs get paid more, because they're skilled in their profession. Waiting staff don't need a qualification (but it helps, and god knows a lot should be sent on courses) so they get min wage, with the tips as a bonus. The bonus to the chefs is being paid more. I don't see the issue...

Peregrinus

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118671088#Comment_118671088

Wait, wait. A skilled chef is paid at what you tell us is the average rate for kitchen staff generally? That doesn't seem right.

Dempo1

All throughout the Pandemic, a narrative was actively pushed by the Restaurants Association of Ireland essentially claiming how simply wonderful their members are, how well they treated their staff, amazing career opportunities etc whilst at the same time blaming everything bar themselves as to why so many people left the sector in droves, unlikely ever to return. Adrian Cummins (CEO) favorite excuse was the PUP, even at a time it was neither available or when official data showed most on it in Hospitality sector were infact from the accommodation sector (Hotels) , not food service.

I had a near 30 successful career in the sector but became more and more dissolusioned by the working conditions, pay and actually, the loss of understanding on the concept of the meaning of the word hospitality.

To be fair, those reputable establishments who treated their staff well, never, ever had a difficulty with staff retention.

Few hospitality businesses opted for the wage subsidy schemes, those that did were primarily Hotels, most preferred to drop their staff like bad habits, staff were essentially left to fend for themselves, these employers then foolishly assumed, the staff would return in their droves, full of the joys of spring, they we're absolutely mistaken and its not at all surprising. The potential earnings potential quoted by Adrian Cummins were utterly ludicrous and fanciful.

Now, like the celtic tiger era, the sector is pushing big time for work permits, of course they've not factored in one major obstacle to that not so cunning plan, we're do they expect all these NON EU citizens to actually live 🤔 or indeed afford the outrageous rental prices in Ireland.

I'm afraid this story is just the tip of the ICEBERG, the staff were very brave to persue the action. The sector has in truth, been treating staff appallingly for year's and they've just got a serious rude awakening on how staff should be treated coupled with offering fair wages.

On the specific question on tips, it's been a serious bone of contention for years in the Industry. It is True, Skilled Kitchen staff (Chefs) generally did not share tips nor did General Management, primarily because wages were higher and bonus schemes in place, unskilled kitchen staff whilst supposed to be in the pool for tips, rarely got them, generally I found management of Tip payouts lacked any transparency, particularly in larger establishments and sadly, more times than often, Tips were non existant and kept by owners.

It will take years to recover from the pandemic fall out, not I might add from the virus aspect, but what it exposed as quite appalling practices within the sector, in relation to how staff had been treated and not just in recent years.

I'm out of the sector 8 years and will never, ever return to it.